Who would you rate as the strongest premiership side in the AFL era?

[Shaneprice97]

Who had the better backline?

Brisbane:
FB: Chris Johnson, Mal Michael, Daryl White
HB: Chris Scott, Justin Leppitsch, Brad Scott

Geelong:
FB: Tom Harley, Matthew Scarlett, Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright, Harry Taylor, Andrew Mackie
+Wojcinski

Hawthorn:
FB: Ben Stratton, Brian Lake, James Frawley
HB: Grant Birchall, Josh Gibson, Shaun Burgoyne

Added Frawley even though he only played in one flag.

Ill even add Richmond since they are discussed quite heavily(by their own supporters that is).

FB: Brandon Ellis, David Astbury, Dylan Grimes
HB: Nick Vlaustin, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli

 

[MacMum]

Can't see why anyone would vote for a team that wasn't "strong" enough to follow up their flag with another and then a third.

Brisbane 01-03 will be the benchmark for decades to come. Proven strength over 3 years.

...and proceeded to get into their 4th GF in a row, but unfortunately they had run out of puff.

4 straight GF's is a mighty mighty effort.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Richmond's midfield has multiple Brownlow Medallist in it easily has St Kilda's covered, Richmond's backline has beaten better forward lines than St Kilda's would have no problem accounting for them, and Jack Riewoldt use to kick bags against St Kilda's no name backline in 09-10 Richmond's forward line would have no problem

hahahahhahaahah
Cotchin getting a brownlow because Jobe had his taken off him means nothing ... the softest brownlow medal ever .. even Woewodins holds more respect then Cotch's brownlow ...
yes Cousin Jack's bag of 1 goal 4 in 2009 against first choice full back Zac Dawson (Before he went full crab) was certainly memorable
he did kick 6 and 7 in 2010 in the games where the Saints were without their first choice full back out injured so yeah but that said the Saints also did have Milne kick 5 goals 5 in that first game and Kosi kicked 5 goals 1 .. but then in your premieship year your backline the as you say "has beaten better forward lines than St Kilda's" did also allow Tim Membry (who wouldnt have got a game in the 2009 Saints forward line) to kick a bag ...

but hey lets just ask the opinion of the neutral supporters who they reckon was the stronger side .. 2017 Richmond vs 2009 St Kilda ... i would say it would be 90% in favour of the 2009 Saints .. the only people who consider Richmonds 2017 team in the conversation as the strongest team in the last 25 years are deluded Richmond supporters ... i know the 2009 Saints are not the strongests but they certainly were stronger than richmond

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Who had the better backline?

Brisbane:
FB: Chris Johnson, Mal Michael, Daryl White
HB: Chris Scott, Justin Leppitsch, Brad Scott

Geelong:
FB: Tom Harley, Matthew Scarlett, Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright, Harry Taylor, Andrew Mackie
+Wojcinski

Hawthorn:
FB: Ben Stratton, Brian Lake, James Frawley
HB: Matt Suckling, Josh Gibson, Shaun Burgoyne

Added Frawley even though he only played in one flag.

Ill even add Richmond since they are discussed quite heavily(by their own supporters that is).

FB: Brandon Ellis, David Astbury, Dylan Grimes
HB: Nick Vlaustin, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli

including that richmond line up is comedy gold ...

FB: Tom Harley (AA captain), Matthew Scarlett(6x AA , Hall of Famer), Darren Milburn (AA)
HB: Corey Enright (6x AA), Harry Taylor(2x AA), Andrew Mackie (AA)

you cannot go past that ... Brisbanes backline were harder more agressive and made forwards worry more, Hawthorn's is more attacking and damaging on the rebound but the Geelong back line wins it for me ...

Richmonds i dont think is even the best in the comp today let alone all time best

 

[Ok Boomer]

Who had the better backline?

Brisbane:
FB: Chris Johnson, Mal Michael, Daryl White
HB: Chris Scott, Justin Leppitsch, Brad Scott

Geelong:
FB: Tom Harley, Matthew Scarlett, Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright, Harry Taylor, Andrew Mackie
+Wojcinski

Hawthorn:
FB: Ben Stratton, Brian Lake, James Frawley
HB: Matt Suckling, Josh Gibson, Shaun Burgoyne

Added Frawley even though he only played in one flag.

