Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today.... part 2

[Chief]

Reminder: This isn't the Israel/Hamas thread. Go to the Israel/Hamas thread if you want to talk about that. Thanks.

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack II

Part I: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/israel-declare-war-after-hamas-attack.1371828/page-47#post-81443295 Thread Rules: Alright. I recognise that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have...

www.bigfooty.com

Thread rules update:

From this point if you're going to make a connection between Islam and the crime rate, you need to demonstrate causation in your post. If you do not, I'm going to infract you for the inherent racism in the position you're taking.

 

[Malifice]

Except for the bloke they revere as the prophet, who was the 'perfect' Muslim that men aspire to be?

Mary (the Mother of Jesus) was 12-14 when she gave birth to him.

I hate to break it to you but back in antiquity child marriages (and births) were extremely common.

 

[bzparkes]

Mary (the Mother of Jesus) was 12-14 when she gave birth to him.

I hate to break it to you but back in antiquity child marriages (and births) were extremely common.

Aisha was 6 when she married Muhammad and 9 when the marriage was 'consummated'. Muhammad was in his 50s and is seen as the 'perfect' Muslim.

I understand child marriages were common in antiquity, which is not an attempt to say Mary's situation was better than Aisha's.

Child marriages are still quite common in the Muslim world today however.

 

[Malifice]

Ok, so based on what you're saying, you agree that importing millions of men aged 15-25 from Islamic countries into Europe was a ******* stupid idea then?

Why are you focussed on Muslim immigration?

Muslim immigration was tiny in the UK compared to non-Muslim immigration:

Migrants in the UK: An Overview - Migration Observatory

You should be going after the Hindus and Catholics if 'migration' is your problem.

 

[Number37]

Ok, so based on what you're saying, you agree that importing millions of men aged 15-25 from Islamic countries into Europe was a ******* stupid idea then?

Here are the changes in crime rates for March-April 2020.
We should have more lockdowns because lockdowns prevent crime?
What do you reckon genius?

What do you say about crime statistics now?

 

[bzparkes]

Why are you focussed on Muslim immigration?

Muslim immigration was tiny in the UK compared to non-Muslim immigration:

Migrants in the UK: An Overview - Migration Observatory

You should be going after the Hindus and Catholics if 'migration' is your problem.

Because this thread's about Islam?

I'm also not aware of Hindus and Catholics continually causing terror attacks in Western countries in the name of their particular sky fairy, nor were millions of them imported into Europe in the past 7 years.

 

[Malifice]

Child marriages are still quite common in the Muslim world today however.

Child marriages are still reasonably common in undeveloped parts of the world or in the developing world. It's not a unique feature of 'Islam'.

Child Marriage in the Middle East and North Africa

Non-Islamic 'Western Europe' or Asia was absolutely no different when they were less developed either.

 

[bzparkes]

Here are the changes in crime rates for March-April 2020.
We should have more lockdowns because lockdowns prevent crime?
What do you reckon genius?

What do you say about crime statistics now?

View attachment 1864993

Why don't you answer the question instead of your usual deflecting?

 

[bzparkes]

Child marriages are still reasonably common in undeveloped parts of the world or in the developing world. It's not a unique feature of 'Islam'.

Child Marriage in the Middle East and North Africa

Non-Islamic 'Western Europe' or Asia was absolutely no different when they were less developed either.

True, this is a reasonable point.

Happens a lot with the gypsies in Europe also.

 

[Malifice]

I'm also not aware of Hindus and Catholics continually causing terror attacks in Western countries

I provided you with stats from the UK. The Republic of Ireland was number 3 on the list, and Germany was number 5.

IRA and the Nazis dont count?

 

[Malifice]

True, this is a reasonable point.

Happens a lot with the gypsies in Europe also.

You going to casually toss out the N word now?

Dont do that again. Its a racial slur, like calling Irish travellers the P word.

It'll get you smacked in the mouth if the wrong person hears it, just like using the N word would in the USA.

 

[Number37]

Why don't you answer the question instead of your usual deflecting?

I'll repeat again.

