Yarra Valley-Mountain District FL Discussion Forum 3

[Burnt out]

If the standard is as good as you claim why do Wandin keep losing all their juniors to EFL clubs??

Maybe theres a family connection and a friend connection between Wandin and a EFL side where most of them went, ya knob and Wandin have had a bit of a tough couple of years. Secondly i think those players have fitted i quite well at a 1st div side so you answer my question stupid

 

[Hump 17]

If the standard is as good as you claim why do Wandin keep losing all their juniors to EFL clubs??

Theres blokes out there that love to tell everyone " Im going down the line to play football". Fair enough and all clubs should encourage it if there going to play First Division EFL and it will improve there football. But when there going to a 3rd or 4th Division club whats the point.

 

[Medevil]

Maybe theres a family connection and a friend connection between Wandin and a EFL side where most of them went, ya knob and Wandin have had a bit of a tough couple of years. Secondly i think those players have fitted i quite well at a 1st div side so you answer my question stupid

Just stating facts, did I call you a knob or stupid?? Don't start getting personal at the end of the day the EFL is a better standard professionally run and cheaper comp than the yarra valley, ya tool!

 

[Footy Rules]

Your kidding mate, top 5 sides in 1st div YVMDFL would fit easily in 2nd div EFL, and the top 2 YVMDFL would be competative with the bottom sides in 1st div EFL, so there is no reason to move, then you have to sustain the costs to compete at that level has any club got a couple of $100k to do this, or lets say Upwey, Gembrook, Woori go and play 3rd or 4th div EFL and play in a lesser comp why

l think you will find that the 1st divy clubs in yarra valley would be of a bottom div 2 standard no where near 1st div & div 3 & 4 in EFL is quite good, its not like 3-4 years ago. Tempelstowe & FTG in 4th div EFL would smash any 2nd div yarra valley side.

 

[Hump 17]

Just stating facts, did I call you a knob or stupid?? Don't start getting personal at the end of the day the EFL is a better standard professionally run and cheaper comp than the yarra valley, ya tool!

Thats a very wide blanket your throwing there. Id like to hear how there more proffessional.

 

[Burnt out]

Just stating facts, did I call you a knob or stupid?? Don't start getting personal at the end of the day the EFL is a better standard professionally run and cheaper comp than the yarra valley, ya tool!

lol might pay to go back primary school mate and do some math, maybe in 4th,3rd Div but i think 1st & 2nd there might be a difference in cost to compete with player payments, never said it wasnt a better standard at the top end, but gee you over rate your lower comps there, you guys tend to think because 1st div efl is so strong the rest are the same.

 

[Burnt out]

l think you will find that the 1st divy clubs in yarra valley would be of a bottom div 2 standard no where near 1st div & div 3 & 4 in EFL is quite good, its not like 3-4 years ago. Tempelstowe & FTG in 4th div EFL would smash any 2nd div yarra valley side.

lol there we go again totally over rate 2nd div and the bottom sides of 1st div efl,

 

[Medevil]

Thats a very wide blanket your throwing there. Id like to hear how there more proffessional.

Just compare web sites, that says it all!!

 

[Burnt out]

Just compare web sites, that says it all!!

LOL that must be correct, you are a better footballer, business or better at anything because the WEB SITE is better, lol . Better remember that

 

[Monniehawk]

l think you will find that the 1st divy clubs in yarra valley would be of a bottom div 2 standard no where near 1st div & div 3 & 4 in EFL is quite good, its not like 3-4 years ago. Tempelstowe & FTG in 4th div EFL would smash any 2nd div yarra valley side.