Ill even add Richmond since they are discussed quite heavily(by their own supporters that is).

FB: Brandon Ellis, David Astbury, Dylan Grimes
HB: Nick Vlaustin, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli

My default answer was Brisbane just because of how tough it looks on paper.

I then had a closer look at Geelong and think how can anything this century be close to that?

I reckon our 1994 backline would go close to best ever too.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

...and proceeded to get into their 4th GF in a row, but unfortunately they had run out of puff.

4 straight GF's is a mighty mighty effort.

the fact the lions were running on fumes by the time 2004 came around for them to win their way back into a 4th g/f is a mighty accomplishment ... by 2004 the core of their group were banged up and on their last legs the pace of the game was becoming to much but the sheer ferosity of that groups still did enough to get to the g/f

 

[Brolga]

the fact the lions were running on fumes by the time 2004 came around for them to win their way back into a 4th g/f is a mighty accomplishment ... by 2004 the core of their group were banged up and on their last legs the pace of the game was becoming to much but the sheer ferosity of that groups still did enough to get to the g/f

Weren't they forced to play an away "home" final as well?
So many obstacles placed on top of the travel made the achievements of Eagles Crows Port and Lions all the more meritorious in that earlier period.

 

[shintemaster]

That’s the wrong way of looking at it. If we are simply playing these sides with their tactics against each other, West Coast 18 would beat Richmond 17 in most of the ‘Grand Finals’, and WB 16 & Hawthorn 13-15 would round out the semi finalists. Tactics are always progressing quickly in the modern game - if you don’t progress, you will go backwards quickly.

But that’s unfair on teams of the past. Everything modern teams do is only possible due to the knowledge developed by past teams. Past teams couldn’t use this knowledge to develop their own tactics. By discussing a hypothetical match between two sides it encourages comparison between tactics, which is, clearly, unfair.
I think the best way to look at it is simple dominance over the competition - it’s how good you are relative to teams essentially on a level playing field to you. In this, I think it’s really down to 2. Essendon 00 and Geelong 07 - smashing teams like they did in finals is simply ludicrous.

That's a pretty fair way to look at it except that dominance over the competition can be precarious as well. I rate dominance post GC / GWS very differently to prior. Like it or not I also rate dominance from Brisbane post merger or say Sydney with extra money in the kitty differently to other teams. It gets complicated very quickly though. Is a team dominant because they're so much better or the competition is so much worse... Not being a standout doesn't really mean that you're worse than any other year in theory, it just means that the others are better - arguably that's almost a harder flag to win.

For mine in the last 15 years or so the Cats pre expansion (2009) is probably about the strongest and beat a very strong opponent on the day.

Before that I'd struggle to name one, there's plenty of salary cap tainted flags earlier on in the AFL as well and a heap of ridiculously unfair finals fixturing issues (not solved now but at least better).

 

[Power Raid]

good to see the lions get the nod

 

[Sttew]

Who had the better backline?

Geelong:
FB: Tom Harley, Matthew Scarlett, Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright, Harry Taylor, Andrew Mackie
+Wojcinski

I'm biased! So no guessing who I select.

You can throw in Matthew Egan (AA in 2007) & Tom Lonergan (played in back line in 2011 premiership) to that Geelong line up

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

FF: Breust - Roughie - Puopolo
HF: Gunston - Franklin - Rioli
Ce: Hill - Lewis - Smith
HB: Birchall - Gibson - Hodge
FB: Guerra - Lake - Stratton

Ru: McEvoy
RR: Burgoyne
Ro: Mitchell

I/C: Hale, Frawley, Sewell and Shiels.