Population density --- AKA nothing to do with religion
Population aged 15-25 --- AKA nothing to do with religion

In case you are unable to understand basic concepts...
If they were 2 million Christians or Hindus or Atheists you would get the same spike in crime...because...drum roll...

Population density
Population aged 15-25.

 

[bzparkes]

I provided you with stats from the UK. The Republic of Ireland was number 3 on the list, and Germany was number 5.

IRA and the Nazis dont count?

iRA and Nazis haven't gone around conducting regular terrorist attacks in recent times, at least as far as I am aware.

Also, the bulk of the imported 'refugees' ended up in Germany, France and Sweden, all of which have had significant problems with gang violence, rapes, terror attacks, etc.

 

[Malifice]

iRA and Nazis haven't gone around conducting regular terrorist attacks in recent times, at least as far as I am aware.

No, the majority of terror attacks are committed by far-Right wing Europeans, and Ethnic nationalists like the IRA, Neo Nazis, Basque separatists, Serb and Croat nationalists and the list goes on.

Ethnic nationalism and far right-Wing ideology remains by far and away the major cause of terorism in Europe.

The Nazis alone killed millions.

Salaffi Jihadism is definitely a thing, but it pales in comparison to Ethnic nationalism in Europe.

Also, the bulk of the imported 'refugees' ended up in Germany, France and Sweden, all of which have had significant problems with gang violence, rapes, terror attacks, etc.

No, they dont. Most rapes are by a perpetrator known to the victim. Date rapes and family members.

Its the same with when a woman in murdered. It's almost always by a male partner or ex partner.

Do you really want to look at the stats on sexual violence and violent crime and single out a specific group as perpetrators?

Fine. 'Men'.

Ban all immigration by blokes. They're overwhelmingly the perpetrators of virtually all sexual offending and most murders, and virtually all terror attacks. domestic violence murders and mass killings and mass shootings are by men.

We ban immigration from men, and impose special laws restricting men from owning guns, being out at night or being alone with women. When men commit offences, we strip them of citizenship, and deport them. Maybe other rules to stop them congregating together with each other as well.

Sound fair?

If not, why not?

 

[bzparkes]

I'll repeat again.

Population density --- AKA nothing to do with religion
Population aged 15-25 --- AKA nothing to do with religion

In case you are unable to understand basic concepts...
If they were 2 million Christians or Hindus or Atheists you would get the same spike in crime...because...drum roll...

Population density
Population aged 15-25.

Christians? Probably not. As far as a religion goes, they tend to be more respectful and liberal towards women.

Hindus I'll give you, considering India's reputation as rape capital of the world, despite being behind other countries.

Considering this thread's about Islam, the effect forced immigration from Islamic countries has had on the west is the discussion here. You're talking about people who follow a religion that makes women cover up to protect them from the lustful thoughts of men and, in Sharia countries, punishes women for being rape victims.

Do you seriously believe this belief system doesn't have a profound effect on the minds of these imported 'refugees' when they see Western women walk around uncovered?

Check out the current top 10 countries rape statistics per capita

One of these things is not like the others...

 

[bzparkes]

No, the majority of terror attacks are committed by far-Right wing Europeans, and Ethnic nationalists like the IRA, Neo Nazis, Basque separatists, Serb and Croat nationalists and the list goes on.

Ethnic nationalism and far right-Wing ideology remains by far and away the major cause of terorism in Europe.

The Nazis alone killed millions.

Salaffi Jihadism is definitely a thing, but it pales in comparison to Ethnic nationalism in Europe.


No, they dont. Most rapes are by a perpetrator known to the victim. Date rapes and family members.

Its the same with when a woman in murdered. It's almost always by a male partner or ex partner.

Do you really want to look at the stats on sexual violence and violent crime and single out a specific group as perpetrators?

Fine. 'Men'.

Ban all immigration by blokes. They're overwhelmingly the perpetrators of virtually all sexual offending and most murders, and virtually all terror attacks. domestic violence murders and mass killings and mass shootings are by men.