Went to see a 4th div game last week with a finalist playing a lower side. Sorry, but the standard was woeful. Maybe the wind...?
I question Wilbar and your ideas about the EFL. Why make a comparison with another competition? I think that your assumption about playing standards of top YVMDFL clubs is pretty reasonable, but just irrelevant. As for Tempy and FTG "smashing" any 2nd div side, well let's just agree to disagree.
As for players going down the line - fine, if they are moving in a genuine career pathway such as VFL or at least EFL 1st div. EFL is still just club football even though its higher levels may be a better standard of play. So is VAFA. Kids just get lost in the larger comps, rather than becoming exposed to better chances, so let's not kid ourselves.
The topic does raise the issue of competition boundaries though, which AFL Victoria is currently reviewing in the eastern metro region.
Related to this issue: I don't think Silvan should go to EFL because they aren't in EFL territory. They want to go because they think they will be better off. I am far from convinced, but it is their call now that they have finally followed protocol. Anyway, I suspect that AFLVic will have the final say on that issue, once again!

 

[Medevil]

Went to see a 4th div game last week with a finalist playing a lower side. Sorry, but the standard was woeful. Maybe the wind...?
I question Wilbar and your ideas about the EFL. Why make a comparison with another competition? I think that your assumption about playing standards of top YVMDFL clubs is pretty reasonable, but just irrelevant. As for Tempy and FTG "smashing" any 2nd div side, well let's just agree to disagree.
As for players going down the line - fine, if they are moving in a genuine career pathway such as VFL or at least EFL 1st div. EFL is still just club football even though its higher levels may be a better standard of play. So is VAFA. Kids just get lost in the larger comps, rather than becoming exposed to better chances, so let's not kid ourselves.
The topic does raise the issue of competition boundaries though, which AFL Victoria is currently reviewing in the eastern metro region.
Related to this issue: I don't think Silvan should go to EFL because they aren't in EFL territory. They want to go because they think they will be better off. I am far from convinced, but it is their call now that they have finally followed protocol. Anyway, I suspect that AFLVic will have the final say on that issue, once again!

How is the review going seeing that it's been almost a year since it started? Gary you seem to know what's going with it and with AFLvic, care to enlighten the rest of us??

 

[ManInWhite]

I'll throw in my 2 cents worth considering I've been at EFL for 10 years and this is my first at YV. In a very broad sense I've found that our Div 1 (skillswise) is on par with EFL Div 2 and our Div 2 on par with their Div 4. Having said that, we've had some cracking Div 1 matches which would have outdone say a Lilydale / Sth Croydon match.

Div 4 seems to have 2 extremes - the top 3 are on par with each other but they leave the rest for dead. No disrespect to Silvan but I'll think they'll just be pushing that 4th spot. I can't see them going the year unbeaten but they're certainly better than the bottom half of the ladder.
In comparing leagues, you have to compare apples with apples. Eastern might have more of the recently retired AFL players and have a higher skill standard in general terms. And a better website. But umpire training and development is much better here than Eastern. Videoing all senior matches next year is something Eastern would dream of. And having a big screen with multiple cameras is something that not many other leagues are doing. I've found the physicality here harder but fairer. i.e. The bumps and tackles are more solid at YV but there are much fewer reports than Eastern and I've found YV cleaner in that respect.

So it's a bit hard to say one comp is better than the other - some aspects are done better by one and vice versa but I haven't found anything that suggests Yarra Valley is inferior. In fact, I wish I'd made the move sooner.

As for the review, call me a cynic but I'll admit to only being convinced that Silvan have moved once they run out on EFL grass next years round 1 - until then any other outcome wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Wilbar]

I'll throw in my 2 cents worth considering I've been at EFL for 10 years and this is my first at YV. In a very broad sense I've found that our Div 1 (skillswise) is on par with EFL Div 2 and our Div 2 on par with their Div 4. Having said that, we've had some cracking Div 1 matches which would have outdone say a Lilydale / Sth Croydon match.

Div 4 seems to have 2 extremes - the top 3 are on par with each other but they leave the rest for dead. No disrespect to Silvan but I'll think they'll just be pushing that 4th spot. I can't see them going the year unbeaten but they're certainly better than the bottom half of the ladder.
In comparing leagues, you have to compare apples with apples. Eastern might have more of the recently retired AFL players and have a higher skill standard in general terms. And a better website. But umpire training and development is much better here than Eastern. Videoing all senior matches next year is something Eastern would dream of. And having a big screen with multiple cameras is something that not many other leagues are doing. I've found the physicality here harder but fairer. i.e. The bumps and tackles are more solid at YV but there are much fewer reports than Eastern and I've found YV cleaner in that respect.

