2012 List Management - Drafts, Trading and Delistings

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I've done about 5 of these already but with the end of the season, things are a little clearer from my view.

Upgraded rookies- Johannisen, Jong, Campbell, Austin (only if Markovic is delisted)
Draft Picks- Not sure if we use 5 picks or 6 picks. With 4 being upgraded we may only use the 5. Will need to cut 9 or 10 regardless.
Delisted/Retired- Gilbee, Hargrave, Mulligan, Moles, Hooper, Markovic (I think Austin has surpassed him and we have a wealth of options above him in his position, regardless of contract situation he should probably be cut. He is a "try-er" so wouldn't be surprised if he stays), Djerrkura (improved lately, but I don't think he has shown enough to get an extension), Skinner (same as DJ, has improved of late but I wouldn't rush to give him a new contract), Hill/Panos (neither got a game this season, you'd expect 1 to stay and 1 to go, my tip is Panos to stay). Sherman and Veszpremi will probably get extra seasons, but are probably lucky not to be on the "de-list list". Will have one more season to prove themselves.
Trades- Not interested in being big trade players. Wouldn't mind trading a Sherman or Veszpremi for a pick upgrade of some time.
Draft- Like a lot of others Mayes and Stringer would be my preferred selections (Toumpas if he slipped). Would love Tom Lee (20yo KPF) as well, but he might be a bit of a stretch at our second pick and might not last to our third pick with a few other clubs in need of tall forwards. I hope he is available at our third round. Have been impressed by Lachie Hunter's year in the TAC Cup and we would be silly not to pick him up as a F/S.

What's everyone's thoughts?
 
Morris Tarlia Wood
Murphy Roughead Howard

Jones Williams Higgins
Dickson Lake Dahlhaus

Lake is there to take the best back every week, and allow Jones Grant and Cordy time needed to develop and not get mauled by back lines getting 2-3 to them.

BMac has over the past 6 weeks that he is happy giving Roughead the big jobs and i think he will do the same next year as will he with Tarlia and having Morris and Murphy back there to have some old heads for them
 
fronkalicious said:
Carlton would take lake. 2nd rounder at best though. If hawthorn get roughed up by hawkins or cloke in a final they might offer a 2nd rounder for him aswell.
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I reckon Carlton are mad if they don't look at Lake. You look at their list, and a number of their best players are in their late 20s (Judd, Scotland, Waite, etc). If they got Cloke, then imagine Lake at the other end and they are Premieship contenders in 2013.

Rather than a second rounder though, I reckon they might offer up Kane Lucas (188cm midfielder, pick 12 in 2009 - 3 seasons with Carlton for 18 games).

Thoughts?
 

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josh the gent said:
I reckon Carlton are mad if they don't look at Lake. You look at their list, and a number of their best players are in their late 20s (Judd, Scotland, Waite, etc). If they got Cloke, then imagine Lake at the other end and they are Premieship contenders in 2013.

Rather than a second rounder though, I reckon they might offer up Kane Lucas (188cm midfielder, pick 12 in 2009 - 3 seasons with Carlton for 18 games).

Thoughts?
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No thanks. Picks or nothing. First rounders only please.... Otherwise we are clearly better off keeping him.... I'm not saying we would get a first round pick, but it would be the only thing I'd accept for Lake.
 
TedDougChris said:
Do we trade Lake ?? .
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I threw Lake's name up as a trade a while back and his performance's towards the end of the year have done nothing to change my opinion on him. From the outside he doesn't appear to show any leadership qualities, and if anything his appaling body language and lack of desire would be more detrimental to the development of our young players. He got a massive contract a couple of years back to see out his career, and has played selfish lazy football since.
I think the best we could hope for in a trade is a potential upgrade of our 2nd round pick to a middle to late 1st rounder, but I would settled for a 4th rounder from anyone who would take his contract off our hands.
To be honest I can't see many clubs considering him worth the money he is on.
 
If Carlton (or any other contender) wanted Lake, we would need to pay a fair bit of his salary. It's worth it if we get a first rounder, or an upgrade to a first rounder, but realistically we won't get either. Hasn't Malthouse been critical of Lake's body language in the past? Even if not, Malthouse would likely see his second year as his best chance of winning a premiership with the Blues. I can't see Clarkson wanting Lake.

Hypothetical trades in an attempt to find fair value:
Carlton's second and third rounders for Lake and our fourth rounder.
Carlton's first rounder for our second OR third rounder and Lake
Hawks first rounder and second rounder for our second rounder, fourth rounder and Lake (essentially Lake for 2 x pick upgrades).
Can't see any of them being accepted by both parties.
 
