Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 3 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

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What about the Josh Dunkley bobble-head I got for my son?

Will someone please think of the children!
 
lachy said:
Sorry if this comes across an singling you out Dog 36, not meant to be as your posts reflect a commonality on this board.

Again though you are stating our current assistants are not strong enough to challenge Bev. Have you spoken to any of them to know this is a fact or is it supposition? Also, what sort of challenge do you want and what should the reaction be if Bev does not follow their suggestions? Have you ever been a senior assistant coach and worked as a part of a senior coaching group?

I also gather instead of IQ you mean IP and a forward structure functioning properly is dependant on all areas of the ground as well as structures for stoppages, fast plays and slow plays not simply getting a gun forwards coach
Click to expand...

No need for apologies all healthy discussion and you have every right to challenge and make me think about my posts.

In answer to your questions - No I haven't spoken to any of the assistant coaches and I don't know for a fact that they don't challenge Bev but I know they should have their own ideas and be prepared to present them coherently and be challenged on them.
- If they make suggestions and Bev doesn't follow, that is an issue that Chris Grant has to deal with and see why Bev is not taking on board what has been said.
- Never been a senior coach or any type of coach and have never worked with a senior coaching group other than a player. Played the game at school level and suburban level. I have been attending games for over 30 years. My only contact to AFL circles is a list manager at an opposition club.

Point taken that forward line is dependent on many things.

So what is my response based on? Gut feel and eye test and the little I ask the List Manager at another club.



Our Assistant coaches have been unchanged since 2015 lets say? If I was challenging the senior coach and he was not considering, thinking about my suggestions time after time, not sure I would be hanging around for too long (Montgomery maybe). How do you challenge a coach well that is dependent on what skill set you have brought in and what IP you have come with. if your skill set and IP is not up to scratch then a football department has a responsibility to react accordingly that may mean your services are terminated. I would like to think a forward coach would know things that a coach like Bev may not know eg. How does a key forward position his body in a contested pack one to get the ball or two to dictate where it will go etc etc.

Can you identify what our forward line stands for? What I mean can you go to a game and know this is how our forward line will function today and this is what it will do, this is who will play there and this is what they will bring? We have had Tom Boyd , Jack Redpath, Potentially and AA CHB played in our forward line in Naughton, Schache, Bruce amongst other all since 2015 as KPF but it seems there is no clear path how these guys should function in our forward line.

So much of what I say is not based on any experience but the eye test.
 
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Astro_ said:
What about the Josh Dunkley bobble-head I got for my son?

Will someone please think of the children!
Click to expand...

It's ok, we still have our CD bobble heads.
 
Doggies_13 said:
I think the issue is that those high picks wouldn’t be high picks after matching the JUH bid.

For example say we get picks 6 and 7, JUH gets bid on at pick 1 we lose pick 6 and pick 7 becomes pick 18
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I think all of the ways around this (there are many) have been gone over plenty of times in this thread already so I won't lay them all out.

But I would be pushing for Essendons future first (likely a top 5) and enough points to ensure we can cover JUH (would probably be a second and third rounder added on to what we currently have).
Then I would trade our first this year for Collingwood's first next year and take 3 picks into a very strong 2021 draft.
That could set us up for a decade - look at Port with Rozee/Butters/Duursma in 2018.
 
Sam Edmund reporting the Essendon offer is 650-700k over 4-5 years and a promise to pick up Kyle.

Dogs aren’t interested and will block any offer and are confident that Dunkley will not be a disruption to the playing group if forced to stay due to his character and will prepare for 2021 as normal.
 
Astro_ said:
What about the Josh Dunkley bobble-head I got for my son?

Will someone please think of the children!
Click to expand...

And the user names!
 
TBOW said:
I think all of the ways around this (there are many) have been gone over plenty of times in this thread already so I won't lay them all out.

But I would be pushing for Essendons future first (likely a top 5) and enough points to ensure we can cover JUH (would probably be a second and third rounder added on to what we currently have).
Then I would trade our first this year for Collingwood's first next year and take 3 picks into a very strong 2021 draft.
That could set us up for a decade - look at Port with Rozee/Butters/Duursma in 2018.
Click to expand...

I would push for one of two things, a future first and a player from Carlton. Basically
Essendon lose saad and future first and gain Dunkley
carlton gain saad lose player x
Dogs lose Dunkley gain player x and future first

Or go for a superior player from Carlton where Essendon give carlton saad and pick 6 and we get a top line player.

but based on the Edmund article it sounds like the dogs won’t be budging and he’s going no where
 
Doggies_13 said:
Sam Edmund reporting the Essendon offer is 650-700k over 4-5 years and a promise to pick up Kyle.

Dogs aren’t interested and will block any offer and are confident that Dunkley will not be a disruption to the playing group if forced to stay due to his character and will prepare for 2021 as normal.
Click to expand...
Why would he leave for $650k if he is on $550k? That would be bewildering.

Essendope will just delist Kyle after a year anyway
 
dergert said:
Joel Corey to return to the club as a line/ VFL coach after a few adjustments.
Click to expand...
confirmed?
 