We ban immigration from men, and impose special laws restricting men from owning guns, being out at night or being alone with women. When men commit offences, we strip them of citizenship, and deport them. Maybe other rules to stop them congregating together with each other as well.

Sound fair?

If not, why not?

Ever notice how these 'refugees' entering Europe are mostly military aged men from Arab nations?

Where are the women and children?

Sure, you make a fine point about banning 'men', but the issue is when Europe has literally thrown open the doors and done little to no screening of these people, then do a surprise Pikachu when western women are constantly being r*ped and murdered by imports.

 

[Malifice]

Christians? Probably not. As far as a religion goes, they tend to be more respectful and liberal towards women.

Hindus I'll give you, considering India's reputation as rape capital of the world, despite being behind other countries.

Considering this thread's about Islam, the effect forced immigration from Islamic countries has had on the west is the discussion here. You're talking about people who follow a religion that makes women cover up to protect them from the lustful thoughts of men and, in Sharia countries, punishes women for being rape victims.

Do you seriously believe this belief system doesn't have a profound effect on the minds of these imported 'refugees' when they see Western women walk around uncovered?

Check out the current top 10 countries rape statistics per capita

One of these things is not like the others...

View attachment 1865002

You idiot.

Sweden has high statistics because of how they define rape, and how its prosecuted:

In 2017, there were 4,895 reported rape cases and 190 convictions.[6] In 2018, Sweden passed a new law that criminalizes sex without consent as rape, even when there are no threats, coercion, or violence involved.[4] Sweden no longer requires prosecutors to prove the use or threat of violence or coercion. This led to a rise in convictions of 75% to 333.

Rape in Sweden - Wikipedia

There are not more rapes in Sweden, it's that more people report them.

Here in Australia, 97 percent of rapes go unreported. That number is lower in Sweden.

 

[Malifice]

Ever notice how these 'refugees' entering Europe are mostly military aged men from Arab nations?

Which would be unsurprising seeing as men have greater social mobility than women and children, are more capable of finding work.

Do you have any statistics at all that back up your assertion that 'Men' form the overwhelming majority of refugees in Europe?

Sure, you make a fine point about banning 'men'

So you agree, we should have special laws targeting all men (and only men) then?

Youd sign up to that?

western women are constantly being r*ped and murdered by imports.

You make this claim again, and I'll boot you. It's not true and its a racist claim.

 

[bzparkes]

You idiot.

Sweden has high statistics because of how they define rape, and how its prosecuted:



Rape in Sweden - Wikipedia

There are not more rapes in Sweden, it's that more people report them.

Here in Australia, 97 percent of rapes go unreported. That number is lower in Sweden.

Hmm, good point, probably should've worn my glasses before reading that article.

Still, violent crime statistics, especially gun violence, has had a significant increase in Sweden since 2017, as have narcotic offences. There's an estimated 60-odd suburbs in and around Helsinki that police simply won't go to because of gang violence perpetrated by recent migrants.

 

[Gough]

Hmm, good point, probably should've worn my glasses before reading that article.

Still, violent crime statistics, especially gun violence, has had a significant increase in Sweden since 2017, as have narcotic offences. There's an estimated 60-odd suburbs in and around Helsinki that police simply won't go to because of gang violence perpetrated by recent migrants.

Helsinki is in Finland ffs, you're incoherent.

 

[bzparkes]

Helsinki is in Finland ffs, you're incoherent.

Yes, Stockholm is the one I was thinking of. 2 hours sleep because Mrs didn't wake up for work this morning. Knew it was wrong when I was typing it LoL.

 

[Malifice]

Still, violent crime statistics, especially gun violence, has had a significant increase in Sweden since 2017, as have narcotic offences. There's an estimated 60-odd suburbs in and around Helsinki that police simply won't go to because of gang violence perpetrated by recent migrants.

Again, a lot of that comes down to how Sweden capture and report crime data.

Isnt your argument that poor people do crime and not that 'Muslims' do crime?

Refugees generally speaking, are poor. Poor people are more likely to commit crimes.

