Will Soccer ever take over AFL?

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One thing that comes up again and again in these 'sokkah vs. football' debates that regularly come up in these forums is the messianic beliefs of some of the mono-codal supporters of each code. It is really like religion. Both sides believe strongly that their code is so superior that if only people would really be exposed to it they would ditch what they were following at the moment and see the true light and shout 'thank you Lord! I saw the light and I am saved!' as they go to the stadium.

Let's take the Association Football ones (aka soccer).

Their argument tend to rely on the fact that because AF is the most popular football code in the world it is proof that it is better. Well that's no real argument. Mac Donald hamburgers are also probably the most popular fast food in the world, but that does not make it necessarily better either.

They also believe that because it is the most popular sport it is 'inevitable' that it will 'take over ze world!' Like a huge jaggernaut it will overcome any other code to become the true world code.

Sounds like Germany pre invasion Poland 1939.

Usually people who thinks like this have often being belittled at school etc. by AFL loving students and teachers for their love of AF. So they are waiting in the darkness of their bedrooms for the day when their game will be taken over by the world game. 'Ah ah! 'they will shout. 'What has happened to your little insignificant game now! Bwaahhhha! Revenge is sweet!'

Maybe some therapy to move on may be useful. Or perhaps a big G-E-T a L-I-F-E.

Now we come from the AFL messianics. Again they believe that Australian Rules Football (ARF) is the best code in 'The whole frigging world!' and are deeply resentful that what they believe is an inferior game gets so much attention.

They can be deeply insecure, as we see everytime AF gets some attention (A-League finals, World Cups) as they come out and tell us really original things such as 'Soccer is boring - 0-0 scoreline etc.', 'Players are weak and dive all the time', spectators riot because the game is so dull' etc. etc. I am sure you can fill the rest. We have heard it so many times.

Interestingly people that say these things are also happy to sit through five days (let alone 90 minutes) of a cricket match where not much happens and ends up in a draw (but that's for another argument).

As the soccer messianics they believe that only if people overseas would get exposed to the ARF they would all realise that they have been wasting their time on that dull weak as piss code and would rush to set up ARF clubs everywhere.

Often when someone says 'But ARF is played only in Australia' they immediately state that it is not true, it is played in many countries. But the fact remains that while some people outside Australia may play it it will remain as popular as Lacrosse it is here.

We regularly read soppy stories about how ARF is resolving the poverty of Black South Africans and resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, but let's face it, it will remain an exotic curiosity outside our country. All the talk about ARF becoming popular overseas has a degree of pathos about it.

Me? Well I am hoping that Melbourne Victory makes the finals, the Association Football National team makes the World Cup and I am really looking forward to a resurgent Carlton next year.
 
One thing that comes up again and again in these 'sokkah vs. football' debates that regularly come up in these forums is the messianic beliefs of some of the mono-codal supporters of each code. It is really like religion. Both sides believe strongly that their code is so superior that if only people would really be exposed to it they would ditch what they were following at the moment and see the true light and shout 'thank you Lord! I saw the light and I am saved!' as they go to the stadium.

Let's take the Association Football ones (aka soccer).

Their argument tend to rely on the fact that because AF is the most popular football code in the world it is proof that it is better. Well that's no real argument. Mac Donald hamburgers are also probably the most popular fast food in the world, but that does not make it necessarily better either.

They also believe that because it is the most popular sport it is 'inevitable' that it will 'take over ze world!' Like a huge jaggernaut it will overcome any other code to become the true world code.

Sounds like Germany pre invasion Poland 1939.

Usually people who thinks like this have often being belittled at school etc. by AFL loving students and teachers for their love of AF. So they are waiting in the darkness of their bedrooms for the day when their game will be taken over by the world game. 'Ah ah! 'they will shout. 'What has happened to your little insignificant game now! Bwaahhhha! Revenge is sweet!'

Maybe some therapy to move on may be useful. Or perhaps a big G-E-T a L-I-F-E.

