Training Training Reports and Updates

[dardy33]

I see the term lazy ( justified or not) being used to describe a given player without reference at all to race.
I see someone picking that up and assuming it’s a race based comment.
Hmmmh.
Where might the casual discrimination actually be?

Jen’s comments were in no way racist. I don’t know many Aboriginal people who associate the word lazy with racism

I am aboriginal and have never thought calling someone was lazy was racist. It's simply stating your opinion/ observations

 

[Jafo]

Apparently Ablett Snr was very lazy when it came to training. Preseason or during season training.

 

[Fat Jesus]

Apparently Ablett Snr was very lazy when it came to training. Preseason or during season training.

Opposite to Jnr training.

 

[Matrix10]

My memory isn't great. If Wood had played the 2011 GF (Jolly cooked) and another defender instead of the injured Reid we could have been premiers.

WHERE WAS MALTHOUSES HEAD AT.

Mick’s head was dwelling in Bitter Town

 

[Matrix10]

I am aboriginal and have never thought calling someone was lazy was racist. It's simply stating your opinion/ observations

Amen. I was called a wog many a time , never took offence , take it as badge of honour, as when one seeks to categorise , they themselves have been branded

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Amen. I was called a wog many a time , never took offence , take it as badge of honour, as when one seeks to categorise , they themselves have been branded

Interesting comment as it has no bearing on what you quoted!

 

[jonbe54]

I thought Danielle Laidley was the first.
Unless wearing a dress doesn't make you homosexual.
It's all to confusing.

I couldn't care less either mate. Whatever floats your boat.
Love is what matters.

They don't call 'alternative' sexuality 'rainbow' behaviour for nothing . . . there are almost as many options as there are individuals.

People just love to Pidgeon hole . . .

 

[neilk]

Scott Pendlebury has a tennis background.

But there is a basketball in the background also.

 

[JB1975]

Last 5 pages have buoyed me considerably.

Our pre-season must be tracking nicely if attentions have settled upon belly button fluff.

 

[Buckleys_Chance]

No one labelled anyone here a racist.

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Exactly. I really don’t understand why everyone gets so defensive around this issue. Everyone wants to be completely admonished of any possible fault, or says “I’m not racist, your racist!”, rather than just considering this issue.

I say we’ll done for speaking up when you saw something that concerned you. I think more people need to do that, and it should be encouraged rather than condemned.


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[Pragmatic Shill]

Exactly. I really understand why everyone gets so defensive around this issue. Everyone wants to be completely admonished of any possible fault, or says “I’m not racist, your racist!”, rather than just considering this issue.

I say we’ll done for speaking up when you saw something that concerned you. I think more people need to do that, and it should be encouraged rather than condemned.


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Thank you BC. All I wanted to do was point out that language does matter. Having nonsense labels like "woke" thrown at me isn't helpful.

And frankly, I had gotten pretty sick and tired of the animosity thrown AJ's way this summer based on his performance in the prelim. People hang on to the words of people who attend training a lot, when all it is is just a perception, and perception doesn't always equal reality. AJ going poorly in a time trial won't matter when he's kicking the footy from the pocket in a way that would put the JFK bullet to shame.

 

[Jen2310]

12:45 they are training


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[Mkcaptain]

Thank you BC. All I wanted to do was point out that language does matter. Having nonsense labels like "woke" thrown at me isn't helpful.

And frankly, I had gotten pretty sick and tired of the animosity thrown AJ's way this summer based on his performance in the prelim. People hang on to the words of people who attend training a lot, when all it is is just a perception, and perception doesn't always equal reality. AJ going poorly in a time trial won't matter when he's kicking the footy from the pocket in a way that would put the JFK bullet to shame.

The only way it matters is whether the coaches think he is fit enough to perform his role in the side. That time trial did alarm me, as I believe Ash makes us a better side and I really want him to be a selection lock each week. I don't think its entirely fair for you to frame your point in the context that people hang on the words who attend training a lot, when there is the video to support that Ash struggled bigtime in the 2km.

