Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 7 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[Martyn_30_]

Not getting O’Hallaron is a big win, I implore anyone who wanted him to watch him closely at the Giants next season.

Smith going for essentially Geelongs first pick was always going’s to happen, I think both the bulldogs and Geelong did the right thing in the circumstances.

There’s next to no chance the war chest is going to be used on a big name player, but it gives the club a chance outbid anyone next year for those second tier type trade options.


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[FROGGR]

If we play Geelong in the second half of the year, I'd like to formally welcome our mid-season draftee Clay Smith

Is it wrong that I wish him every luck in a 'Nathan Brown' sense?

 

[Libbaaaa]

More than happy with where the club ended up after tonight. Pick 17 being what it was had nothing to do with Sam Power

Sam Power

Age

42

Ht

190cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.7

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

6.9

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

No current season stats available

D

7.8

2star

K

3.8

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.6

4star

, but more with our patchy form and the Cats 7-0 start. They finish 8th or 9th and we get a pick 5-6 spots higher, simple as that.

Anybody upgrading to #6 and #11 or they going to draftees?

 

[wian]

I’m glad I no longer need to follow him or his shit drink, but Smith no longer follows the Bulldogs on insta & is following Geelong.

I’ll be surprised if he even posts any sort of thank you for everything the club has done for him.

He won't because he's a self absorbed knob

Good riddance

 

[dogwatch]

At what point does the club just cut any and all remaining ties to Connors and his group?

Surely you would just want to avoid dealing with the slimy p**** at costs?

Avoid drafting his players for a start or get them to change managers.

Face. Nose. Knife.

It's just not possible. Connor Sports has more than AFL 100 players in its stable. Probably a lot more. He'd have a huge slice of the top 20% of ranked players. You want to exclude them all?

 

[Libbaaaa]

Not getting O’Hallaron is a big win, I implore anyone who wanted him to watch him closely at the Giants next season.

Smith going for essentially Geelongs first pick was always going’s to happen, I think both the bulldogs and Geelong did the right thing in the circumstances.

There’s next to no chance the war chest is going to be used on a big name player, but it gives the club a chance outbid anyone next year for those second tier type trade options.


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The fact he is OOC means we can get him for fk all next year if we are still keen.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

The Smith saga tells us that without the AFLPA having to go through protracted negotiations with the AFL, players have now got unlimited free agency. De facto.

No need to complete 8 years of service or go through the charade of "restricted" free agency. Just name your club when your contract expires and leave it all to your manager. It might even work when you are still contracted.

Yep while I guess that they don't get to take 17 to the draft (just like how Hawks could recruit Battle without giving up picks), it really makes you wonder how the Dogs themselves would have been better off it he had been a free agent, as getting a better compensation pick (pick 14).

To the extent that we've benefitted from it - and paid unders with a trade in recent years - it goes back to what, Alex Keath? Who we paid unders for but only slight unders.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

My only criticism of the club was that there was no attempt to get specialist half forwards and try to improve that weakness.

Kennedy will spend time there obviously while rotating through the middle but really he is a midfielder. O’Halloran I’m not convinced is an AFL best 22 level player and wouldn’t classify him as a specialist half forward either.

Obviously there is a decent chance that a couple of the draftees will be those types and I think its a position that first year players can impact but a little disappointed we didn’t appear to target someone for the role.

 

[dogwatch]

Given what we ended up getting for Smith what are people's updated thoughts on whether we should have brought him back to play the last month of the season? Did we really "preserve" any value but not risking a further injury?

He wanted to go. The club wanted him gone. He's now gone.

It was the right call. Why demean ourselves? Why complicate an already messy situation?

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

The Smith saga really does go to show that we need to find out if JUH is in it for the long haul or is he not.

We need to capitalise on max value if he’s not. We still have Naughton, Darcy and Croft to build a forward line around.

Come September 2025 he’s either on a long term contract or traded to another club whilst in contract and we hold the power. Just my view.

This is not a “let’s get rid of JUH post” I’d be very happy if he’s a long term player. But we need to extract max value going forward.

I have heard he will be traded to Tassie Devils as a marquee player.

 

[BEaston]

They played 35 games between them and honestly should have had more if we weren't favouring the youth/speed throughout a lot of the year.

That's 35 games we need to replace with guys who weren't up to it this year. It's 100% a worse list.

It's only a worse list if you ignore the impact any draftees will have, next year and in future years.

Smith is no loss from this year.
Kennedy is an upgrade on Macrae.
I don't see it being that hard that one of Sanders, Garcia, Pick 17, Pick 25, Gallagher goes past whatever Daniel would have given us next year.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I'm excited about the fact that we can draft three reasonably good talents that we can sustainably develop and look to strengthen the medium and long term.

A lot of our weaknesses in the worse 2022-23 period was just the lack of options we had to fill out the playing 22 other than players recruited for "free" on the list (rookies, DFA's, late draft pick, mature aged draft picks etc.) rather than the 2nd round ish talent players that we had spent some time developing in previous years.

The only player we have on our list drafted earlier than 2022 by us and between picks 20 and 37 was Rhylee West

14

Rhylee West

Age

24

Ht

183cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.3

3star

K

5.7

2star

HB

6.7

4star

M

2.5

3star

T

1.5

3star

G

0.5

3star

D

12.0

3star

K

6.0

2star

HB

6.0

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

2.0

3star

G

0.3

3star

D

13.0

4star

K

5.6

3star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.2

3star

T

1.4

4star

G

0.6

3star

, who we sort of had to draft because we got the points-based matching discount and upgrade.