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Mattdougie said:
But did nothing about the abuse and mocking I copped from the same pellet that do it constantly

I was warned which I take on board but you are not even close to being fair when I’m involved.

THEY ruined the thread and you blamed me.
Click to expand...
We all saw what happened and you were vindicated.

But give it a rest now before you start something off your own bat
 
Doggies_13 said:
Sam Edmund reporting the Essendon offer is 650-700k over 4-5 years and a promise to pick up Kyle.

Dogs aren’t interested and will block any offer and are confident that Dunkley will not be a disruption to the playing group if forced to stay due to his character and will prepare for 2021 as normal.
Click to expand...
So if Dunks chooses to stay, would Kyle still get picked up by the Bombers? If he wouldn’t, then that is an extremely grubby move. You either want him or your list and believe he could help you, or you don’t.
 
Golden_6 said:
So if Dunks chooses to stay, would Kyle still get picked up by the Bombers? If he wouldn’t, then that is an extremely grubby move. You either want him or your list and believe he could help you, or you don’t.
Click to expand...

Appears to be a conditional offer you come to us and we will pay you this and pick up your brother. If he doesn’t go doubt they’d draft Kyle.

I hope we don’t draft Kyle just to appease dunks as he’s the last type of player we need on our list
 
redmania said:
If we can use Dunkley to get Nathan broad and Charlie Constable I'd be happy. Add to that Jammara, Hannan and a chop out ruck and we will have a better list and better balance.
Click to expand...
6E5A0163-EA1E-42ED-9B94-51DDBC6C2C12.jpeg
 
Would I be wrong in thinking the quoted figure in that article is about at least about what Dunks would be likely to get on his next contract with us anyway?

If he stays and assuming there's no bad blood I can see us coming to the table and offering him another contract early in the year if that's all it's going to take.
 
parlot said:
Would I be wrong in thinking the quoted figure in that article is about at least about what Dunks would be likely to get on his next contract with us anyway?

If he stays and assuming there's no bad blood I can see us coming to the table and offering him another contract early in the year if that's all it's going to take.
Click to expand...

Would think he’d be getting 600-650k next contract minimum depending on salary cap reduction.

Said in the article that he is not disgruntled with the club And has not made a trade request
 
Dog 36 said:
No need for apologies all healthy discussion and you have every right to challenge and make me think about my posts.

In answer to your questions - No I haven't spoken to any of the assistant coaches and know for a fact that they don't challenge Bev.
- If they make suggestions and Bev doesn't follow that is an issue that Chris Grant has to deal with and see why Bev is not taking on board what has been said
- Never been a senior coach or any type of coach and have never worked with a senior coaching group other than a player. Played the game at school level and suburban level. I have been attending games for over 30 years. My only contact to AFL circles is a list manager at an opposition club.

Point taken that forward line is dependent on many things.

So what is my response based on? Gut feel and eye test and the little I ask the List Manager at another club.

Our Assistant coaches have been unchanged since 2015 lets say? If I was challenging the senior coach and he was not following my suggestions time after time, not sure I would be hanging around for too long (Montgomery maybe). How do you challenge a coach well that is dependent on what skill set you have brought in and what IP you have come with. if your skill set and IP is not up to scratch then a football department has a responsibility to react accordingly that may mean your services are terminated. I would like to think a forward coach would know things that a coach like Bev may not know eg. How does a key forward position his body in a contested pack one to get the ball or two to dictate where it will go etc etc.

Can you identify what our forward line stands for? What I mean can you go to a game and know this is how our forward line will function today and this is what it will do, this is who will play there and this is what they will bring? We have had Tom Boyd , Jack Redpath, Potentially and AA CHB played in our forward line in Naughton, Schache, Bruce amongst other all since 2015 as KPF but it seems there is no clear path how these guys should function in our forward line.

So much of what I say is not based on any experience but the eye test.
Click to expand...
Thank you for the detailed reply.

I will start with the obvious, our forward performance needs significant improvement in all facets, from movement, to personnel, to entries, to pressure on exit etc.

I am not sure whether I am correct but 2 issues seem to stem from firstly pushing a forward to contests leaving the opposition with a plus one, however in saying that Richmond do the same, the different is their press is set deeper allowing more space in front of the space whereas we set a very high press which if it comes off is works well but only needs a turnover or contest created by either a poor disposal or decision going forward to not only wreck the functioning of the forward line but expose us badly on transition. There is a tweak needed to address this and the coaching panel have a pre season to work on that.

Having spoken to and been in both seminars are coaching courses with assistants not only form the dogs but other clubs, there does not appear to be an issue with input from the assistants at the dogs being accepted or implemented. Monty was an issue moreso as he missed out on the senior role, which really is fair enough. Of course not all assistants may feel they have the input they desire. I always find some of the negativity towards assistants interesting, using Ash Hansen for example. He is one of the very few assistants invited to complete Level 4 coaching which in itself is building on his IP whilst he is in the position, yet people on here seem to think he is some kind of old diliton who has been in the club too long.
 
Dogs have had talks with Brandan Parfitt but he's comfortable taking reduce pay to stay at Geelong
 
Think the AFLPA would be concern that a club is dangling a lifetime to a player if his bro can get traded there
 
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