Training Training Reports and Updates

[Kappa]

Fair enough, I may have worded it differently than I intended. Apologies.

Lets say, some players do appear they act lazy during pre-season, and hence fly under the radar.

It’s fine to say a player who is indigenous looks lazy. The problem would be if someone says indigenous players in general look lazy.

Some people don’t get that and love to play the race card at every opportunity, which actually makes the fight against racism harder.

 

[Kappa]

Don't try to come in with your faux middle of the road perspectives as if you genuinely care about issues such as that Kappa, because every post you've made on such topics has always been contrarian and gatekeeping without ever actually seeming like you give a s**t about addressing issues such as racism. Would LOVE for you to point me to where you have actually discussed "real racism issues" because you've hidden your posting activity so no one can verify if you actually ever have.

I'm saying that words matter - and laziness being used exclusively for the likes of AJ and Hill and for absolutely zero other players raises my eyebrows. Maybe they don't have the best tanks, but there are better phrases to use that don't have a particular weight to them, and that don't create preconceived notions about certain players in the minds of people who take opinions on pre-season training as gospel.

I’ve done probably 100 times more to help disadvantaged communities than you have pal so take your faux social media activism elsewhere.

1 random guy not even on this forum called Hill lazy and now u start ranting paragraphs about how it’s all about race. Get a grip, and focus on real acts of racism. You’re not helping, you’re hurting the issue.

 

[jonbe54]

Yeah, Selwood was still playing footy, kept his feet and looking to dish off. Ginni's technique was more effective at getting frees, but it put him to ground and unable to do anything if the free didn't come - it was an uglier technique for opposition fans.

Selwood used to HEAD BUTT opposition players hands and arms to get frees . . .

Great player and a superb athlete but a sleaze of the highest order.

 

[Jen2310]

It’s fine to say a player who is indigenous looks lazy. The problem would be if someone says indigenous players in general look lazy.

Some people don’t get that and love to play the race card at every opportunity, which actually makes the fight against racism harder.

It’s clearly a player by player basis. Not a general view which would be silly to imply given we don’t see every indigineous player in person.
Can Johnson improve? Of course. I just would love to see a bit more urgency from him at training.
Hill I never got the lazy vibe as I’ve seen him work. He has some explosive pace. His fitness prob not at top speed given he’s coming from a little behind. But this stuff can be worked on. Like all fans we want to see players training to be the best players they can possibly be.


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[Fat Jesus]

Selwood used to HEAD BUTT opposition players hands and arms to get frees . . .

Great player and a superb athlete but a sleaze of the highest order.

Countless games when he got ready for the next quarter wearing a bandage on his head.
Agree

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

It’s clearly a player by player basis. Not a general view which would be silly to imply given we don’t see every indigineous player in person.
Can Johnson improve? Of course. I just would love to see a bit more urgency from him at training.
Hill I never got the lazy vibe as I’ve seen him work. He has some explosive pace. His fitness prob not at top speed given he’s coming from a little behind. But this stuff can be worked on. Like all fans we want to see players training to be the best players they can possibly be.


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Unfortunately the last memory people have of AJ is his prelim - and this memory allows people to conveniently forget the talent he demonstrated in his games beforehand.

AJ does not need to show "urgency" at training if he continues to demonstrate strong ability in actual game time. And before anyone mentions the prelim again, it's okay for a player to have a bad game.

You don't need to be winning 2km time trials in order to kick insane snags from the pocket.

 

[Buckleys_Chance]

I’ve done probably 100 times more to help disadvantaged communities than you have pal so take your faux social media activism elsewhere.

1 random guy not even on this forum called Hill lazy and now u start ranting paragraphs about how it’s all about race. Get a grip, and focus on real acts of racism. You’re not helping, you’re hurting the issue.

Addressing racism doesn’t have to be a life or death issue. It can be as simple as raising concerns to encourage discussion and build awareness. There is an existing racist stereotype that suggests that indigenous Australians are lazy. So I think flagging concerns when a pattern is seen (and this can be subjective- we can all view things differently) is helpful. It’s not saying you are a horrible person, or uncaring or anything like that. It’s just saying we might want to be more mindful in the language we use, so as not to unwittingly further endorse an untrue and hurtful stereotype.


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[JuniorB]

Don't try to come in with your faux middle of the road perspectives as if you genuinely care about issues such as that Kappa, because every post you've made on such topics has always been contrarian and gatekeeping without ever actually seeming like you give a s**t about addressing issues such as racism. Would LOVE for you to point me to where you have actually discussed "real racism issues" because you've hidden your posting activity so no one can verify if you actually ever have.