 

[Captain_Bender]

hahahahhahaahah
Cotchin getting a brownlow because Jobe had his taken off him means nothing ... the softest brownlow medal ever .. even Woewodins holds more respect then Cotch's brownlow ...
yes Cousin Jack's bag of 1 goal 4 in 2009 against first choice full back Zac Dawson (Before he went full crab) was certainly memorable
he did kick 6 and 7 in 2010 in the games where the Saints were without their first choice full back out injured so yeah but that said the Saints also did have Milne kick 5 goals 5 in that first game and Kosi kicked 5 goals 1 .. but then in your premieship year your backline the as you say "has beaten better forward lines than St Kilda's" did also allow Tim Membry (who wouldnt have got a game in the 2009 Saints forward line) to kick a bag ...

but hey lets just ask the opinion of the neutral supporters who they reckon was the stronger side .. 2017 Richmond vs 2009 St Kilda ... i would say it would be 90% in favour of the 2009 Saints .. the only people who consider Richmonds 2017 team in the conversation as the strongest team in the last 25 years are deluded Richmond supporters ... i know the 2009 Saints are not the strongests but they certainly were stronger than richmond

Yet Trent Cotchin would be St Kilda's best midfielder and the only mid St Kilda 2009 side had on the level of Cotchin was Lenny Hayes, the Jack Riewoldt of 2017 is a far better player than the Jack Riewoldt of 2009 St Kilda would not have a single defender who could stop him, and lol Milne and Koschizke would struggle to get a kick against Grimes and Astbury, and lol Membry kicked most of his goals after Grimes had been knocked out and has struggled to have an impact against Richmond ever since

 

[Benny78]

Hawthorn 13-15 have to be the strongest premiership side. When you consider they were the weakest of the three triple premiership sides and this is bigfooty you'd have to say they were the strongest.

Dimma is also a master coach. And Martin has had the best season of any individual player in the last 150 years.

 

[Benny78]

hahahahhahaahah
Cotchin getting a brownlow because Jobe had his taken off him means nothing ... the softest brownlow medal ever .. even Woewodins holds more respect then Cotch's brownlow ...
yes Cousin Jack's bag of 1 goal 4 in 2009 against first choice full back Zac Dawson (Before he went full crab) was certainly memorable
he did kick 6 and 7 in 2010 in the games where the Saints were without their first choice full back out injured so yeah but that said the Saints also did have Milne kick 5 goals 5 in that first game and Kosi kicked 5 goals 1 .. but then in your premieship year your backline the as you say "has beaten better forward lines than St Kilda's" did also allow Tim Membry (who wouldnt have got a game in the 2009 Saints forward line) to kick a bag ...

but hey lets just ask the opinion of the neutral supporters who they reckon was the stronger side .. 2017 Richmond vs 2009 St Kilda ... i would say it would be 90% in favour of the 2009 Saints .. the only people who consider Richmonds 2017 team in the conversation as the strongest team in the last 25 years are deluded Richmond supporters ... i know the 2009 Saints are not the strongests but they certainly were stronger than richmond

Exactly. I'm surprised the award wasn't crossed out that year. Can't believe they still awarded it to the second best players that year.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Yet Trent Cotchin would be St Kilda's best midfielder and the only mid St Kilda 2009 side had on the level of Cotchin was Lenny Hayes, the Jack Riewoldt of 2017 is a far better player than the Jack Riewoldt of 2009 St Kilda would not have a single defender who could stop him, and lol Milne and Koschizke would struggle to get a kick against Grimes and Astbury, and lol Membry kicked most of his goals after Grimes had been knocked out and has struggled to have an impact against Richmond ever since

clearly you are new to this sport ....
2009 the saints had Lenny Hayes , Leigh Montagna and Nick Dal Santo in the All Australian team Brendan Goddard also made the All Australian team as a utility spending some time in the midfield the 2017 All Australian team didnt have Cotchin in it... he didnt even make the 40 man squad funny enough Seb Ross from the Saints made the 40 man squad in 2017 so from the experts in football they all rated Seb Ross a stronger midfielder than Cotchin in 2017 (and thats with two Richmond supporters on the selection panel!!)

