We better not make a straight swap Jackson Paine for Patrick Karnezis (Edit: too bad, we did)

[Lefthanded]

Ok you've confused the shit out of me now. Excuse my ignorance.

There was talk in another Pies thread that it might be Paine plus pick 10 for Karnezis and pick 7. Nothing in the media about anything other than straight swap so pick exchange unlikely but we will know within 3 hours....

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

There was talk in another Pies thread that it might be Paine plus pick 10 for Karnezis and pick 7. Nothing in the media about anything other than straight swap so pick exchange unlikely but we will know within 3 hours....

Wow, would be amazing if true.

 

[MarkT2]

Paine will never make it with us.... If he was going to, it would have happened by now.
Fair swap if you ask me.

He's played 2 seasons of VFL as a key forward since being drafted. 90% of key forwards outside of the superstars of the game would be similarly placed at the same stage. Ben Ried and Nathan Brown were VFL players at the start of 2010 having been at the club 1 year longer.

IMO Paine has something. He isn't going to be an AA full forward but he has talent and flair. What he lacks is intensity and a defensive midset so he may well have a limited future at Collingwood where we now seem to value that above actual talent but that's another debate again.

 

[wicksy]

He's played 2 seasons of VFL as a key forward since being drafted. 90% of key forwards outside of the superstars of the game would be similarly placed at the same stage. Ben Ried and Nathan Brown were VFL players at the start of 2010 having been at the club 1 year longer.

IMO Paine has something. He isn't going to be an AA full forward but he has talent and flair. What he lacks is intensity and a defensive midset so he may well have a limited future at Collingwood where we now seem to value that above actual talent but that's another debate again.

Flair? I'd suggest that's something he distinctly lacks.
Look, if there were any chance of him being a good player for us, we wouldn't be offloading him.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

He's played 2 seasons of VFL as a key forward since being drafted. 90% of key forwards outside of the superstars of the game would be similarly placed at the same stage. Ben Ried and Nathan Brown were VFL players at the start of 2010 having been at the club 1 year longer.

IMO Paine has something. He isn't going to be an AA full forward but he has talent and flair. What he lacks is intensity and a defensive midset so he may well have a limited future at Collingwood where we now seem to value that above actual talent but that's another debate again.

Not only that, he was pick 50 that could have slipped furhter down had we not taken him. Not sure what everyone was expecting out of him.

 

[MarkT2]

Paine is a smaller, slower, weaker version of Cloke and always will be.

The SLOWER part is the worst part.

Cloke had 29, that's right, 29 tackles for the season and played all games bar 1!

We can't have another player being defensively useless in the forward line. Cloke gets away with it because he is an animal and generally retained the ball in his hands 75% of the time in the forward line.

This Cloke tackling stat is very over used. He's a player that kills every contest he is in. He either takes the mark or it is punched a distance away by the third man up more often than not so the next contest either doesn't exist or is elsewhere. When he leads up the ground he is either used or by-passed. In static play he is mobbed.

heck tackles, let him be the dangerous target.

As for Paine, I'd like him to be faster and more defensive but IF he takes marks and icks goals Cloke will be the better for it and we WILL win more games.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

 

[Snoop Dog]

I am pretty disappointed about the prospect of losing Paine. I actually find it surprising that people have a dim view of him. He has only been in the system for 2 years and he is a big fella so its going to take time. He certainly over achieved in his first year. Last year he kicked 45 goals in the VFL which for a 20yo is not a bad effort. I know his defensive efforts could improve but he did improve in the games I saw and he has red hot go. I am a fan and we should persist with.

In saying that he is going to struggle for a game with Cloke, White ahead of him and Reid being able to swing through the fwds as well so the kid might want a go somewhere else. I can see him playing a role in the seniors for the Lions next year.

 

[MarkT2]

Flair? I'd suggest that's something he distinctly lacks.
Look, if there were any chance of him being a good player for us, we wouldn't be offloading him.

I've seen him kick some nice goals. He's got something IMO. As for the other point, we are exiting Shaw, Thomas & Didak and they ARE good players. So is Wellingham. We didn't play Didak for the same reason we didn't play Paine. Perhaps Paine isn't ready anyway but the theory was flawed re Didak and still is. Talent still wins flags but everything in balance.

 

[jonbe54]

I am just wondering if Karnesis is good why was he languishing in the reserves all year,when I doubt he was injured and Brisbane were screaming for another forward to help Jonathan Brown?