I'm saying that words matter - and laziness being used exclusively for the likes of AJ and Hill and for absolutely zero other players raises my eyebrows. Maybe they don't have the best tanks, but there are better phrases to use that don't have a particular weight to them, and that don't create preconceived notions about certain players in the minds of people who take opinions on pre-season training as gospel.

Would we say Pendles is lazy because he never seems to show any urgency about what he does onfield?
Yes, words matter.

 

[sr36]

It’s fine to say a player who is indigenous looks lazy. The problem would be if someone says indigenous players in general look lazy.

Some people don’t get that and love to play the race card at every opportunity, which actually makes the fight against racism harder.

It's more complex than you're suggesting. It's a negative stereotype of Aboriginal players. And stereotypes do affect our judgement, whether we are aware of it or not. Thus Aboriginal players are more likely to be viewed as lazy. Not saying that's what occurred here, but it does often occur.

Positive stereotypes also occur. Some used to consider Andy Krakouer fast, despite him running like he was on a treadmill. Incredible skill though. Another stereotype. It took me a while to realise that Richie Cole was a fumbly butcher.

 

[Jen2310]

Back to regular programming tomorrow! I’m just trying to find out if they are having a morning session or… like sometimes after a break they have been known to have a session in the afternoon.

Match sim will ramp up from now on


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[The Phantom]

Are you suggesting that raising concerns about language that supports racial stereotypes is actually racist? So your solution would be to never raise concerns, because doing so is actually racist? Genius reasoning.

Why does everyone freak out whenever someone mentions racism? It’s really not that scary. All we can do is continue to try to do better and that means engaging in the issue and being open to exploring concerns that people might have. Collingwood’s problematic history with racism means we really need to be more vigilant about it. That just means being open to acknowledging the ways that racism can can manifest - often unintentionally. There’s really nothing that scary about it.


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No.
I’m not suggesting that at all.

What I am suggesting is that a random linking of an attribute to a creed, race or colour is an act of casual racism and that’s ironic in this instance.

My background is Italian. And I’ve been called a lot of things over the years.
But the one that I hate most is when people get my name wrong and call me Tony because somewhere they’re wired that Italians are all called Tony.
Casual stereotyping.
It actually shows what is hardwired within.

 

[whiskeytown]

Are you suggesting that raising concerns about language that supports racial stereotypes is actually racist? So your solution would be to never raise concerns, because doing so is actually racist? Genius reasoning.

Why does everyone freak out whenever someone mentions racism? It’s really not that scary. All we can do is continue to try to do better and that means engaging in the issue and being open to exploring concerns that people might have. Collingwood’s problematic history with racism means we really need to be more vigilant about it. That just means being open to acknowledging the ways that racism can can manifest - often unintentionally. There’s really nothing that scary about it.


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Yeah nah… calling Johnson or Hill lazy at times is the same as calling Sier lazy or a fat returning from preseason (circa 2020) De Goey lazy, etc, etc

You’re the one crusading about language… and in the process derailing a preseason thread

 

[Buckleys_Chance]

No.
I’m not suggesting that at all.

What I am suggesting is that a random linking of an attribute to a creed, race or colour is an act of casual racism and that’s ironic in this instance.

My background is Italian. And I’ve been called a lot of things over the years.
But the one that I hate most is when people get my name wrong and call me Tony because somewhere they’re wired that Italians are all called Tony.
Casual stereotyping.
It actually shows what is hardwired within.

There is plenty of empirical researcher that supports what you are saying. We are wired from birth to preference our in group and be cautious of out-group members. It makes evolutionary sense. I think that’s a liberating realisation because it means that we all have implicit biases and that being called racist is probably accurate in most instances, but what is important is that we acknowledge that bias, and do our best to be more open, inclusive and caring. I think that Pragmatism Schrill bringing up his concerns demonstrates an authentic attempt to do that.

I’ve already addressed in another post that using the word lazy to describe indigenous players in problematic, so will leave it there. It costs us nothing to be more thoughtful is our use of language especially when it might be really hurtful to someone else.


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[Pragmatic Shill]

Yeah nah… calling Johnson or Hill lazy at times is the same as calling Sier lazy or a fat returning from preseason (circa 2020) De Goey lazy, etc, etc

You’re the one crusading about language… and in the process derailing a preseason thread

Edit: replied to wrong poster!

