Hot Topic 2016 DRAFT

[Soapy V]

Trading a future first round for another first round this year is mad imo... McKay, Curnow, Jack and Cuningham are all complete unknowns at this stage and we could easily find that our "needs" change as their futures become more clear.

why not if sos sees it as an advantage? so many people complaining about trade but no other solutions. do we just sit still, do nothing and pick up 4 picks inside top 50 and build that way. worked well before. tough decisions will need to be made. right or wrong thats the system we need to work in

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Rumour was our first and second this year for the GWS 4.

An Everitt trade makes sense in that he is what he is. A laconic third tall runner who likes a goal. Gold Coast had interest last year. If we can somehow turn him into an early second rounder, I wonder if we can use 2 seconds this year and a 2017 second to get that GWS 4 deal done. That way we keep both first rounders.

My feeling is that Silvagni is a logical replacement for Everitt anyway as far as forward play goes and Tomlinson will cover that tall midfield runner role.

Not a fan of that rumour at all. We are in rebuild mode and giving away our top 2 picks for GWS rejects is unacceptable.

I would offer up our second rounder + another second rounder (from a trade) for Tomlinson and Marchbank. If they say no, well then it's their loss. Good luck fitting them all onto the list. I'd happily keep our second rounders and spend them along with our first rounder.

Silvagni will most likely take over Everitt's spot as you said. I wouldn't be against pick #23 + Everitt for a pick#15. Not a bad idea actually.

Structurally, we need Casboult in the side so we can't afford to offer him up just yet. IF he puts a good couple of season together this year and next, I can see a flag contender offering up their first rounder for him. If C.Curnow and McKay develop by then as planned, I would jump if offered a top 15 pick for him.

 

[mediumsizered]

settle down. not wish lists just examples of players that are worth some trade value. i have no idea what will happen but to say someone wont be traded is silly. i have no doubt that if a deal is put forward that will benefit the club they will do it. if we do nothing and keep all these players it will be a very slow rebuild. sos said 66 games for a full list rebuild. i have no doubt he will trade some players. who? i have no idea. he will make the tough decisions we have avoided for more than a decade.

Given Gibbs is under contract & has made it very clear from the beginning that he intends to be a one club player, the club cannot trade him, no matter how much his trade value is perceived to be.

We were quite fortunate that Hendo & Yarran wanted out (add Bell as well, but obviously for different reasons) & Menzel was happy to return to SA. That made it easy to go to the trade table & stock up on draft picks/GWS players.

Between now & the trade period, there may well be Carlton players put their hand up for a trade or have their managers test the waters at other clubs, but they may not necessarily be those of the highest trade value. When it comes to player trades, it is not about making tough decisions. Players don't get traded unless they are open to being traded. Trade period might be perceived as a meat market, but it is a voluntary meat market.

We have to accept that we will not be replicating our 2015 trade period. This year SOS will really be earning his money when the trade period starts, because he won't have the same value to trade.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Not a fan of that rumour at all. We are in rebuild mode and giving away our top 2 picks for GWS rejects is unacceptable.

I would offer up our second rounder + another second rounder (from a trade) for Tomlinson and Marchbank. If they say no, well then it's their loss. Good luck fitting them all onto the list. I'd happily keep our second rounders and spend them along with our first rounder.

I really think you are underselling some of these players. They are not rejects. They are not being delisted. We are not the only teams trying to take advantage of the GWS situation.

Tomlinson, Marchbank and Steele have shown more than Plowman had at GWS. By your measure Plowman is a reject.

Steele is in his 2nd season, was a #24 Academy player. He played 7 games in his first year and has played 8 games this year in a flying GWS side with an embarrassment of riches. He is averaging 15 disposals, 6 contested possessions, 5 tackles, 2.3 clearances and has kicked 9 goals so far. These are pretty decent stats for a 2nd year inside mid. That is in about 70% game time overall.

Marchbank is 19, rolled his ankle in the seniors and then suffered a setback. GWS have some KPD stocks though so while Marchbank is a required player, they are wary that he may want to return home so will have to decide which ones to keep.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

I really think you are underselling some of these players. They are not rejects. They are not being delisted. We are not the only teams trying to take advantage of the GWS situation.