That whole time trial was weird though. Most players ran times that I'd consider below average for AFL players returning for preseason. However, it was pointed out to me that they were doing it in footy boots on grass. So I also agree that perception doesn't always equal reality.

The key will be whether Johnson has improved since November. If what you say is correct and he was doing the required running over Christmas, that gives me confidence. Stevie J was never fit in November.

As an aside, as a BigFooty board we should be encouraging each other to do better in regards to recognising unconscious biases. Calling out the use of 'lazy' in regards to Hill was what was needed. I applaud you for bringing this conversation on.

 

[Buckleys_Chance]

Jen’s comments were in no way racist. I don’t know many Aboriginal people who associate the word lazy with racism

Saying that a certain race of people exhibit a particular behaviour is stereotyping. Jen acknowledged that, and changed her wording. I think that was a very mature way to respond. Play on.


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[jonbe54]

Saying that a certain race of people exhibit a particular behaviour is stereotyping. Jen acknowledged that, and changed her wording. I think that was a very mature way to respond. Play on.


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I think we should acknowledge history in all of this.

Firstly history is NOT an excuse for less than sensitive and tolerant behaviour or language.

Secondly history drives us - humans are creatures of habit and that is both good and bad.

The key is not to be thoughtless about our lives, if we nourish the habit of being thoughtful we run less risk of being offensive or condescending.

History can't be changed but our actions can change the present and the future.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Saying that a certain race of people exhibit a particular behaviour is stereotyping. Jen acknowledged that, and changed her wording. I think that was a very mature way to respond. Play on.


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But no one said that Aboriginal people are lazy. She was referring to two individuals and did not stereotype in any way. I did not feel any stereotypical labelling in regards to Aboriginal people. I am a fighter for equality in race but there was nothing to discuss here. All it did was bring discomfort to someone who made an innocent comment.

 

[South of the Yarra]

The only way it matters is whether the coaches think he is fit enough to perform his role in the side. That time trial did alarm me, as I believe Ash makes us a better side and I really want him to be a selection lock each week. I don't think its entirely fair for you to frame your point in the context that people hang on the words who attend training a lot, when there is the video to support that Ash struggled bigtime in the 2km.

That whole time trial was weird though. Most players ran times that I'd consider below average for AFL players returning for preseason. However, it was pointed out to me that they were doing it in footy boots on grass. So I also agree that perception doesn't always equal reality.

The key will be whether Johnson has improved since November. If what you say is correct and he was doing the required running over Christmas, that gives me confidence. Stevie J was never fit in November.

As an aside, as a BigFooty board we should be encouraging each other to do better in regards to recognising unconscious biases. Calling out the use of 'lazy' in regards to Hill was what was needed. I applaud you for bringing this conversation on.

We should always be supporting each other to do better in regards to racism and bias but there was no ill intent or labelling in regards to Hill be called lazy. No Aboriginal people on here have taken no offence to it or seen it as an issue. If Aboriginals in general were being referred to as lazy that is different but two individuals who may have an attitude that is not fully committed is not bias in any way

 

[jonbe54]

But no one said that Aboriginal people are lazy. She was referring to two individuals and did not stereotype in any way. I did not feel any stereotypical labelling in regards to Aboriginal people. I am a fighter for equality in race but there was nothing to discuss here. All it did was bring discomfort to someone who made an innocent comment.

I get the distinction you're making soty and agree with it.

Sadly both sides of the argument are stuck in stereotype mode and the media has a lot to do with that.

 

[JuniorB]

I think we should acknowledge history in all of this.

Firstly history is NOT an excuse for less than sensitive and tolerant behaviour or language.

Secondly history drives us - humans are creatures of habit and that is both good and bad.

The key is not to be thoughtless about our lives, if we nourish the habit of being thoughtful we run less risk of being offensive or condescending.