Now we come from the AFL messianics. Again they believe that Australian Rules Football (ARF) is the best code in 'The whole frigging world!' and are deeply resentful that what they believe is an inferior game gets so much attention.

They can be deeply insecure, as we see everytime AF gets some attention (A-League finals, World Cups) as they come out and tell us really original things such as 'Soccer is boring - 0-0 scoreline etc.', 'Players are weak and dive all the time', spectators riot because the game is so dull' etc. etc. I am sure you can fill the rest. We have heard it so many times.

Interestingly people that say these things are also happy to sit through five days (let alone 90 minutes) of a cricket match where not much happens and ends up in a draw (but that's for another argument).

As the soccer messianics they believe that only if people overseas would get exposed to the ARF they would all realise that they have been wasting their time on that dull weak as piss code and would rush to set up ARF clubs everywhere.

Often when someone says 'But ARF is played only in Australia' they immediately state that it is not true, it is played in many countries. But the fact remains that while some people outside Australia may play it it will remain as popular as Lacrosse it is here.

We regularly read soppy stories about how ARF is resolving the poverty of Black South Africans and resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, but let's face it, it will remain an exotic curiosity outside our country. All the talk about ARF becoming popular overseas has a degree of pathos about it.

Me? Well I am hoping that Melbourne Victory makes the finals, the Association Football National team makes the World Cup and I am really looking forward to a resurgent Carlton next year.

I can't disagree with any of that.
 
to some delusional people, AFL is barely followed outside of victoria, i can't see how it can be followed by those in other countries.

Wow what a stupid post..Aussie rules dominates in Victoria South Australia Western Australia and Tasmania .

lets hope your posting improves newbie ..because that was stupidity personified .
 

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If you're so sure about this please tell this forum what criteria you want to measure 'overtaking' and being 'number 1' sport.

If its participants - soccer is number 1. Pay that

If its regional/geographical spread of premier teams across Australia - soccer is number 1. Don't think so, 7 teams in 6 cities & 1 regional team (Hunter) ATM, compared to 16 teams in 6 cities & games in Tassie

If its participation across different ethnic groups and boys, girls, womens leagues, soccer is number 1. Already proven in you 1st point, you're repeating yourself, a rubbery, dodgy comparison

If its number of elite competitions, like world cup, Asians Champions, Under 17, 20 world cups, FIFA World cups - soccer is number 1 - No AFL comparison here, pay that

If its largest single sponsor - Soccer is number 1 with Qantas Again, picking selective stats for proving your point. Essendon signed Samsung for $7.5M over 3 years, Qld Roar are sponsored by The Coffee Club. I'd be adamant that total AFL sponsorship would dwarf that of the A-League, including the FFA

Player salaries - soccer is number 1. Look at the figures released yesterday about sports salaries. AFL salaries didn't even rate in top 20 Aussie sports stars. how pathetic for a 'number 1' sport. 1 A-League player there, along with Chris Judd. All of the soccer players in the top 20 were overseas based, not here in Oz, proof that you need to leave as the $ aren't here, unless you score the last penalty in a World Cup qualifier

In fact, the only places AFL is number 1 over soccer is (Current) TV rights, at $780 mn versus $120 mln. You may also want to crow about crowd numbers, but this is a rubbery, dodgy comparison to make b/c if you want to measure soccer crowds, you need to include socceroos games (here and overseas), Champions League Games, those ridiculous Beckman-spin games etc. But you can claim crowd numbers if you like.

I'd argue that A-league alone has more global viewers than AFL, and its only 4 years old - this will surely affect TV rights next round. - How can you argue or prove this?

The A-League deliberately went to a summer timeslot so it could survive & flourish, not going up against the established winter codes. Let's not forget what happened to the old NSL.

Crowd figures aren't rubbery, it's how many people went through the gate - (38287 ave. in 2008, compared to the A-League's 15348, incl. finals in 07-08).