Tomlinson, Marchbank and Steele have shown more than Plowman had at GWS. By your measure Plowman is a reject.

Steele is in his 2nd season, was a #24 Academy player. He played 7 games in his first year and has played 8 games this year in a flying GWS side with an embarrassment of riches. He is averaging 15 disposals, 6 contested possessions, 5 tackles, 2.3 clearances and has kicked 9 goals so far. These are pretty decent stats for a 2nd year inside mid. That is in about 70% game time overall.

Marchbank is 19, rolled his ankle in the seniors and then suffered a setback. GWS have some KPD stocks though so while Marchbank is a required player, they are wary that he may want to return home so will have to decide which ones to keep.

Let me clear something up. I don't think they're bad footballers. Not at all. GWS are the ones rejecting them I think it's fair to say, Tomlinson had some incredible form in their 2's and still can't keep a spot there. Both Steele and Tomlinson were omitted for the Swans game and the Giants still won by 7 goals.

If they're going to ask for our first 2 picks in a strong draft then they need to offer up regular 22 players as far as I'm concerned.

 

[ferrisb]

...Jack Steele?

I like the look of him.

#BluesSteele....

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Let me clear something up. I don't think they're bad footballers. Not at all. GWS are the ones rejecting them I think it's fair to say, Tomlinson had some incredible form in their 2's and still can't keep a spot there. Both Steele and Tomlinson were omitted for the Swans game and the Giants still won by 7 goals.

If they're going to ask for our first 2 picks in a strong draft then they need to offer up regular 22 players as far as I'm concerned.

Again, they are not rejecting them. GWS refused to trade Tomlinson only last year for a mid first rounder. They are a special case, full of draft concessions and academy players. Do you really think someone in the GWS best 22 is worth our second rounder?

They have players doing well in the NEAFL, earning a spot in the seniors. If their seniors have a loss they have a handful of players they rotate in and out, whether they are in the bottom few or not. Plus, they know Tomlinson wants to go home. He is an easy target at the moment.

Tell me who you would drop from their side to accommodate these players. Yet, 3 of the 4 have got senior games this year.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Again, they are not rejecting them. GWS refused to trade Tomlinson only last year for a mid first rounder. They are a special case, full of draft concessions and academy players. Do you really think someone in the GWS best 22 is worth our second rounder?

I just think with Tomlinson and Steele constantly in and out of the side, they (in the eyes of the GWS team selection hierarchy) are not part of their best 22. If we offer our top pick it's only going to help them more than it does us. They get to offload players that they are rejecting on a regular basis and in return can grab some more top notch academy players or use the picks as currency to chase a big fish and bolster their stocks further.

As for a player in their best 22 worth our second rounder, probably not someone we could go after with that pick alone, but we aren't talking about just that, we also talking about offering our first pick as well. For our first two picks we need to get a gun mid in return or else there's no point in giving them up considering that's what we will potentially get in this year's draft anyway.

They have players doing well in the NEAFL, earning a spot in the seniors. If their seniors have a loss they have a handful of players they rotate in and out, whether they are in the bottom few or not. Plus, they know Tomlinson wants to go home. He is an easy target at the moment.

Tell me who you would drop from their side to accommodate these players. Yet, 3 of the 4 have got senior games this year.

Not too sure. And that's my point, if they aren't part of their best 22 then we shouldn't give up our first pick for them.

I look at it this way, do we have a real need for Marchbank? Probably not. It would be great to get him, but not at the cost of our first pick, we have a greater need for gun mids and Jack Steele (imo) is not the gun mid we are after either.

Tomlinson is one we would have use for. However, given he's been in and out of the side last year and this, a second round pick in a strong draft is a reasonable offer for him.

 

[Golden Tonsils]

We need outside run but may still have Boekhorst or Cuningham coming in to provide that. We need a livewire goalkicking type but then we badly need a class inside mid to work in tandem with Cripps. Steele looks good but maybe not the elite potential that may be available in this draft.

If we keep our first rounder who do we like and who do we need the most, bearing in mind we can't fix all of our problems in the one draft and we still have a couple of years to complete this rebuild.