Jack Riewoldt could only dream to be the player Nick was from 2009 to 2010
2009 Saints had the only tagger to consistantly beat GAJ in Clinton Jones .. GAJ was far and wide the best player in the comp by a huge margin yet CJ used to keep him quiet. at his peak he would do the same to Dusty as GAJ was a much harder prospect then dusty is ..
dont get me wrong i rate richmond i think they will most likely enter 2019 as the team to beat but they are not in the same level as the 2009 Saints and considering the 2009 Cats beat the 2009 Saints there is no question that Richmond of 2017 is miles off being the most dominant grand final winner

 

[Captain_Bender]

clearly you are new to this sport ....
2009 the saints had Lenny Hayes , Leigh Montagna and Nick Dal Santo in the All Australian team Brendan Goddard also made the All Australian team as a utility spending some time in the midfield the 2017 All Australian team didnt have Cotchin in it... he didnt even make the 40 man squad funny enough Seb Ross from the Saints made the 40 man squad in 2017 so from the experts in football they all rated Seb Ross a stronger midfielder than Cotchin in 2017 (and thats with two Richmond supporters on the selection panel!!)

Jack Riewoldt could only dream to be the player Nick was from 2009 to 2010
2009 Saints had the only tagger to consistantly beat GAJ in Clinton Jones .. GAJ was far and wide the best player in the comp by a huge margin yet CJ used to keep him quiet. at his peak he would do the same to Dusty as GAJ was a much harder prospect then dusty is ..
dont get me wrong i rate richmond i think they will most likely enter 2019 as the team to beat but they are not in the same level as the 2009 Saints and considering the 2009 Cats beat the 2009 Saints there is no question that Richmond of 2017 is miles off being the most dominant grand final winner

Dude Cotchin > Montagna, Dal Santo and Goddard and lol Seb Ross is nowhere near Cotchin

It's safe to say Jack was better than Nick in 2010 and also played a good grand final unlike Nick in either year, and lol Clinton Jones would have no chance against Dusty and the 2 games Ablett played against St Kilda in 2009 he had 27 disposals and 2 goals and 25 Disposals and 1 goal barely kept quiet

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Richmond 09? Well, we didn't get near St Kilda 09. We lost by 56 points.
But Richmond 17? We'll never know but I'd love to hear you explain how St Kilda's game plan wouldn't be significantly outdated when even elements of Richmond 17's gameplan were outdated by the end of 2018.

Richmond of 2017 couldn't even finish top of the ladder in a significantly weaker season. St.kilda lost 2 games for the year. That team would pulpervise your current mob. It's embarrassing to think otherwise.

 

[HTT]

Richmond of 2017 couldn't even finish top of the ladder in a significantly weaker season. St.kilda lost 2 games for the year. That team would pulpervise your current mob. It's embarrassing to think otherwise.

Again. St Kilda 09 were significantly more dominant than Richmond 17. But Richmond 17 had a game plan in turn significantly more sophisticated and better than St Kilda 09's. As an easy example, our gameplan in 2017 had a lot in common with the Bulldogs 2016 - but we learned certain things from their use of it and tried to optimise it - as a result we were probably slightly stronger than they were. WC 18 played a style that was significantly different from ours in 17 so to materialise the change is a little more difficult, but they were probably slightly stronger than we were in 2017.
Another good example is the use of an undersized ruck - i.e. Shaun Grigg - which was a raging success in 2017. By prelim night in 2018 it was clear that it was simply not viable.
That has happened every year since probably the inception of the game. A team devises a strategy no one can contend with, they dominate, teams adopt this strategy to break even and/or determine a way to beat it, and no odne can contend with the new strategy. Rinse and repeat.
OK, perhaps equalisation and ever-reduction of the dominance of top teams reduces the effect of tactical developments and since it's impossible to quantify either factor you could argue St Kilda 09 are better than Richmond 17, but in my honest opinion, it's embarrassing to think that St Kilda 09 would pulverise Richmond 17 - when they didn't t even pulverise Richmond 09