It's not the same. It's common knowledge that Sier and De Goey returned to pre-seasons past in demonstrably poor physical shape because they spent their off-seasons getting on the tins or getting on the darts. And there wasn't any disputing of those extra-curricular activities occurring. THAT is lazy.

There is zero evidence AJ or Hill have done that, and just because they have a lackadaisical nature about them doesn't make them lazy.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

It's not the same. It's common knowledge that Sier and De Goey returned to pre-seasons past in demonstrably poor physical shape because they spent their off-seasons getting on the tins or getting on the darts. And there wasn't any disputing of those extra-curricular activities occurring. THAT is lazy.

There is zero evidence AJ or Hill have done that, and just because they have a lackadaisical nature about them doesn't make them lazy.

I wouldn’t say zero evidence when it comes to AJ. That time trial was pretty damning for a professional athlete IMO.

 

[whiskeytown]

It's not the same. It's common knowledge that Sier and De Goey returned to pre-seasons past in demonstrably poor physical shape because they spent their off-seasons getting on the tins or getting on the darts. And there wasn't any disputing of those extra-curricular activities occurring. THAT is lazy.

There is zero evidence AJ or Hill have done that, and just because they have a lackadaisical nature about them doesn't make them lazy.

I’m not saying they are… but I’m saying people should be able to call any player lazy… whether that’s accurately or not… without it becoming a race thing

The neurotic wokes can live by their own Orwellian speech protocols… but don’t force it upon others

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

I’m not saying they are… but I’m saying people should be able to call any player lazy… whether that’s accurately or not… without it becoming a race thing

The neurotic wokes can live by their own Orwellian speech protocols… but don’t force it upon others

What does woke even mean? Lmao
It's asking people to be recognisant of negative stereotypes, no one is forcing anything upon anyone.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

I wouldn’t say zero evidence when it comes to AJ. That time trial was pretty damning for a professional athlete IMO.

He ran a poor time trial. He then spent a lot of the pre-Christmas period doing running sessions in his own time. Hardly what I'd call lazy.

 

[whiskeytown]

What does woke even mean? Lmao
It's asking people to be recognisant of negative stereotypes, no one is forcing anything upon anyone.

Well then don’t pull people up for calling a player lazy… indigenous or not… race needn’t come into it

Pretty simple really…

 

[The Royal Sampler]

He ran a poor time trial. He then spent a lot of the pre-Christmas period doing running sessions in his own time. Hardly what I'd call lazy.

Frame it how you want, he’s either tending towards laziness or lacking initiative to get fit enough in the first place.

It’s not terminal, but something he would definitely want to learn from if he wants a long career in the AFL.

 

[Jen2310]

Any reports on how Scott Pendlebury's pre season is going? I'm assuming he's going well.

How did Sidey go in the time trial? He used to win them most years.

A couple of the veteran players didn’t participate. Sidey didn’t unfortunately as prob would have gave Nick a run for his money


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[pablo disco bar]

Yeah nah… calling Johnson or Hill lazy at times is the same as calling Sier lazy or a fat returning from preseason (circa 2020) De Goey lazy, etc, etc

You’re the one crusading about language… and in the process derailing a preseason thread

I hope the first homosexual to come out in the afl is indigenous..


It's 2023 I couldn't care what colour/race or sexuality ppl are !!!

Amazed at pples comments

Jen2310 clearly did not mean to make a racist remark (in some peoples odd views)

It was just a comment on a players input from her source and frequent track watching


Play on

 

[TradeDraft]

I reckon sometimes, with indigineous players, in pre-season they can appear lazy, but during the game and during the season is a different story. Some players are just better players than trainers. Draper was probably known for that type of player in hisn U18 year. But he has improved in that area. Its definitely a workable trait.

True - Johnson has not set the Training on Fire

 

[TradeDraft]

Jen you seem like a great person and obviously bleed black and white but this post kind of highlights Pragmatic Shrill’s concern. Saying that indigenous players do appear lazy in preseason is racist (in the last paragraph). I’m sure their is nothing malicious intended but it might be an opportunity to reflect on the language being used and how that can contribute to unhelpful racially based stereotypes.


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Then should Lazy be a Racist Word for Everyone then?

 

[TradeDraft]

Back to regular programming tomorrow! I’m just trying to find out if they are having a morning session or… like sometimes after a break they have been known to have a session in the afternoon.

Match sim will ramp up from now on


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When will the Intra-Club happen Jen2310 ?