Society/Culture Working from home vs forced back to the office

[Jivlain]

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/at-work/victoria-vows-to-be-a-work-from-home-haven/news-story/77a296766c24a4dc857b14c7868be623

We have a surplus of office space in older buildings….and a housing crisis…..or is that an opportunity?

Trouble you've got is office buildings are rarely built in a way you'd like to for residential spaces. Often you'd need to have either bizarrely-proportioned spaces or no windows, the individual floors are often quite lightly built (can be fun if you want a bath, say), aircon requirements are substantially different for open plan offices/cubicles vs individual flats (especially if those flats don't have anywhere to put a window unit!), drop ceilings, things like that. If that's the only remaining use case for them they're going to suck as apartments.

(note that this shouldn't be construed as an argument against WFH, it is a strong argument for absolutely dropping developing office spaces though)

 

[peetoo]

Trouble you've got is office buildings are rarely built in a way you'd like to for residential spaces. Often you'd need to have either bizarrely-proportioned spaces or no windows, the individual floors are often quite lightly built (can be fun if you want a bath, say), aircon requirements are substantially different for open plan offices/cubicles vs individual flats (especially if those flats don't have anywhere to put a window aircon unit!), drop ceilings, things like that. If that's the only remaining use case for them they're going to suck as apartments.

(note that this shouldn't be construed as an argument against WFH, it is a strong argument for absolutely dropping developing office spaces though)

Modern offices… might as well start again. Older office buildings or industrial which have been repurposed as offices

Maybe repurpose them as wfh apartments. 2000-10 era dog box apartments completely unsuitable for WFH

 

[spinynorman]

It has little to do with coffee shops and everything to do with the multibillion-dollar metro that NSW just finished building, that needs people using it to pay off, re vitalising CBD's economies is part of it also.

Also, Minns hasn't said everyone needs to get back in the office 5 days a week. He has said full time public servants need to spend a minimum 3 days in the office, with each department to manage it accordingly.

He is offering flexibility, which is pretty much in line with most other companies.

Way too many think "flexible" means WFH full time. That isn't flexible. Flexible doing something that work's for both parties.

That wasn't what was originally said, hence the noting that there's been a fair bit of confusion about all this.

Public sector back-to-office order prompts confusion

Government sector staff have been told to start primarily working from the office but department heads issued their own advice at odds with the premier.

au.news.yahoo.com

If he's walking that back, great, but the whole thing speaks to a totally on the fly ruling.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

That wasn't what was originally said, hence the noting that there's been a fair bit of confusion about all this.

Public sector back-to-office order prompts confusion

Government sector staff have been told to start primarily working from the office but department heads issued their own advice at odds with the premier.

au.news.yahoo.com

If he's walking that back, great, but the whole thing speaks to a totally on the fly ruling.

He hasn't walked back on anything; the word primarily indicates that it was never a full-time arrangement. The world permanent was never used.

Same with anything, people jumped the gun before actually seeking clarity.

What Minns is offering is actually quite reasonable, and if NSW Gov workers don't want to be flexible, they can go and get new jobs.

 

[Andre]

Enriching CBD coffee shops but it’ll damage suburban ones. The accidental opportunity to change the way cities are structured goes squandered.

That said, several government departments have moved offices in the last four years and taken smaller office space. I don’t think they logistically can afford to have everyone return to their offices five days a week.

Incredibly dumb move by a dumb premier.

Cool. Let's put more cars on the road, add congestion, pollution and green house gasses, decrease work life balance and reduce how much time kids will see the primary bread winner in the household. But those coffee shops will be saved

 

[peetoo]

Thats exactly what Minns has said...........

Largest workforce in country told to return to office in memo from NSW premier's department

NSW state government workers have been told working from home will be less common after a new directive from the premier's department nudged people back into the office.

www.abc.net.au

View attachment 2070698

Minimum 3 days a week is what is specified currently in reports. Which is actually quite fair and pretty well in line with other major companies including banks.

I know its Big Footy, but at least chuck it in google before having a rant about others being dumb.....

So in fact both NSW and VIC have a 3 day per week recommendation

 

[eddiesmith]

That wasn't what was originally said, hence the noting that there's been a fair bit of confusion about all this.

Public sector back-to-office order prompts confusion

Government sector staff have been told to start primarily working from the office but department heads issued their own advice at odds with the premier.

au.news.yahoo.com

If he's walking that back, great, but the whole thing speaks to a totally on the fly ruling.

Exactly, everyone didn’t jump the gun, the ruling was very clearly that WFH was to become only when required and justified and they’ve walked it back to continuing to offer flexibility.

Typical Labor government decision that changes as soon as they received backlash.

 

[bzparkes]

P&C tried to make us go back in 3 days a week where I work, then everyone basically went "Meh", and just went in one day, if that.

It's funny when certain bigwigs talk about boosting CBD businesses, yet a lot out in the suburbs are flourishing.

It's really just about empty office space and devaluing commercial real-estate in the CBDs as to why workers are being lobbied to return to the office.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

So in fact both NSW and VIC have a 3 day per week recommendation

it isn't a recommendation as such.

its 3 days a week minimum, which i think is very good.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

P&C tried to make us go back in 3 days a week where I work, then everyone basically went "Meh", and just went in one day, if that.

It's funny when certain bigwigs talk about boosting CBD businesses, yet a lot out in the suburbs are flourishing.

