Banter Who will be better in 2024? Carlton or Collingwood? Part 2

[Aphrodite]

Collingwood cheersquad don't even know how to spell.
What hope have you got ?

ISSAC

 

[Fadge]

That is a dictionary using the word in a sentence to help demonstrate its meaning. Note the Dictionary does not say "the team that wins or comes close to winning a preliminary final is a contender"

Read a book once in a while.

Ok, so who were the premiership contenders in 2023?

2022?

 

[Worm4]

Ok, so who were the premiership contenders in 2023?

2022?

Hey fadge it's 2024 brother.

 

[CCurnow3votes]

Interestingly this definition refers to major contenders which would logically be teams in the 8 and allows for the principle of unlikely/minor contenders which would be teams outside of the 8 such as Collingwood.

Still waiting for Fadge to produce a definition from a reputable source that matches his take on the matter

Exactly - the word “Major” is used by the lovely people at Oxford University Press as a way to further qualify a contender or a competitor.

It’s pretty basic stuff.

PS - an apt usage could be;

“This conversation is a major contender for the dumbest of all time”.

(although we know the Whispers Goaty one takes the cake).

 

[Fadge]

Hey fadge it's 2024 brother.

All good.

I understand why it's too difficult a question for the Carlton faithful to answer.

 

[Fadge]

Exactly - the word “Major” is used by the lovely people at Oxford University Press as a way to further qualify a contender or a competitor.

It’s pretty basic stuff.

And therein lies the problem.

Why do we need to differentiate between 'major' and I assume 'minor' contenders?

And where is that point of differentiation? Were North Melbourne only a 'minor contender' at the start of the season, or was there a different classification again for them?

A team either contends, or they don't.

 

[CCurnow3votes]

And therein lies the problem.

Why do we need to differentiate between 'major' and I assume 'minor' contenders?

And where is that point of differentiation? Were North Melbourne only a 'minor contender' at the start of the season, or was there a different classification again for them?

A team either contends, or they don't.

El Fudgo - you have finally arrived in that corner!

North Melbourne contends like every other club - until they cannot contend any more.

 

[Worm4]

All good.

I understand why it's too difficult a question for the Carlton faithful to answer.

Coz it's not relevant to the thread.

 

[JustaBattler]

If someone asks me 'who do you think the 2024 contenders are', I say exactly what I have been saying in my last 20 posts.

If someone asks me 'who do you think the 2024 contenders will be', that is a very different question, and at this stage I'd say 'Sydney appear to be a class above all other teams, so wouldn't be surprised if they sweep the finals comfortably, in the absence of any other genuine contenders. Then any of Fremantle, Brisbane, GWS and/or Collingwood could gain some momentum and make a late charge. I don't predict any of Carlton, Port Adelaide, Essendon or Geelong genuinely contending for the 2024 flag.'

So ( right now) you see the battle for the flag in 2024 as:

Sydney

gap

Fremantle, GWS, Collingwood + Brisbane

the rest.

gap and don't really rate with the above but currentlyin top4 or 8

Carlton, Port Adelaide, Essendon and Geelong

Do you also see Collingwood finishing higher than Carlton?

 

[Fadge]

Do you also see Collingwood finishing higher than Carlton?

I see Collingwood being able to do more damage in finals than Carlton, should they be able to gather some momentum before the end of the season, though it has to happen quickly.

 

[Fadge]

So ( right now) you see the battle for the flag in 2024 as:

Sydney

gap

Fremantle, GWS, Collingwood

the rest.

gap and don't really rate with the above but currentlyin top4 or 8

Carlton, Port Adelaide, Essendon and Geelong

You forgot Brisbane on the same line as Freo, GWS and Collingwood.

 

[JustaBattler]

I see Collingwood being able to do more damage in finals than Carlton, should they be able to gather some momentum before the end if the season, though it has to happen quickly.

right now - do you see Collingwood finishing higher than Carlton ?

 

[Fadge]

right now - do you see Collingwood finishing higher than Carlton ?

Refer to my previous post.

 

[JustaBattler]

Refer to my previous post.

so - you refuse to predict or speculate or provide your 'probability' or use whatever other prosaic device you feel inclined to use - to answer in straight forward terms according to your own logic and premises that you have set out above - and provide an answer to a straight forward question...

you an change your mind of course at any time- but I repeat

right now

do you think Collingwood will finish higher than Carlton in 2024?