So it's a bit hard to say one comp is better than the other - some aspects are done better by one and vice versa but I haven't found anything that suggests Yarra Valley is inferior. In fact, I wish I'd made the move sooner.

As for the review, call me a cynic but I'll admit to only being convinced that Silvan have moved once they run out on EFL grass next years round 1 - until then any other outcome wouldn't surprise me.

Amazing, an answer that actually answers.
I might have to take back all things I've ever said about umps!!

 

[Monniehawk]

How is the review going seeing that it's been almost a year since it started? Gary you seem to know what's going with it and with AFLvic, care to enlighten the rest of us??

It hasn't been going for a year, but certainly it is taking a long time. I understand that it will be completed "towards the end of the year" which is a piece of string answer. The governing bodies of footy in Victoria (VCFL, VMFL, etc.) are also cooperating with the review team who will report their findings to the AFL. A number of clubs from the region have been "interviewed".
Can't tell you any more than that at the mo.

 

[YFNC TIGERS]

Stacy the girl that works for the league, plays netball and has a lot to do with junction... maybe she had something to do with it. I honestly don't think it would be that much of a problem for seville. If they are the best team, then they will win on the day. Junction have potential to play in 2 more home finals if they keep the ground allocations the same. Will everyone sook about that? Just suck it up and play football . It would be almost impossible for a club to host a final and have their senior team play elsewhere - they wouldn't get any vounteers to stay back and help out.

Im sure many clubs would be in similar circumstances...

YFNC would have loved hosting a final game this season, however as discussd with the League, nearly all our junior teams (who play in a different League and subsequently travel to different locations) are in finals. All our senior netballers are in finals which leaves us significantly short with regard to members (many of whom are parents / partners etc) being available on the day at home to host a final. We look forward to a day when circumstances avail us to host such an event.

It is dissapointing and somewhat staggering that you would name someone based on assumption...

Stacey has always been a huge help to the Yea Tigers as I'm sure she is to all other clubs within the League and is looked on with more substance than 'that girl who works for the League' by our club.

 

[Graeme Tuplin]

It hasn't been going for a year, but certainly it is taking a long time. I understand that it will be completed "towards the end of the year" which is a piece of string answer. The governing bodies of footy in Victoria (VCFL, VMFL, etc.) are also cooperating with the review team who will report their findings to the AFL. A number of clubs from the region have been "interviewed".
Can't tell you any more than that at the mo.

I can throw some light on it. Your right MH the review has not been going a year. In actually fact the review started in June 2010 and all YVMDFNL clubs were interviewed by end of June. The powers to be were hoping to have the report out by end of July mid August however because of the size of the report this has been put back and we have been promised delivery by 4th September 2010. We wait for the findings and recommendations that will come with the report.

Graeme Tuplin

 

[Geehard]

lol there we go again totally over rate 2nd div and the bottom sides of 1st div efl,

Not sure what level of footy you played at burnt out or how many games of footy you have watched but I have played both 2nd division efl and 1st division yv and not 1 side in 1st division would get close to a 2nd division efl side

 

[Local Knowledge]

Not sure what level of footy you played at burnt out or how many games of footy you have watched but I have played both 2nd division efl and 1st division yv and not 1 side in 1st division would get close to a 2nd division efl side

Not quite sure how you become a better judge by playing at a higher level. I'll use Mike Sheahan for my argument (Caroline Wilson, Craig Hutchinson etc. etc). One thing that country footy has that suburban footy does not is netball. Go to any country town who has a home game and it's full of families; go to a suburban home game and it's full of knobs.

 

[localfootyguru]

Not sure what level of footy you played at burnt out or how many games of footy you have watched but I have played both 2nd division efl and 1st division yv and not 1 side in 1st division would get close to a 2nd division efl side

Interesting comment Geehard. I think its hard to compare as the standard and style of footy playes is completelly different. Like you I have played in both leagues (Division 1 of both) and many good players from the EFL have struggled to adjust to the more physical style of the YVMDFNL.

