2017 Rising Star Discussion

[Love the Drake]

I don't think anyone is arguing that Burton, SPP or McGrath are better propositions for players long term than Curnow; it's just that the award is based upon the full year rather than star capability (see Bontempelli v Taylor).

Good point. Which is why most of us aren't too fussed who wins it. Just happy to have young guns in the ranks. This crop is looking exceptionally good.

Then theres 'the nator'..

 

[Buzzasto DaSilva]

Truly bizarre that Curnow is being spoken about as third or fourth.

I honestly have massive respect for Burton McGrath and SPP, they will all be very good to great players, Charlie on the other hand is potentially generational.

We can all roll our stats to support our favoured scenario, but for those who have actually watched Curnow is the very definition of a "Rising Star".

Bias yes, happy to acknowledge that, but I have not seen a better and more complete young talent in eons, I would expect those that are burdened with the responsibility of judging this award would do more than look at a couple of stats and would actually apply the eye test. In which case Curnow is in this up to his ears.


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Generational is a pretty big hyperbole. He's played 23 games. After 23 games Dangerfield looked like a schoolboy playing against men and Josh Kennedy was still not established. Yet, both have been arguably the best forward and midfielder over the past five years. Curnow has a mighty long way to go. Not saying he won't get there, he's had a very good 2017 but he can't be thought of at that level yet.

And my understanding is that the award is for sustained excellence, which is what Burton and McGrath have showed beyond Curnow. I'd probably have Petrevski-Seton ahead based on the entire season, but Curnow has had a very good year.

 

[blues4flag]

And my understanding is that the award is for sustained excellence, which is what Burton and McGrath have showed beyond Curnow. I'd probably have Petrevski-Seton ahead based on the entire season, but Curnow has had a very good year.

Burton has had the better body of work over the season. Curnow over the past 10 weeks has sustained a level of excellence that neither Burton nor McGrath have reached.

As impressive as SPS has been, Curnow's clearly been the better player.

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[RudyBlue]

I think Hawthorn and Carlton would be hoping Burton and Curnow can become big-bodied mids in time. Curnow is probably a bit more powerful in the contest whereas Burton has better vision and poise.

Curnow looks like he could develop into something like Fyfe/Kouta pre-knee.

Burton more of a silky Pendlebury type.

 

[Espio]

Generational is a pretty big hyperbole. He's played 23 games. After 23 games Dangerfield looked like a schoolboy playing against men and Josh Kennedy was still not established. Yet, both have been arguably the best forward and midfielder over the past five years. Curnow has a mighty long way to go. Not saying he won't get there, he's had a very good 2017 but he can't be thought of at that level yet.

And my understanding is that the award is for sustained excellence, which is what Burton and McGrath have showed beyond Curnow. I'd probably have Petrevski-Seton ahead based on the entire season, but Curnow has had a very good year.

Thus the word "potentially " in my original post.

The wording of the award is "standout young talent", it hasn't necessarily been applied that way, but here we are.


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[Lance Uppercut]

The award is for the "standout young player".

Of this group, based on that definition, it is difficult to argue Curnow is not right in it.


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it's still standout player over the year though, so it's undeniable that a level of consistency is required. Curnow will probably come 3rd or 4th but I doubt he'll win, simply on the fact his first half of the year wasn't up to scratch

 

[Buzzasto DaSilva]

Thus the word "potentially " in my original post.

The wording of the award is "standout young talent", it hasn't necessarily been applied that way, but here we are.


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James Aish is potentially a generational talent. We have no idea at this point of Curnow's career.

 

[Espio]

it's still standout player over the year though, so it's undeniable that a level of consistency is required. Curnow will probably come 3rd or 4th but I doubt he'll win, simply on the fact his first half of the year wasn't up to scratch

Any of the four could win it. I will applaud that kid honestly. These kids are that good it will mean more to the supporters than them I am sure. My conversation is more about semantics than anything. Charlie has been great and I am invested. Best of luck to all.



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[Lance Uppercut]

Any of the four could win it. I will applaud that kid honestly. These kids are that good it will mean more to the supporters than them I am sure. My conversation is more about semantics than anything. Charlie has been great and I am invested. Best of luck to all.



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agree, and whoever does win it will be eminently worthy. Having one of the kids in contention in your own team is just awesome in reality

 

[Coona Blues]

And my understanding is that the award is for sustained excellence, which is what Burton and McGrath have showed beyond Curnow. I'd probably have Petrevski-Seton ahead based on the entire season, but Curnow has had a very good year.

No doubt Burton, McGrath and SPP have had more consistent seasons, but with my Carlton glasses on,
I draw attention to a couple of years previously. Patrick Cripps clearly had the more consistent season,
and body of work, yet Hogan was given the gong. Hogan while quality, was not consistent, the old
line about key positions being harder to play was trotted out. Precedent has been set to bring Charlie
right in to calculation.

 

[Donakebab]

No doubt Burton, McGrath and SPP have had more consistent seasons, but with my Carlton glasses on,
I draw attention to a couple of years previously. Patrick Cripps clearly had the more consistent season,
and body of work, yet Hogan was given the gong. Hogan while quality, was not consistent, the old
line about key positions being harder to play was trotted out. Precedent has been set to bring Charlie
right in to calculation.