We have since drafted Clarke (pick 24) but there's still a large amount of players in a range where there's still significant draftable talent that we don't have on our list.

Compare to Sydney who have recruited 9 players to our 2 on their list in that same 20-37 range, many who made their GF team.

 

[doggiesin08]

I’m going to be really conservative here to prove a point.

Sanders plays 5 more games than last year.
Garcia plays 5 more than last year.
Kennedy probably offers us at minimum 15 games.
Harmes a couple more.
2 top 25-30 selections another 10.

Hardly panic stations.

Freijah didn't play before round 10 and was rested for a few games so there's an extra 10 games or so there even if he doesn't improve at all.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

It's only a worse list if you ignore the impact any draftees will have, next year and in future years.

Smith is no loss from this year.
Kennedy is an upgrade on Macrae.
I don't see it being that hard that one of Sanders, Garcia, Pick 17, Pick 25, Gallagher goes past whatever Daniel would have given us next year.

I suppose we can say we had the opportunity to improve on the position that Vandermeer played - while selecting him was a necessary evil in terms of the fact the overall structure needed at least one player who could sprint as much as he could, he was still a weak player - and we didn't pull the trigger on the XOH trade.

As it stands our theoretical best 22 next year still needs Vandermeer's selection in so we have enough blokes doing repeat sprints, and it's still a weakness in team.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Freijah didn't play before round 10 and was rested for a few games so there's an extra 10 games or so there even if he doesn't improve at all.

Plus we can't rule out the fact that Freijah himself is a genuine contender to truly breakout and be a top 5-10 player in our team. Without wanting to put pressure on the kid, if nobody knew the fact that he was a pick 45 in the draft and was treated like a top 10 pick, people would be already making that assumption about his rapid improvement continuing.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Imagine if we get another Bont at #17, it can happen when you think of where Butters, Fyfe and others have gone. Come on Milesi, time to do your thing.

 

[doggiesin08]

The Smith saga tells us that without the AFLPA having to go through protracted negotiations with the AFL, players have now got unlimited free agency. De facto.

No need to complete 8 years of service or go through the charade of "restricted" free agency. Just name your club when your contract expires and leave it all to your manager. It might even work when you are still contracted.

It also impedes keeping clubs honest on father-son bids. Sure Brisbane will match, by why would you both bidding on Ashcroft in the top 3-4 picks when if in the 1% probability you actually get him you end up losing him for cents on the dollar at the end of his first 3-year deal.

 

[c0de_crow]

I can't see anything in the wash up of the trade period, but are we paying any of Macrae's contract or the Saints are completely taking it on?

 

[lachy]

They played 35 games between them and honestly should have had more if we weren't favouring the youth/speed throughout a lot of the year.

That's 35 games we need to replace with guys who weren't up to it this year. It's 100% a worse list.

Combined they were subs in 11 of those games so they started 24 of 48 games

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[Doggy Dan]

Back left pocket surely

The unknown in all this is what we do with the extra $ in salary cap as Macrae, Smith and Daniel off our books must give us sone $ to spend

Yes we were not under salary cap pressure which now means we should really be in a strong position to retain and the like

Ps not sure if or what we are paying for Jack and Caleb

And all managers of our players know this and will whittle it away without us bringing in any quality new talent. Sam Power is a complete dunce!

 

[Mojorisin]

I can't see anything in the wash up of the trade period, but are we paying any of Macrae's contract or the Saints are completely taking it on?

All of macrae's and Daniel's contracts are now off the books.

 

[Proffessor]

There is no way to spin it. After talking a big game about holding strong, we folded like a cheap deck chair.

Not only did we give up substantially more than we got in return, but our trade credibility has also been severely eroded, so we are likely to get worse deals in future trades.

Whatever credit points Sam Power

Sam Power

Age

42

Ht

190cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.7

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

6.9

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

No current season stats available

D

7.8

2star

K

3.8

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.6

4star

had in the bank before today, they are all gone now.

Not to mention the emotional impact of trading away champions of the club for a pittance.

Anyone talking this up as a win or even a reasonable outcome is kidding themselves.

 

[BLACAE]

Pray tell us, how you would have gone about negotiating a better deal for Bailey smith?

Personally, I would've been talking to other clubs about getting an earlier pick, even if it cost us a F1 and F2. That would've been done independently of this Geelong fiasco. Geelong has 2 options then:
1. The come to the party and pay what he is worth, in which case we would have 2 solid picks in the first round. Or,
2. They call our "bluff."

At that point, I would've let Bailey walk. On draft night I would've given Geelong the option on the night to substantially overpay for our pick (17, F1, and F2), or I would've recruited him again. I would've played him in the VFL every game and asked for more next year. The mere fact we just had 1 plan that we had no power in is pathetic. That is why this club will remain small, because it, like most of the players, has absolutely no mongrel.

Anyone who says this would be unfair, but then piss and moan about the corrupt actions of Geelong need their head read. At least what we should've done would be legal.

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[PocketRocket08]

Out Ryp/AOD, Smith, Daniel, Macrae, Bedendo, Keath
In Kennedy 17 25 35 48 DFA/Rookie/SPP

Keath still on the list.
He or Clarke delisted maybe even both and we take one DFA and one rookie.

 

[Struggle]

Need to put an offer in front of JUH now to use that extra cap room we generated
Minimum 5 year deal, frontload what we have to.
If he's not interested, move him on at the end of next season so we don't get pick 20 again