Yet Karnesis was completely overlooked why? This is where alarm bells ring,whereby Paine is in the reserves because other players were keeping him out of the seniors after a while if you are trying hard enough but never get a shot at top level one does become complaicent.

JEEZUZ how many times has it got to be repeated?? Voss knew he wanted to leave Brissy and return to Melbourne and his family and friends - would you put games into a bloke who's heart wasn't in it??

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

This sums up my feelings

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

This sums up my feelings

Let me guess - You're Kif in this scenario?

 

[Hva sher a]

I am pretty disappointed about the prospect of losing Paine. I actually find it surprising that people have a dim view of him. He has only been in the system for 2 years and he is a big fella so its going to take time. He certainly over achieved in his first year. Last year he kicked 45 goals in the VFL which for a 20yo is not a bad effort. I know his defensive efforts could improve but he did improve in the games I saw and he has red hot go. I am a fan and we should persist with.

In saying that he is going to struggle for a game with Cloke, White ahead of him and Reid being able to swing through the fwds as well so the kid might want a go somewhere else. I can see him playing a role in the seniors for the Lions next year.

I'm disappointed we couldn't get more out of him. Clearly Bucks doesn't rate him. And White/Lynch are there to play the 2nd/3rd tall role so there isn't space for Paine.
Neither Karnezis nor Paine had great defensive capabilities so it's nil-all on that one.

In the ideal world we would've waited for Paine to develop but realistically, Karnezis fits a more important need that what Paine would've.

Of course if Cloke goes down the doomsdayers will scream about how we let Paine go but its very difficult to fully plan around that.

Good luck to both boys

 

[mattys123]

Already posed for a shot, something tells me he wanted this move;

 

[Chilli Con Incarnate]

I'm disappointed we couldn't get more out of him. Clearly Bucks doesn't rate him. And White/Lynch are there to play the 2nd/3rd tall role so there isn't space for Paine.
Neither Karnezis nor Paine had great defensive capabilities so it's nil-all on that one.

In the ideal world we would've waited for Paine to develop but realistically, Karnezis fits a more important need that what Paine would've.

Of course if Cloke goes down the doomsdayers will scream about how we let Paine go but its very difficult to fully plan around that.

Good luck to both boys

If Cloke goes down we go down, no amount of Paine would help ease that .... pain.

 

[RuFiO]

Already posed for a shot, something tells me he wanted this move;

Looks happy as hell.

 

[Snoop Dog]

I'm disappointed we couldn't get more out of him. Clearly Bucks doesn't rate him. And White/Lynch are there to play the 2nd/3rd tall role so there isn't space for Paine.
Neither Karnezis nor Paine had great defensive capabilities so it's nil-all on that one.

In the ideal world we would've waited for Paine to develop but realistically, Karnezis fits a more important need that what Paine would've.

Of course if Cloke goes down the doomsdayers will scream about how we let Paine go but its very difficult to fully plan around that.

Good luck to both boys

exactly

 

[Jonno94]

Pretty sure Hine has said 1000 times now that we want versatile key position players that can play both ends of the ground, spend time in the ruck and play on the wing. Paine simply doesn't fit this criteria and doesn't have the size to become your stay at home full forward.

 

[jonbe54]

Looks happy as hell.

If I had crazy Vossy in charge of my professional destiny I wouldn't even look that happy

 

[Soul_Pie]

Paine looks like he's been kidnapped and forced to put on that jumper at gunpoint.

 

[MagpieBat]

To be fair to Jacko, would you be happy if you had to wear that stupid cartoon "Paddle Pop lion" jumper?

 

[stevo86]

Pretty sure Hine has said 1000 times now that we want versatile key position players that can play both ends of the ground, spend time in the ruck and play on the wing. Paine simply doesn't fit this criteria and doesn't have the size to become your stay at home full forward.

This is spot on.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Let me guess - You're Kif in this scenario?

Zap all the way mofo

 

[millsy29gopies]

Was afraid this day might come. Thought we survived when the delistings came through but it appears we did not. Paine will be an absolute star for the Lions and I think he will haunt us for years to come. Fortunately, I think Karnezis himself will turn out to be a very good player for us, it is definitely a win-win.

 

[augie]

Was afraid this day might come. Thought we survived when the delistings came through but it appears we did not. Paine will be an absolute star for the Lions and I think he will haunt us for years to come. Fortunately, I think Karnezis himself will turn out to be a very good player for us, it is definitely a win-win.

Am very disappointed with Paine leaving. I don't know much about Karnezis, but had very high hopes for Paine after watching him a lot over the past couple of years. I hope he does really well in Brisbane.