 

[muesli]

Not sure what level of footy you played at burnt out or how many games of footy you have watched but I have played both 2nd division efl and 1st division yv and not 1 side in 1st division would get close to a 2nd division efl side

In my opinion most YVMDFNL Div. 1 clubs would fall into EFL Div. 3/Div. 2
All hypothetical of course and everyone has their own opinion.

I can throw some light on it. Your right MH the review has not been going a year. In actually fact the review started in June 2010 and all YVMDFNL clubs were interviewed by end of June. The powers to be were hoping to have the report out by end of July mid August however because of the size of the report this has been put back and we have been promised delivery by 4th September 2010. We wait for the findings and recommendations that will come with the report.

Graeme Tuplin

Be interesting to see where the boundaries are..., their is no doubt in my mind that some clubs will be playing in the wrong leagues according to the boundaries. These clubs should have a choice to stay in their current league or move to the league that they fall under.
For example in the review, Coldstream would probably fall under the YVMDFNL boundary but if they want to stay where they are then thats up to them, however if they want to move then they have to move to YVMDFNL.
Upwey-Tecoma or Mount Evelyn could even fall in the EFL boundary??? who knows... (not saying they would, just hypothetically could fall in different league's boundary).
Another example would be Noble Park (Yes i know, no relavence to this thread, was just giving an example) who would definently be in the Southern FL boundary. However they should have the choice to either stay in EFL or move back to SFL.

In my opinion their should be a little leeway, for example a club within a few km's of the boundary should have the choice of which league they play in (what i'm basically saying is their should be a grey area between each league's area, & if your club falls in this grey area, You can play in either league). But thats just my opinion & who knows what they will do...

 

[Monniehawk]

Not quite sure how you become a better judge by playing at a higher level. I'll use Mike Sheahan for my argument (Caroline Wilson, Craig Hutchinson etc. etc). One thing that country footy has that suburban footy does not is netball. Go to any country town who has a home game and it's full of families; go to a suburban home game and it's full of knobs.

Actually not that many knobs, either. The crowd in Surrey Hills on Saturday was thinner than boarding house soup.

 

[Monniehawk]

In my opinion most YVMDFNL Div. 1 clubs would fall into EFL Div. 3/Div. 2
All hypothetical of course and everyone has their own opinion.


Be interesting to see where the boundaries are..., their is no doubt in my mind that some clubs will be playing in the wrong leagues according to the boundaries. These clubs should have a choice to stay in their current league or move to the league that they fall under.
For example in the review, Coldstream would probably fall under the YVMDFNL boundary but if they want to stay where they are then thats up to them, however if they want to move then they have to move to YVMDFNL.
Upwey-Tecoma or Mount Evelyn could even fall in the EFL boundary??? who knows... (not saying they would, just hypothetically could fall in different league's boundary).
Another example would be Noble Park (Yes i know, no relavence to this thread, was just giving an example) who would definently be in the Southern FL boundary. However they should have the choice to either stay in EFL or move back to SFL.

In my opinion their should be a little leeway, for example a club within a few km's of the boundary should have the choice of which league they play in (what i'm basically saying is their should be a grey area between each league's area, & if your club falls in this grey area, You can play in either league). But thats just my opinion & who knows what they will do...

Not sure if its just about boundaries!
But it has been an issue raised by leagues neighbouring the EFL. They have probably felt that the former "Croydon-Ringwood FL" has been a bit acquisitive over the past few years and is destabilising other leagues - including their own lower grades.
Also think that common sense will prevail and they'll allow some leeway.

 

[Doona2]

I can throw some light on it. Your right MH the review has not been going a year. In actually fact the review started in June 2010 and all YVMDFNL clubs were interviewed by end of June. The powers to be were hoping to have the report out by end of July mid August however because of the size of the report this has been put back and we have been promised delivery by 4th September 2010. We wait for the findings and recommendations that will come with the report.