We are currently sitting at Pick 8 in reverse ladder order but the Gold Coast and Collingwood picks are unlikely to be live. We could be as high as 6 as far as live picks go, 5 if Richmond get a run and we run out of steam completely.

Mids McLuggage, Brodie, Gallucci, Sharenberg, Powell-Pepper - names that have been talked about for a while. One of them will be there for us. If they all went we have forwards Marshall or Battle, utility Petrevski-Seton, forwards Ainsworth or Venables or key defender Rotham to choose from. We know SPS will be gone though so we get a rated mid regardless.

Haven't watched the championships so maybe those that have can add to these profiles.

Jordan Gallucci - 183cm, has come on strong. Classy ball user - tick, lowers eyes and finds short to medium targets - tick, ability to accelerate away from contests - now is he quick the first few steps, naturally quick overall? Like can he go on a long run? Does he get enough of the ball to effect matches? An inside mid needs to get their hands on it. Writeups make him seem more an inside/outside type. I'm fine with that given acceleration and ball use but it doesn't necessarily help Cripps unless Gibbs goes inside permanently.

Will Brodie 189cm - Strong inside mid. Clearance and contested possessions - good support for Cripps. Can go outside and carry ball, good pace. Scoreboard impact.

Hugh McLuggage 185cm - Outside mid. Ground level ability is freakish. Overhead marking. Lightning fast disposals under pressure. Front and centre of packs up forward. Reliable in front of goal. Good acceleration. Efficiency needs to improve but part of that is because he spends a lot of time up forward. Potential to develop contested game as he gets stronger.

Sam Powell-Pepper - 188cm - Strong inside mid. Outstanding athlete. Explosive speed. Great endurance and change of direction. Efficiency not great.


Jonty Scharenberg - 185cm - Productive, Contested ball winner. Uses football well. Athletically average. No x-factor.


Leaning towards Brodie first, then McLuggage, Powell-Pepper and Gallucci around the same mark, then Scharenberg as far as mids.

However if Marshall came to us, we'd have to look purely because tall forwards attract a premium if you end up with too many of them. I'd insert him or SPS in somewhere around the McLuggage mark at this stage. In other words, I would consider abandoning the inside mid dream to get one of those other two if Brodie is gone.

Love the players you picked agree with all

After seeing him today, Andrew McGrath is now on the wish list.

Brilliant all round, only downside might be gis lack of height

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I just think with Tomlinson and Steele constantly in and out of the side, they (in the eyes of the GWS team selection hierarchy) are not part of their best 22. If we offer our top pick it's only going to help them more than it does us. They get to offload players that they are rejecting on a regular basis and in return can grab some more top notch academy players or use the picks as currency to chase a big fish and bolster their stocks further.

Steele has played 8 of 12 though. He's thereabouts. Tomlinson got as many games as they could give him prior to this year injury notwithstanding. What has changed? He asked to be traded last year so they are planning for their future without him.

As for a player in their best 22 worth our second rounder, probably not someone we could go after with that pick alone, but we aren't talking about just that, we also talking about offering our first pick as well. For our first two picks we need to get a gun mid in return or else there's no point in giving them up considering that's what we will potentially get in this year's draft anyway.

It's a tough call. A good inside mid, a good tall utility, a potential gun key defender, and a developing tall forward vs potentially a gun mid (where are the guarantees here?) and whoever we get as a second rounder. I do tend to think we assume we are going to luck out in the draft with guns at every pick and the reality isn't quite that. What we do know is that on exposed form, Tomlinson, Marchbank and Steele are AFL footballers. Where their ceiling might be is the question. I certainly don't think the script has been written on any of them, most certainly not the two second year players who were taken top 10 and early in the second round.

Not too sure. And that's my point, if they aren't part of their best 22 then we shouldn't give up our first pick for them.

Yet we wanted first rounders for Henderson and Yarran last year despite well documented problems, and an early second for Tommy Bell who while an honest player has deficiencies those GWS boys just don't have.

As our first rounder gets lower there might be an issue. I do favour trying to nab a later first rounder back of them somehow. If we could find 3 second rounders I'd be thrilled to get away with that. I too want a gun mid AND the GWS 4. Getting Plowman, Phillips, Lamb and Sumner was such a win for our club in terms of depth. The 2016 package is far far more accomplished.