Simple question Fudgey and no tricks involved.

 

[Sector 7G]

So you're happy that the literal meaning of 'contender' include North Melbourne and West Coast as 2024 premiership contenders through to the point in time that it's no longer mathematically possible for them to win the premiership?

I'm adhering to the definition of contender, but not applying it until such time as a team contends.

I'm still waiting on any of you to answer my question re: who were the premiership contenders in 2022 and 2023...

I have previously advised every team was a contender until they were not, applying the literal meaning of all of those words. I am happy to use literal meaning for words because that is the correct and only way to clearly convey ideas.

While teams have a chance they are contending. The Odds of Carlton making the GF were remote at round 12 last year and were odds on 25 minutes into the prelim. At all times we were still in Contention

I don't think there is much further to go on this you when you are using your own unique definitions that no one but you has any idea what they are. We have spent enough time trying to lock it down to no avail.

 

[Fadge]

do you think Collingwood will finish higher than Carlton in 2024?

Refer to my post above.

 

[Fadge]

I have previously advised every team was a contender until they were not, applying the literal meaning of all of those words. I am happy to use literal meaning for words because that is the correct and only way to clearly convey ideas.

While teams have a chance they are contending. The Odds of Carlton making the GF were remote at round 12 last year and were odds on 25 minutes into the prelim. At all times we were still in Contention

I don't think there is much further to go on this you when you are using your own unique definitions that no one but you has any idea what they are. We have spent enough time trying to lock it down to no avail.

All good.

I understand why Carlton supporters feel the need to defer to your interpretation of 'contention', because the alternative - 'Did the team legitimately contend for the premiership' - hasn't been great for Carlton for the past two plus decades...

 

[Sector 7G]

All good.

I understand why Carlton supporters feel the need to defer to your interpretation of 'contention', because the alternative - 'Did the team legitimately contend for the premiership' - hasn't been great for Carlton for the past two plus decades...

It is not my definition. I don't have any definitions. It is the definition common to every available Dictionary..

I will leave the personal definitions to your good self.

 

[JustaBattler]

Refer to my post above.

Fudgey - you havent answered the question in your previous post - why are you dodging the question?

Not interested in what you think needs to happen about something to happen.

Pretty simple.

I'll ask again.

RIGHT NOW - today.

Who do you think finishes higher Collingwood or Carlton?

 

[Fadge]

It is not my definition. I don't have any definitions. It is the definition common to every available Dictionary..

I will leave the personal definitions to your good self.

Indeed.

And note the example used was 'the major contenders in a football championship', because the reasonable person doesn't perceive every team in the competition to be a 'contender until such time as they're out of contention'.

The reasonable person identifies a subset of better teams who are likely to contend, and I choose to go a step further and refuse to anoint a team as a contender until such time as they actually contend - otherwise we've got a different group of perceived 'contenders' at different stages of the season.

It is clear why I haven't had one single poster respond to my question about who the contenders were in 2022 and 2023 - because it doesn't suit your line of argument (and no doubt brings back some bad memories for Carlton supporters).

 

[Fadge]

Fudgey - you havent answered the question in your previous post - why are you dodging the question?

Not interested in what you think needs to happen about something to happen.

Pretty simple.

I'll ask again.

RIGHT NOW - today.

Who do you think finishes higher Collingwood or Carlton?

I've answered the question, and refuse to clarify any further until I get some answers to the questions I've been posing.

 

[Arr0w]

Waffle

 

[JustaBattler]

I've answered the question, and refuse to clarify any further until I get some answers to the questions I've been posing.

There is no clarification required.

All you need to do is answer a simple question.

I'll repeat it (again)

Right now knowing all you need to know - who do you think will finish higher in 2024 - Collingwood or Carlton?

To make it even easier for you...


who do you think will finish higher BEFORE finals commence?

 

[Arr0w]

So right at this moment, Fadge has the main flag contenders as Swans, Dockers, GWS, Lions and Pies?

Like pulling teeth from a wooden horse

 

[CCurnow3votes]

So right at this moment, Fadge has the main flag contenders as Swans, Dockers, GWS, Lions and Pies?

Like pulling teeth from a wooden horse

From a horse that has no teeth