Rookie said:
If Carlton (or any other contender) wanted Lake, we would need to pay a fair bit of his salary. It's worth it if we get a first rounder, or an upgrade to a first rounder, but realistically we won't get either. Hasn't Malthouse been critical of Lake's body language in the past? Even if not, Malthouse would likely see his second year as his best chance of winning a premiership with the Blues. I can't see Clarkson wanting Lake.

Hypothetical trades in an attempt to find fair value:
Carlton's second and third rounders for Lake and our fourth rounder.
Carlton's first rounder for our second OR third rounder and Lake
Hawks first rounder and second rounder for our second rounder, fourth rounder and Lake (essentially Lake for 2 x pick upgrades).
Can't see any of them being accepted by both parties.
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Fair comments from both you and TBOW before. I dont think we'll let him go unless someone is willing to pay over the odds. He will still be a very good defender and hopefully teach the kids something. I think his season has declined in part due to missing all of last year. I think he's struggling to cope with a long year after missing 12 months before that...

Hopefully he'll be better next year...
 
Josh Toy anyone...?



You don't lose ability.. You lose confidence.
Could be a steal..

Jarrad Grant for Josh Toy..?
 
Lake has value to teams in contention who are lacking a key defender and it would also offer Lake the chance to have one last crack at a flag. He only has one year of his (large) contract left and if whichever other side asks for him is willing to extend the term to two years on a lesser amount we may avoid paying much. Generally I'd be all for this (as long as Lake actually wanted to do it) but I doubt anyone will be giving us a first rounder for it. If, however, it netted us a promising youngster from another club (NOT a Vez/Dj type fringe dweller who is underperforming) or if the compensation could be used to help us get into the mini-draft (ie bundling with our second rounder) then I'd consider it.

Have heard a lot about Toy but it's a real concern that he couldn't get more of a lookin in an underperforming side. Would want him interviewed thoroughly - he may be talented but if he's an off-field problem then I'd pass.
 

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Dogs_r_barking said:
Oliver Wines write up.
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Dogs_r_barking said:
http://www.footytragic.com/blog/planning-for-2013/planning-for-2013-oliver-wines/
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"In terms of playing style, Wines is your blue collar, hardworking ball magnet. His attack at the contest is second to none, with his contested ball winning ability on par with anyone in this draft. But what separates Wines from other ball winners is a very mature football brain. His positioning around stoppages is outstanding. He routinely loses his opponent in congested areas, and more often than not will be the one that ends up in possession. He knows when to peel off and find space, showing a nice link up game that compliments his link up work. For a player that hits contests as hard as he does, Wines footy smarts are a stand out."

Definitely like the sound of Wines a bit more now. At the minute I'd be happy with any two of Mayes, Stringer, O'Rourke and Wines, but Mayes/Stringer is still my preference. Then again, still a long way to go.
 
Dazb86 said:
Where do we start? If we are going to delist all the players that aren't going to take us to a premiership we wouldn't be able to field a team next year.
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We will win the spoon next year anyway, lets get rid of all dead wood now.
 
Ok....he's a bloke who tried hard. I was excited by his recruitment. But he's just not been able to do it with us. He's a good bloke, brings a lot of energy and I hope he gets an opportunity somewhere else. Also mentioned is that Grub has gone also.....not a surprise I guess....pretty decent athlete another who gavee it all he had....and you can't do any more. Well done to both and thanks for your efforts.
 
Anyone care to take a punt on the top 10 draft picks?

1. GWS - Whitfield
2 GC - Martin MDP+1/ GWS - Grundy
3. Melb - Viney
4. Melb - Hogan (MDP+2) GWS - Toupas
5. WB - Mayes
6. WB - Stringer
7. PA - Wines
8. BL - Garlett
9. Rich - Kennedy
10. Daniher
 
Dancing Dougy said:
Where would the Doggies be without their "project players"? The last 15 or so years have been littered with them. With Tommy Gun Williams pretty much established as an bonafide AFL player, Skinner is a required project / player :thumbsu:
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yes....have to agree....Zephy has the talent.....he just needs to apply himself and he can make it....can he? Ball in his court I suspect....I don't think we will delist him this year.....think...
 
Whether Skinner survives is one of the more interesting questions of our list/delistings. If McCartney retains him, it will be because Zeph is willing to work hard at training. For that reason he will probably make it as an AFL footballer as he has the ability.
 
Dazb86 said:
I'm not sold on Zeph at all. He has a lot of talent. Quite often looks lost on the field though.
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Me neither. I think it's reasonably likely he will be delisted. But, his chances of staying are improved by the amount of more obvious dead wood and three retirements (including Mulligan according to an HS article today).
 
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