History can't be changed but our actions can change the present and the future.

Agreed.
As a forum, we need to be mindful of the fact that we are all drawn here by our shared love of the Collingwood Football Club.
It's important to choose our language carefully and be aware that we all have subconscious attitudes.
We have differing opinions about all things Collingwood, which is healthy providing we discuss them in a civil manner.
Calling someone stupid or an idiot because they disagree with your opinion is unacceptable.
Discrimination of any kind, be it racism, ageism, sexism or whatever, is also unacceptable.

We all agree on one thing: GO Pies!!!

 

[Jen2310]

Let’s just move on yeah?


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[Mick F]

But no one said that Aboriginal people are lazy. She was referring to two individuals and did not stereotype in any way. I did not feel any stereotypical labelling in regards to Aboriginal people. I am a fighter for equality in race but there was nothing to discuss here. All it did was bring discomfort to someone who made an innocent comment.

FFS, you have dragged this on for three pages. Everyone in the room doesn’t have to feel uncomfortable, that the boss put his hand up the typist’s skirt, for it to be inappropriate.

There have been several posts from our more erudite contributors that you should re-read and think about. Such as: “we might want to be more mindful in the language we use”. If you still don’t give a rat’s, fair enough, but that doesn’t mean other people have a differing level of awareness.

 

[jonbe54]

FFS - everyone in the room doesn’t have to feel uncomfortable, that the boss put his hand up the typist’s skirt, for it to be inappropriate.

There have been several posts from our more erudite contributors that you should re-read and think about. Such as: “we might want to be more mindful in the language we use”. If you still don’t give a rat’s, fair enough, but that doesn’t mean other people have a differing level of awareness.

Fair comment Mick tearing into each other is simply playing into the hands of the sensationalists . . . ermmm media.

 

[South of the Yarra]

FFS - everyone in the room doesn’t have to feel uncomfortable, that the boss put his hand up the typist’s skirt, for it to be inappropriate.

There have been several posts from our more erudite contributors that you should re-read and think about. Such as: “we might want to be more mindful in the language we use”. If you still don’t give a rat’s, fair enough, but that doesn’t mean other people have a differing level of awareness.

I have been on the extreme end of Aboriginal racism more than most in this country. My life torn apart from it. So please don't tell me that I don't give a rats. I spend my life working towards bringing an end the inequality to Aboriginal people. Call out the language that is inappropriate, call it out every time but don't make someone who is making an innocent comment feel uncomfortable for something that was not inappropriate.

 

[jonbe54]

I have been on the extreme end of Aboriginal racism more than most in this country. My life torn apart from it. So please don't tell me that I don't give a rats. I spend my life working towards bringing an end the inequality to Aboriginal people. Call out the language that is inappropriate, call it out every time but don't make someone who is making an innocent comment feel uncomfortable for something that was not inappropriate.

This type of comment - innocent in this case I'm sure - is a strong reason for making Australian history COMPULSORY in every school and by that I mean TRUE Australian history.

Ignorance and propaganda can't stand against a universally upheld truth fearlessly stated.

It's time for the Australian government to stand up and by that I mean it's time for us to stand up.

Find out your local member's stance on these issues and vote accordingly.

There is no grey area here.

 

[Buckleys_Chance]

But no one said that Aboriginal people are lazy. She was referring to two individuals and did not stereotype in any way. I did not feel any stereotypical labelling in regards to Aboriginal people. I am a fighter for equality in race but there was nothing to discuss here. All it did was bring discomfort to someone who made an innocent comment.

Go back and read the post I replied to (not the original one in which she said what her friend said). She said indigenous players appear lazy in the preseason, and later acknowledged the feedback about stereotypes, and changed her wording. Problem solved. No need to be defensive about it. We all mis-speak from time to time. This doesn’t have to be a big issue, if we all acknowledge we can slip up from to time and are willing to reflect and engage in the issue. Happy to leave this discussion here, if you are?


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