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Again. St Kilda 09 were significantly more dominant than Richmond 17. But Richmond 17 had a game plan in turn significantly more sophisticated and better than St Kilda 09's. As an easy example, our gameplan in 2017 had a lot in common with the Bulldogs 2016 - but we learned certain things from their use of it and tried to optimise it - as a result we were probably slightly stronger than they were. WC 18 played a style that was significantly different from ours in 17 so to materialise the change is a little more difficult, but they were probably slightly stronger than we were in 2017.
Another good example is the use of an undersized ruck - i.e. Shaun Grigg - which was a raging success in 2017. By prelim night in 2018 it was clear that it was simply not viable.
That has happened every year since probably the inception of the game. A team devises a strategy no one can contend with, they dominate, teams adopt this strategy to break even and/or determine a way to beat it, and no odne can contend with the new strategy. Rinse and repeat.
OK, perhaps equalisation and ever-reduction of the dominance of top teams reduces the effect of tactical developments and since it's impossible to quantify either factor you could argue St Kilda 09 are better than Richmond 17, but in my honest opinion, it's embarrassing to think that St Kilda 09 would pulverise Richmond 17 - when they didn't t even pulverise Richmond 09

You're embarrassing yourself dude.

 

[HTT]

You're embarrassing yourself dude.

Please give me some reasons why you believe your opinion, it’s hard to argue with someone who refuses to do so, and would rather simply degrade anyone who presents an opinion and backs it up.

 

[Benny78]

Again. St Kilda 09 were significantly more dominant than Richmond 17. But Richmond 17 had a game plan in turn significantly more sophisticated and better than St Kilda 09's. As an easy example, our gameplan in 2017 had a lot in common with the Bulldogs 2016 - but we learned certain things from their use of it and tried to optimise it - as a result we were probably slightly stronger than they were. WC 18 played a style that was significantly different from ours in 17 so to materialise the change is a little more difficult, but they were probably slightly stronger than we were in 2017.
Another good example is the use of an undersized ruck - i.e. Shaun Grigg - which was a raging success in 2017. By prelim night in 2018 it was clear that it was simply not viable.
That has happened every year since probably the inception of the game. A team devises a strategy no one can contend with, they dominate, teams adopt this strategy to break even and/or determine a way to beat it, and no odne can contend with the new strategy. Rinse and repeat.
OK, perhaps equalisation and ever-reduction of the dominance of top teams reduces the effect of tactical developments and since it's impossible to quantify either factor you could argue St Kilda 09 are better than Richmond 17, but in my honest opinion, it's embarrassing to think that St Kilda 09 would pulverise Richmond 17 - when they didn't t even pulverise Richmond 09

It was a Bradbury lol. The only thing amazing about it was Richmond won an AFL flag.

 

[VineyToClark]

Please give me some reasons why you believe your opinion, it’s hard to argue with someone who refuses to do so, and would rather simply degrade anyone who presents an opinion and backs it up.

Standard of the game has been in decline since 2011 because compromised drafts.

Although I get the feeling that we wouldn't be hearing this commentary if Geelong had won a flag since the Dangerfield era began.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Who had the better backline?

Brisbane:
FB: Chris Johnson, Mal Michael, Daryl White
HB: Chris Scott, Justin Leppitsch, Brad Scott

Geelong:
FB: Tom Harley, Matthew Scarlett, Darren Milburn
HB: Corey Enright, Harry Taylor, Andrew Mackie
+Wojcinski

Hawthorn:
FB: Ben Stratton, Brian Lake, James Frawley
HB: Matt Suckling, Josh Gibson, Shaun Burgoyne

Added Frawley even though he only played in one flag.

Ill even add Richmond since they are discussed quite heavily(by their own supporters that is).

FB: Brandon Ellis, David Astbury, Dylan Grimes
HB: Nick Vlaustin, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli

You name Suckling, but not Birchall whos played in 4 flags.

 

[Altum Volantes]

Single Season - Carlton 95 over Essendon 2000

‘Dynasty’ - Brisbane 01-03 over Hawthorn 13-15

 

[Shaneprice97]

You name Suckling, but not Birchall whos played in 4 flags.

Yeah originally had Birchall, my mistake.