I look at it this way, do we have a real need for Marchbank? Probably not. It would be great to get him, but not at the cost of our first pick, we have a greater need for gun mids and Jack Steele (imo) is not the gun mid we are after either.

Absolutely we have a need for Marchbank. Do you want to rely on Rowe or Glass-McCasker to fill the other key posts next to Weitering? Do you want to make Plowman play tall for the next several years? Who else is there?

Tomlinson is one we would have use for. However, given he's been in and out of the side last year and this, a second round pick in a strong draft is a reasonable offer for him.

Others want him and know he is probably worth more.

The draft might be strong in terms of quantity of likely types. Not sure it is strong in terms of elite talent.

 

[Blue and Silver]

For those interested. AFL website has replay of Metro/Country game

http://www.afl.com.au/draft/u18s

 

[FlowersByIrene]

For those interested. AFL website has replay of Metro/Country game

http://www.afl.com.au/draft/u18s

Cheers, will definitely watch

 

[Blue and Silver]

Just finished watching the Vic M vs Vic C game

I'll offer a few opinions based on that, full disclaimer, just another punter, no special knowledge or experience:

Vic Metro:

Jordan Gallucci - Impressive player, not the outside runner I expected but a genuine mid. Good touch of the ball and a very good kick. Tackles well, but will need size at next level I would think

Dylan Clarke - I loved his brother, and I love him. Proper clearance mid, got his hands to it constantly and was working hard to keep Metro in it all game. Took an excellent one-hander in the goalsquare and converted.

Tim Taranto - I liked his game a lot. Has ability in close, but I was particularly impressed by how he hit the scoreboard and posed a threat up forward, in particular a ripper goal he kicked, collecting at pace and snapping truly.

Andrew McGrath - Was a bit quiet to start but burst unto the game in the latter half of the third and into the fourth. Had some Sam Docherty like moments where he marked going back courageously, and had a thrilling run and carry moment kicking in.


Vic Country:

Ben Ainsworth - Real jack in the box leap, goes straight up. Finished with 4.2, all of the goals coming in the third, but contested strongly and is a real marking threat. Made me think of Lindsay Thomas

Will Brodie - Bull of a player, plays good contested footy and wins the ball with consistency. Good on the outside and good instincts but an inside player for certain

Hugh McLuggage - Classy as ****. Just so good with ball in hand. Had an occasional ball fall short, but given the sheer amount of quality delivery he provided I think he can be excused.

Josh Battle - Not convinced. Looks slow off the mark, didn't impact game significantly and couldn't find much of the ball. I think this might be a consequence of the Championship "anti-density" rule, but Country had plenty of supply and he didn't see much of it.

Thomas Jok - Hard tackler, no-nonesense sort of meat and potatoes most of the time. Very good size for a mid, seems to have a good top-end pace, although looked a little slow to start at points. Got quite a bit of the ball through rebound and handball receives which speaks well of his tank.


Those were the main ones which stood out to me.

 

[zeeCFC]

Jok very fumbly, would be a great prospect if he was more a one touch player but still one that catches the eye with size and pace.

The big knock on Gallucci is his kicking and for a mid that we'd consider you'd like it to be at least above average. Looks to have improved a little but judging from things I've heard and read he'll need a large sample of good kicking to turn opinions of his kicking around.

Only watched the one game though so no point running through the other names. Just yet.

 

[HBF]

last year we were happy to move menzel henderson & yarran who had questionable commitment. everitt i put in the same boat and is easily covered

Not sure we'd get anything of value. Already at his 3rd club and everyone knows his weaknesses. He picks and chooses when he goes far to often.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

Not a fan of that rumour at all. We are in rebuild mode and giving away our top 2 picks for GWS rejects is unacceptable.

I would offer up our second rounder + another second rounder (from a trade) for Tomlinson and Marchbank. If they say no, well then it's their loss. Good luck fitting them all onto the list. I'd happily keep our second rounders and spend them along with our first rounder.

Silvagni will most likely take over Everitt's spot as you said. I wouldn't be against pick #23 + Everitt for a pick#15. Not a bad idea actually.