The Socceroos crowds for the first part of qualifying for the 2010 World Cup were - 50969 (Aus), 32000 (China), 48678 (Aus), 8000 (Iraq), 12000 (Qatar) & 70054 (Aus), for an average of 36950, less than the AFL. The last 3 games have been 34000 (Uzbeck), 34320 (Aus) & 10000 (Bahrain) - a 26066 ave. Friendlies are played in the UK at mega-stadiums such as Fulham's Craven Cottage (capacity 25500) & QPR's Loftus Road (capacity 18200)

Adelaide United's AFC run included quite a few games at Hindmarsh where capacity is 17000, and their average for the AFC was 14596! These aren't rubbery, dodgy figures, but bums on seats, the true indicator of popularity.

AFL will never compete globally, but will still dominate domestically for many years to come.
 
The A-League deliberately went to a summer timeslot so it could survive & flourish, not going up against the established winter codes. Let's not forget what happened to the old NSL.

Right back at you:

Put the AFL up against any other established football code in any other country and see how it survives and flourishes.

Stupid point.
 
Right back at you:

Put the AFL up against any other established football code in any other country and see how it survives and flourishes.

Stupid point.


You still banging on about Soccer Vinnie? It's time to move on. I love Football (soccer) but the A League is a snooze fest and will never trouble AFL in Australia.
 
Football will be Number 1 sport of Australia sooner than many people may like, Australia will be swallowed up by the asian population sooner than people may like, Asians love football not aussie rules.

30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find a kid without an aussie rules ball, these days you would be hard pressed not to see the rectangular fields that have taken over the place and kids , men and women playing the game in massive numbers.

Look forward in 2030 and the national sport will be football, not only that but australia will be part of Asia, if it already isn't, and their will no longer be an aussie dollar it will be the Asian Dollar and Australia's demographic will be over 50% asian with an influx of football loving asians.

Aussie rules will be a game for the white anglo saxon minority by then and will only be played in Victoria!
 
Right back at you:

Put the AFL up against any other established football code in any other country and see how it survives and flourishes.

Stupid point.

You're right, you did make a stupid point.

What was the OP again? Or do you need to make it a world-wide context to try to win the argument? Soccer has been around in this country since 1921. To compare that with starting an Aussie Rules League in another country is so far from the point, it's not funny.
 
Football will be Number 1 sport of Australia sooner than many people may like, Australia will be swallowed up by the asian population sooner than people may like, Asians love football not aussie rules.

30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find a kid without an aussie rules ball, these days you would be hard pressed not to see the rectangular fields that have taken over the place and kids , men and women playing the game in massive numbers.

Look forward in 2030 and the national sport will be football, not only that but australia will be part of Asia, if it already isn't, and their will no longer be an aussie dollar it will be the Asian Dollar and Australia's demographic will be over 50% asian with an influx of football loving asians.

Aussie rules will be a game for the white anglo saxon minority by then and will only be played in Victoria!
Oh dear :eek:
 
AFL survived a huge influx of immigrants from Europe with a strong soccer background I cant see how it will be threatened by immigration from countries with far less allegiance if any to soccer.

Oh yes, and which countries might they be?

The point I tried to make is that if you're trying to attract fans, technical skill & the ability to hold out for a draw to get an overall result doesn't match up against a high scoring match, even if it is a flogging.

Really? Well I'm glad you find that so entertaining then.


The culture shifts will happen, whether we like it or not. And the media and sponsors will follow the money.
 

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Football will be Number 1 sport of Australia sooner than many people may like, Australia will be swallowed up by the asian population sooner than people may like, Asians love football not aussie rules.

30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find a kid without an aussie rules ball, these days you would be hard pressed not to see the rectangular fields that have taken over the place and kids , men and women playing the game in massive numbers.

Look forward in 2030 and the national sport will be football, not only that but australia will be part of Asia, if it already isn't, and their will no longer be an aussie dollar it will be the Asian Dollar and Australia's demographic will be over 50% asian with an influx of football loving asians.