Like if I go to any poor neighborhood, anywhere in the world, then I'm going to see more gang violence and property crime aren't I, regardless of the color of the skin of the people that live there, or regardless of the religion those people there have.

Our first gangers here were Irish (Ned Kelly etc). They were poor, disenfranchised by the British, and resorted to crime.

Surely the cause of increased crime is poverty, not 'Islam'?

Do you agree?

 

[bzparkes]

Again, a lot of that comes down to how Sweden capture and report crime data.

Isnt your argument that poor people do crime and not that 'Muslims' do crime?

Refugees generally speaking, are poor. Poor people are more likely to commit crimes.

Like if I go to any poor neighborhood, anywhere in the world, then I'm going to see more gang violence and property crime aren't I, regardless of the color of the skin of the people that live there, or regardless of the religion those people there have.

Surely the cause of increased crime is poverty, not 'Islam'?

Do you agree?

Sure, I can agree with that.

We also know that Islamic countries have far more severe and stricter laws in regards to LGBTQ, women's rights, ethnic minorities, etc.

Mass immigration from anywhere is a terrible idea, let alone importing people whose whole belief system contradicts the country they move to.

 

[Malifice]

Sure, I can agree with that.

Ok so if 'crime' is your concern, and crime is caused by poverty and not by 'Islam' then why the **** are you railing on about Muslims being the problem?

Surely you would support measures to alleviate poverty, and not laws to target Muslims.

We also know that Islamic countries have far more severe and stricter laws in regards to LGBTQ, women's rights, ethnic minorities, etc.

Yes they do. But they're not relevant to the discussion here, because those laws don't apply here.

Mass immigration from anywhere is a terrible idea, let alone importing people whose whole belief system contradicts the country they move to.

Hahahaha.

Are you Aboriginal?

If not, you're saying that, as non-Aboriginal immigrant or descended from one, literally living on Aboriginal land, without any sense of irony.

Why is mass immigration a bad idea anyway? Why can't people be free to choose where they want to live, work and so forth?

 

[bzparkes]

Ok so if 'crime' is your concern, and crime is caused by poverty and not by 'Islam' then why the * are you railing on about Muslims being the problem?

Because read the thread title. This isn't the 'mass immigration' thread and most of the recent mass immigrants to Europe are from Islamic countries.

If you want to discuss mass immigration, happy to do so in a relevant thread.

Surely you would support measures to alleviate poverty, and not laws to target Muslims.

Of course I do. I've also not once suggested any laws to target Muslims, have I?

Yes they do. But they're not relevant to the discussion here, because those laws don't apply here.

So what happens in 30+ years when they outnumber the local populations in those countries mass immigrants have fled to?

Lebanon's a perfect example.

Hahahaha.

Are you Aboriginal?

If not, you're saying that, as non-Aboriginal immigrant or descended from one, literally living on Aboriginal land, without any sense of irony.

Not much I can do about being not being Aboriginal however I was born here and would like to preserve the way of life I currently have, not that I ever see this being an issue for Australia.

Why is mass immigration a bad idea anyway? Why can't people be free to choose where they want to live, work and so forth?

Are you serious? How is mass immigration ever a good thing for a local population(yes, this includes Australia 200 years ago)?

 

[Number37]

True, this is a reasonable point.

Happens a lot with the gypsies in Europe also.

Why do some South Eastern Asian countries ban foreign men from marrying under age girls and impose a max age limit of 50 years old on the would-be groom?

Got anything to do with the child exploitation and/or sex trafficking problem that is widespread in SE Asia?

Why are Bali/Phillipines/Thailand a popular Australian holiday destination?
Got anything to do with sex tours?
Got anything to do with the child exploitation and/or sex trafficking problem that is widespread in SE Asia?


Western values:

10 million child prostitutes worldwide.
1.8 million children each year are exploited as part of the illicit sex market, including up to 100,000 US children.
The average age a girl enters the sex trade in the US is 12-14 years old.
Over 21% of those trafficked for sex are children
Of 25 million victims of forced labor, 5 million are in forced sexual exploitation
51.6% of the criminal human trafficking cases in the US were sex trafficking cases involving children