Structurally, we need Casboult in the side so we can't afford to offer him up just yet. IF he puts a good couple of season together this year and next, I can see a flag contender offering up their first rounder for him. If C.Curnow and McKay develop by then as planned, I would jump if offered a top 15 pick for him.

A 4 for 2 scenario with 4 blokes who are easily best 22 and fit areas of need is exactly what the rebuild needs imo. We'd all love to get Tomlinson and Marchbank for two second rounders but that's pie in the sky stuff.

I get why people see pick 5 or 6 and get concerned. But the reality there is still enormous uncertainty, even at that end of the draft. Marchbank is worth a mid-late first rounder imo, Tomlinson an early second. Steele is about the same as Tomlinson. Stewart, I don't know enough about. But the value from the other three alone is more than pick 5 and an early second when you take risk, uncertainty etc into account.

 

[1981]

Blue Fusion you make a valid point but likely other clubs will offer a higher pick which forces out hand.

I think the key here is getting 4 for 2. Like last year. It's a numbers game and SOS knows this.

Yes Marchbank etc aren't top 22 GWS but that's why you get 4 for 2. That appears to be the thinking anyway. I'm sure GWS know that in all likelihood all 4 will be good players for us.

 

[No1Suspect]

A 4 for 2 scenario with 4 blokes who are easily best 22 and fit areas of need is exactly what the rebuild needs imo. We'd all love to get Tomlinson and Marchbank for two second rounders but that's pie in the sky stuff.

I get why people see pick 5 or 6 and get concerned. But the reality there is still enormous uncertainty, even at that end of the draft. Marchbank is worth a mid-late first rounder imo, Tomlinson an early second. Steele is about the same as Tomlinson. Stewart, I don't know enough about. But the value from the other three alone is more than pick 5 and an early second when you take risk, uncertainty etc into account.

I'm not sure where Ahern sits in their thinking they are getting another couple of decent Mids this year again as well as Macreadie (KPD). Personally I'd float the original trade but ask for Ahern rather than Stewart. Young mid coming off a serious knee injury will probably be behind the 8 ball in trying to get back into the team, may want to come back to Vic. Would complement Steele in the trade as Ahern is a classy outside type with great skills and isn't slow. His value is probably worth significantly more than Stewart so it might take and extra 2nd round to obtain him.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

I'm not sure where Ahern sits in their thinking they are getting another couple of decent Mids this year again as well as Macreadie (KPD). Personally I'd float the original trade but ask for Ahern rather than Stewart. Young mid coming off a serious knee injury will probably be behind the 8 ball in trying to get back into the team, may want to come back to Vic. Would complement Steele in the trade as Ahern is a classy outside type with great skills and isn't slow. His value is probably worth significantly more than Stewart so it might take and extra 2nd round to obtain him.

Ive been anti Ahern in the past due to injury.

But if we got Marchbank, Tomlinson, Steele and Ahern - wowww

 

[No1Suspect]

Ive been anti Ahern in the past due to injury.

But if we got Marchbank, Tomlinson, Steele and Ahern - wowww

Yeah injury has put a massive ? On him, but I see him as a much bigger win than securing Stewart and also gives us 2 mids rather than the 1, also makes the deal and giving up our 1st pick a little more malleable

 

[Azul]

Midfielders!

Not sure the outlook on Foster and G-McC but another tall defender.

 

[1981]

Midfielders!

Not sure the outlook on Foster and G-McC but another tall defender.

You understand it.

To be honest, if the GWS 4 doesn't happen, I would be happy to cough up a second rounder plus change for Marchbank, and then use our first rounder this year and next year on the best available mid.

 

[HBF]

You understand it.

To be honest, if the GWS 4 doesn't happen, I would be happy to cough up a second rounder plus change for Marchbank, and then use our first rounder this year and next year on the best available mid.

We have to get Marchbank to choose us. Then we can offer our 2nd round pick and GWS can tell their story walking.

 

[ODNBlue]

We have to get Marchbank to choose us. Then we can offer our 2nd round pick and GWS can tell their story walking.

I'm not sure we'll be looking to slay the golden goose just yet...

 

[HBF]

I'm not sure we'll be looking to slay the golden goose just yet...

True, but of the 4 it's Marchbank I really want.
And they'll eventually stop being our development academy.