Except Hogan was super consistent. He kicked 44.19 with 12 GA's in his RS season, kicked multiple goals 14 times with a bag of 5 and 4 twice, while only being held goalless once. From the same amount of games Curnow has 18.11 with 10 GA's, has only managed to kick multiples on four occasions with each time only being a 2 goal haul and has been held goalless 6 times. First and foremost you want KPF's to have scoreboard impact, in this area the two are nowhere near comparable. Not sure where the precedent has been set given Hogan was great across the entire season while Curnow only strung his form together across half of one.

 

[Love the Drake]

No doubt Burton, McGrath and SPP have had more consistent seasons, but with my Carlton glasses on,
I draw attention to a couple of years previously. Patrick Cripps clearly had the more consistent season,
and body of work, yet Hogan was given the gong. Hogan while quality, was not consistent, the old
line about key positions being harder to play was trotted out. Precedent has been set to bring Charlie
right in to calculation.

This ^^^

 

[Holy Rioli]

How's Burton been tonight? Obviously haven't seen.

McGrath has been released up the ground and been pretty damn good

Burton was excellent, really the only one down back to show some composure for us tonight. Didn't lose a contest to Curnow either (and got him for holding the ball). Kicked a nice goal as well and linked up with Jaeger a couple of times as well.

 

[Holy Rioli]

I think Hawthorn and Carlton would be hoping Burton and Curnow can become big-bodied mids in time. Curnow is probably a bit more powerful in the contest whereas Burton has better vision and poise.

Curnow looks like he could develop into something like Fyfe/Kouta pre-knee.

Burton more of a silky Pendlebury type.

Exactly the reference I was going to make.

 

[Mr_Plow]

Burton was excellent, really the only one down back to show some composure for us tonight. Didn't lose a contest to Curnow either (and got him for holding the ball). Kicked a nice goal as well and linked up with Jaeger a couple of times as well.

Actually, Curnow's goal was a direct result of him losing Burton in traffic (who was ball-watching) and taking a contested mark in the goal square.

Burton was also beaten by Pickett in the air on his first goal, although that was largely due to poor communication with his teammate when they had to transition.

 

[Cynic]

So we've gone from stats to contests.

Does anyone know whose dad would beat up the other dads out of the four hopefuls?

 

[Mr_Plow]

Curnow has an 8 inch...





strand of hair.

 

[Sector 7G]

Except Hogan was super consistent. He kicked 44.19 with 12 GA's in his RS season, kicked multiple goals 14 times with a bag of 5 and 4 twice, while only being held goalless once. From the same amount of games Curnow has 18.11 with 10 GA's, has only managed to kick multiples on four occasions with each time only being a 2 goal haul and has been held goalless 6 times. First and foremost you want KPF's to have scoreboard impact, in this area the two are nowhere near comparable. Not sure where the precedent has been set given Hogan was great across the entire season while Curnow only strung his form together across half of one.

Cripps and Hogan were playing at a much higher level than any of the RS's this year. No one has said Curnow has had a better 2nd year than Hogan. To put it in perspective using the SC analysis (far from exact but gives some indication in the value of the stats) Cripps averaged 96SC points and Hogan averaged 83 which when adjusted by position is better than Cripps. Apply the same logic KPF being more difficult than being a 3 defender and CC would win the award.

 

[Benaly28]

1.Burton
2.Mcgrath
3.Curnow

 

[Cynic]

Curnow has an 8 inch...





strand of hair.

While he can't compete in lusciousness Burton is going for the ever popular haircut you can set your watch to.

 

[Old navy]

Generational is a pretty big hyperbole. He's played 23 games. After 23 games Dangerfield looked like a schoolboy playing against men and Josh Kennedy was still not established. Yet, both have been arguably the best forward and midfielder over the past five years. Curnow has a mighty long way to go. Not saying he won't get there, he's had a very good 2017 but he can't be thought of at that level yet.

And my understanding is that the award is for sustained excellence, which is what Burton and McGrath have showed beyond Curnow. I'd probably have Petrevski-Seton ahead based on the entire season, but Curnow has had a very good year.

I'd have SPS leading too, he spent a lot of time playing as a genuine midfielder, is a very classy player, has very good contested ball, tackle clearance numbers and can hit the scoreboard kicking 10 goals, even been BOG in some of the games we've won.
This kid had almost no preseason and it's his 1st year of AFL footy, going to be a super star player one day, watching him playing wet weather footy, he just looks a level above, just so clean and composed.

 

[JC Hawks]

Anyone know who the panel of judges are? I know Cameron Ling is one of them.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Anyone know who the panel of judges are? I know Cameron Ling is one of them.

Just so long as it's not Gerard -'pencil Joel Enright in 4 AA HBF, no matter what'- Healy'.

 

[Love the Drake]

Anyone know who the panel of judges are? I know Cameron Ling is one of them.

I hope richo and Dermie are..they both rave about Charlie..

 

[Suntory Boss Coffee]

The current selection panel includes AFL CEO Gillon McLachlan, AFL Football Operations Manager Mark Evans, AFL National Talent Manager Kevin Sheehan and former players Kevin Bartlett, Luke Darcy, Danny Frawley, Glen Jakovich, Cameron Ling, Matthew Richardson and Warren Tredrea