Graeme Tuplin

Be interesting to see where the boundaries are..., their is no doubt in my mind that some clubs will be playing in the wrong leagues according to the boundaries. These clubs should have a choice to stay in their current league or move to the league that they fall under...

Will it be a complete re-jig statewide by the VCFL???

This was thrown around in the Goulburn Murray Region of the VCFL about 5-6 years ago and bugger changed other than the CGFL being disbanded, B&DFL did the same last year with those clubs finding new homes and a few other clubs swapping to the new two tiered Picola comp.

I know a lot of ya's grizzle about the trips to Yea, Alex, Thornton, I just wonder if a new comp encompassing the territory around Seymour (a la the junior comp up here) was considered this time round in the fact finding??? Something like the old Waranga North East, or even Seymour as our Major League club adopting a SDFL, using Kings Park as it's home???

Pie in the sky stuff I know, bored at work and just thinking out aloud.

 

[Medevil]

Will it be a complete re-jig statewide by the VCFL???

This was thrown around in the Goulburn Murray Region of the VCFL about 5-6 years ago and bugger changed other than the CGFL being disbanded, B&DFL did the same last year with those clubs finding new homes and a few other clubs swapping to the new two tiered Picola comp.

I know a lot of ya's grizzle about the trips to Yea, Alex, Thornton, I just wonder if a new comp encompassing the territory around Seymour (a la the junior comp up here) was considered this time round in the fact finding??? Something like the old Waranga North East, or even Seymour as our Major League club adopting a SDFL, using Kings Park as it's home???

Pie in the sky stuff I know, bored at work and just thinking out aloud.

I'm betting that this whole review is a crock of s&@t and nothing comes out of it!

 

[wtfa]

Doona.
Very interesting point, Football restructures? when will it stop? yes many leagues have folded because of several reasons Demographics, clubs wishing to join neighbouring leagues etc.or the VCFL desire to maintain Major leagues at the cost of District Leagues?
YVMDFL it self was created by amalgamation of the YVFA and the MDFA.
Meanhile the Eastern Football League which neighbours the YVMDFL which no doubt has probabaly the highest standard football outside of the VFL namely Division One and Two, It is a tough gig to remain competitive and financial at that level and that is mirrored by the managment of those clubs on and off the field. Division 3 and 4 would be equal standard to the majority of YVMDFL clubs although some would be competitive in Div 2?EFL

What is the answer? Georaphical locations would eliminate the travel bug but there would be a few "cricket" scores will be made.
Reform the WNEFL (Seymour Mansfield Euroa Broadford Yea Alex TEDFC Avenel etc) Mansfield have gone from strength to strength other clubs appear to be happy where they are ie KDFL. GVFL RDFL etc

Perhaps a simplistic answer is that EFL is a large league if they poach or additional YVMDFL clubs transfer to the EFL. In time it has to weaken the YVMDFL mainly because the scope for the YVMDFL to expand is limited?

Boundaries have been mentioned perhaps there could be a reshuffle. Div 1 & 2 EFL remain as is or slightly expanded to a third Division depending on the abilities/competiveness of clubs This could also include existing YVMDF clubs ie Upwey. Worri etc

Then zones / Divisions be established on georaphical areas ie Colsdtream Chirnside Healsville Yarra Glen Alex Yea Kinglake TEDFC etc etc.(F.T.G.Emerald. UFTG. Sth Belgrave. Belgrave.Olinda etc etc) There will always be a couple of clubs where travel will be part of the game, but thats footy (netball) we must remember that the clubs that are away from the "metro" area have long and colourful histories and have been part of their communities no different to all clubs and deserve to be part of the wider footy and netball community not isolated They have to travel every second week they get over it.
YVMDF with Netball have a bit of an edge over the EFL. Perhaps that may be something the EFL may desire.
At the very least YVMDFL should not be targeted or clubs picked of to satisfy a need for EFL to establish a fifth division etc. Football Victoria has an obligation TO ALL CLUBS.