Aussie rules will be a game for the white anglo saxon minority by then and will only be played in Victoria!

nutter sounds about right.
 
Oh yes, and which countries might they be?

Really? Well I'm glad you find that so entertaining then.


The culture shifts will happen, whether we like it or not. And the media and sponsors will follow the money.

Thanks for the insight, this thread is richer for having you post. Obviously spent a lot of time researching there.

Good to see you edit out the bit where I conceded that a 0-0 draw in certain contexts can be exciting, you could probably tee up some work with Today Tonight.


Meh...
 
I think that if Australia ever hosted the FIFA World Cup then Australian Rules Football might start to be overtaken as the countries number one sport. Certainly the A-League is the 2nd best Australian wide competition at the moment and that has only taken 4 years to build which is a great achivement.
 
I think that if Australia ever hosted the FIFA World Cup then Australian Rules Football might start to be overtaken as the countries number one sport. Certainly the A-League is the 2nd best Australian wide competition at the moment and that has only taken 4 years to build which is a great achivement.

No way its the 2nd best! Are you serious?
 
Thanks for the insight, this thread is richer for having you post. Obviously spent a lot of time researching there.

Good to see you edit out the bit where I conceded that a 0-0 draw in certain contexts can be exciting, you could probably tee up some work with Today Tonight.


Meh...

Indeed I did, and I will, thanks for the tip. You were right, I was wrong to selectively edit out the bit where you concede that a 0-0 draw in certain contexts once every four years could be exciting. How gracious.

I now see how a no-contest event that is over before half time (or before the opening bounce) can be far more exciting than a game in which the scores are tied right up till the end. My entertainment dollar has been poorly spent. Somebody alert the footy media that 0-0 draws means soccer will never be able to compete!
 
It's not a case of them taking over, but could they one day be the No.1 code in Australia? Yes.

Having said that, why is nobody looking at Rugby League and wondering the same thing? Seems like a lot of xenophobia.
 
Indeed I did, and I will, thanks for the tip. You were right, I was wrong to selectively edit out the bit where you concede that a 0-0 draw in certain contexts once every four years could be exciting. How gracious.

I now see how a no-contest event that is over before half time (or before the opening bounce) can be far more exciting than a game in which the scores are tied right up till the end. My entertainment dollar has been poorly spent. Somebody alert the footy media that 0-0 draws means soccer will never be able to compete!

I've never been to, seen or heard of an Australian Rules Football match being over before the opening bounce.


Ever...
 
Football will be Number 1 sport of Australia sooner than many people may like, Australia will be swallowed up by the asian population sooner than people may like, Asians love football not aussie rules.

30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find a kid without an aussie rules ball, these days you would be hard pressed not to see the rectangular fields that have taken over the place and kids , men and women playing the game in massive numbers.

Look forward in 2030 and the national sport will be football, not only that but australia will be part of Asia, if it already isn't, and their will no longer be an aussie dollar it will be the Asian Dollar and Australia's demographic will be over 50% asian with an influx of football loving asians.

Aussie rules will be a game for the white anglo saxon minority by then and will only be played in Victoria!


Where's Pauline when you need her?

Maybe we need a 'Pacific solution' for those pesky soccer people.
 
I'm passionate about both footy and football (soccer) and I can safely say that even though soccer is the most popular sport in the world, footy will always be the most popular sport in Australia simply because it is our game. Just look at America and the NFL, NBA and MBL, all more popular than soccer even though they have been pumping the money into the sport for about 10 years now.

Pretty good post actually.

I agree with most of what you said. I recently got back from the States and "foreign" sports aren't reported in the news at all. The interest level in soccer is almost zilch in terms of attendances, funding etc.


When I was in LA - they were getting 90,000 people for a college (American) football match (USC vs Notre Dame). It is massive. College football is massive, NFL is massive, basketball is massive, baseball is massive.


Unlike Australia, they have kept calling their sport football and not bowed to brown nose people from overseas.
 

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