It's really just about empty office space and devaluing commercial real-estate in the CBDs as to why workers are being lobbied to return to the office.

its far more than that, at least in NSW. Commercial real estate is part of it, but it is no way near the main reason.

 

[bzparkes]

its far more than that, at least in NSW. Commercial real estate is part of it, but it is no way near the main reason.

I can't think of any other reason if you're not a customer facing employee and your work can be done remotely.

Perhaps the NSW government can significantly cut down on operating costs for offices and spend the money on something more meaningful?

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I can't think of any other reason if you're not a customer facing employee and your work can be done remotely.

Perhaps the NSW government can significantly cut down on operating costs for offices and spend the money on something more meaningful?

Thats because you are likely only thinking of yourself, and what works for you personally.

 

[peetoo]

Good luck when there’s n emergency during commute time and all required people re on the road or on a train

 

[peetoo]

This borger sounds like a condescending twot. ‘Get out of the pyjamas’ who’s in pyjamas?

‘Get out of the pyjamas’: NSW public service WFH blamed for office vacancy glut

Commercial property developers and aligned lobby groups brazenly hail themselves as victorious in securing a new NSW work-from-office mandate.

www.themandarin.com.au

Anyway public service using less office space is saving taxpayers money. Fat cat property interests going wahhhh their gravy train ain’t returning

 

[Captivating]

The same REIT's that love screwing over small businesses and cafes with exorbitant rents when vacancy rates were 3.2% are now fighting for small businesses and cafes when vacancy rates are at 20%.

They are so honourable.

 

[fs88]

The crazy thing is despite most people currently WFH, peak hour trains are still packed from Tues - Thurs and people are crammed in like sardines here. If return to office was mandated more, I can't imagine how worse trains and roads would get. Fix the train issue and then going into the office would be more viable.

Also seems like once a month there are signalling issues etc so an extra 30 min delay - no thanks.

I wfh 4 days a week so an extra $2,035.2 in my pocket a year ($10.60 x 4 x 48) doesn't hurt.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

The crazy thing is despite most people currently WFH, peak hour trains are still packed from Tues - Thurs and people are crammed in like sardines here. If return to office was mandated more, I can't imagine how worse trains and roads would get. Fix the train issue and then going into the office would be more viable.

Also seems like once a month there are signalling issues etc so an extra 30 min delay - no thanks.

I wfh 4 days a week so an extra $2,035.2 in my pocket a year ($10.60 x 4 x 48) doesn't hurt.

Most people certainly do not WFH full time.

The far majority of people are either working full time,or are doing flexible working hours, like 3 days a week in an office. Thats why the trains are crammed on those days and less busy on Mondays and Fridays.

It would be the very minority of people who are working from home full time.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

The same REIT's that love screwing over small businesses and cafes with exorbitant rents when vacancy rates were 3.2% are now fighting for small businesses and cafes when vacancy rates are at 20%.

They are so honourable.

capitalisms gonna capltalise!

 

[HirdsTheWord]

This borger sounds like a condescending twot. ‘Get out of the pyjamas’ who’s in pyjamas?

‘Get out of the pyjamas’: NSW public service WFH blamed for office vacancy glut

Commercial property developers and aligned lobby groups brazenly hail themselves as victorious in securing a new NSW work-from-office mandate.

www.themandarin.com.au

Anyway public service using less office space is saving taxpayers money. Fat cat property interests going wahhhh their gravy train ain’t returning

I wouldn't say never. It will return slowly eventually as the economy continues to slow, will just be under a more flexible setting as more business force staff back into flexible working. NSW Gov is one of the biggest employers in NSW, so if they do it, others will likely follow. Plenty of businesses have already scrapped full time WFH and have made 3 days a week minimum requirements.

WFH 5 days a week is trading places for 3 days a week in the office. it's really not that big of a deal

You might want to check your superannuation doesn't hold interests on property. Which it's probably very likely they do!

 

[tandino]

It would be one of the obvious occupational hazards of working for an employer with clear competing interests.

A little hard to feel too sorry for them, most did have the inside track all the way through the pandemic (can't have all been on the front line)

#doyourbit #allinthistogether

 

[peetoo]

I wouldn't say never. It will return slowly eventually as the economy continues to slow, will just be under a more flexible setting as more business force staff back into flexible working. NSW Gov is one of the biggest employers in NSW, so if they do it, others will likely follow. Plenty of businesses have already scrapped full time WFH and have made 3 days a week minimum requirements.

WFH 5 days a week is trading places for 3 days a week in the office. it's really not that big of a deal

You might want to check your superannuation doesn't hold interests on property. Which it's probably very likely they do!

Aware of that. Underperforming property can be liqidated

 

[Boston tiger]

We are already too isolated as society. Leave the house .

 

[Cap]

We are already too isolated as society. Leave the house .

we don't need your projection to make our life decisions.

If you feel isolated do something about it, rather than forcing people to talk to you, relfect on who you are an make changes so people want to talk to you.

 

[the_interloper]

Most people certainly do not WFH full time.

The far majority of people are either working full time,or are doing flexible working hours, like 3 days a week in an office. Thats why the trains are crammed on those days and less busy on Mondays and Fridays.

It would be the very minority of people who are working from home full time.

This is why I often get the train into the office on a Friday, nice and quiet

 

[Goroyals22]

We are already too isolated as society. Leave the house .

No thanks, more than happy not to have workers around me gibbering on.. the one day I spend in the office a week is nothing but a waste anyway.


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