List Mgmt. 2018 St Kilda Trade Thread Part 3

[StCicatriz]

i really dont care about the cash we pay for players... the club have shown post GT that they can manage the player payments fairly well to meet the AFL obligations so what we pay the player isnt my concern , what i want is the club to build the best list it can for the money it has available building that list is the key to success... we can debate til the cows come home about Richo as coach but its not going to change the fact he is here with us for at least one more season, you dont have to like that but i would suggest making peace with it cause its not likely to change ..
this season was a perfect storm of crapness for us , we had a tough draw, injurys to the guys we could least afford to lose and we had poor form/ down years from pretty much everyone on field (except a handful) .
now i get the frustrations and ultimately it lands on the club for the poor season but I do have faith (maybe misguided) that the club realise where things went wrong and while some of the issues are going to take time to rectify we have already seen some swift moves made to change the club dynamic away from this years shitshow ...
the issue i keep hearing from contacts on why the club is not being talked as the destination club with players is not the money , we are offering good deals... the issue is there is a perception that as a club we are selling a dream that is very attractive to players but until there is a bit more proof to the dream being reality its still seen as only talk and no action... i think we are getting closer to the club walking the talk but we are still a fair way behind a Hawthorn ...
this to me is why a season like this year really hurts us as a club - if we lose members then we are further away from becoming like the clubs like hawthorn.. the members are angry and want blood but if we go through another cull our reputation inside the footy industry (not in the members eyes who have differant priorities) is tarnished and the "walking the talk" become further from the truth...
so we are in a tough spot .. we go sack happy we throw away the reputation and that hurts the club attracting players ... we dont do a cull the members want blood and feel we are sitting on our hands so dont renew and that hurts the club not being able to attract players ...
so as a club we are toeing a line to stay stable enough to keep our rep but also cull enough to satisfythe members... its a tight edge to walk

Clubs said the same to me "we can't have open speculation on the senior coach because then our existing players won't want to stay and the players we want to attract to our club won't want to either but if richo doesn't play finals next year he's gone"

The problem with that view is if I know that now then the players and their managers sure know it. We are not attractive now because everyone knows we aren't playing finals and the coach will be sacked. They know it's another 12 months of speculation and fall out. They know it's a long road back to finals. So they're better off going to a club with a better history of making it. A better football dept.

We would have been better placed ripping off the band aid than slowly tearing it off. Sure we bust up this trade period which is already written off but it means we give our selves the best chance possible in the next off Season.

I worry about the OOC players next year. Gonna get messy.

 

[stavro#4]

So - and please don’t think this is gospel.

But people are talking utter shit when it comes to saying the saints are less then 50-50 or whatever percent they throw at it.

The player has to be interested in us for us to sit down and offer them a deal firstly. Clubs don’t waste time talking figures if they aren’t a fair way down the road and them and the player aren’t on the same page.

Secondly we are reportedly offering pick 4. So again we are that far down the track we have approached gws with a deal structure which implies Shiel being keen. The order as how a few footballers put it to me is that clubs agree for you to talk to their player. The player then agrees to the financial package. Clubs then agree to a deal.

So either, he isn’t interested and we haven’t offered this monster deal.

Or

He is keen we have offered the deal and his manager has advised us to talk with gws about the deal. Which implies a Carlisle situation whereby he might be keen on club a but if club b can do a deal he will also go there.

 

[Indie Rock]

So from what I gather Sheil is overrated by some people and we don't want.

So that makes, Fyfe and Gaff from last year, Hannebery, Kent, and Sheil this year by some people and not others, also some people may feel Shiel is over rated and not Fyfe or Gaff etc..

FMD, no wonder STKFC supporters are known to embrace mediocrity by some people.

some people Complain we never land anyone, some people complain when we do, some people complain when we try.

Really the mentality reeks loser.
Give it a fecking go FFS.

People prefer Whitfield. Yeah so I prefer Pendles and Mitchell, so what, they aren't available.

Wake up fools that have a different opinion to me.

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EFA

This whole taking one opinion of a few posters and making out that it is the opinion of the entire board can be nauseating.

 

[crasha301]

Sheil, hanners, Steven, Steele, gresh, Clarke makes a nice midfield.

Trade Ross to GC. Keep armo for depth and back up.

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[DarkSaint]

Know one really knows have far we are into certain deals until everything is done and dusted or the club leaks it 24 hours before the big announcement.

What I will say is we have given north shit over the last couple of years by throwing everything at Elite players (Kelly,Martin etc) and been ridiculed from pillar to post.

If they happen to land Gaff we will be that laughing stock and deservedly so. This years season has killed us in more ways than one.

 

[Saint_Matt]

If Shiel wants to come then we get it done. I'd rather pay pick 4 for him than another key forward at the draft that could be anything or nothing. Maybe we will save ourselves from another mistake at the draft. Money shouldn't be an issue for anybody considering our cap space and lack of stars.

 

[lewdogs]

What we are hoping is that Dylan emulates the words to an old Ben Folds song...

"Money talks
I hate to listen
But lately it's been screaming in my ear."

 

[triggering bro]

The Saints are a basket case offering big dollars & still can’t attract talent narrative sells clicks. I wouldn’t bother listening to too much coming from the media. It wouldn’t be that plain & simple.

 

[D2D3]

Our midfield on paper with Shiel (and Hanners)

CL: Steven - Steele - Ross
RR: Longer/Hickey - Hannebery - Shiel

Hawks on paper with Shiel:

CL: Shiels - Mitchell - Smith
RR: McEvoy - O'Meara - Shiel

Pretty close I reckon.

 

[StCicatriz]

Trade radio discussing shiel situation now

 

[SaintersUnite]

Pick 25 (Carlton) > Dunstan
Hanners, Pick 30 > Pick 25, Newnes
Shiel, Setterfield > 2019 first round, Longer, Pick 57
Kent > Pick 61

In: Hannebery, Shiel, Kent, Setterfield, Pick 30
Out: Pick 61, Pick 57, 2019 first, Newnes, Longer, Dunstan

Draft: 4, 30, 63, 75

Use 63 and 75 to upgrade Pierce and Marshall to the senior list. Draft Rankine or Smith with 4 and someone with 30.

Team:
Geary Austin Roberton
Webster Carlisle Coffield
Ross Hannebery Shiel
Billings Bruce Membrey
Gresham Marshall Lonie
Hickey Steele Steven

Setterfield, Acres, Clarke, Kent

Develop the drafties in the VFL unless they bolt straight onto the scene.

**I’m in wonderland fellas come join me**

 

[StCicatriz]

Let's say shiel happens and it's for this years first and next years with maybe a 2nd or something coming back

How do people see the midfield lining up with shiel and hanners at the club

Do we think we could get aggressive with someone like Dunstan or even armitage where he's moved for basically nothing?

 

[triggering bro]

Trade radio touched on what I’ve been banging on about for a while now. Of course a bit a mayo was put on cos I was on the main D&T board having a laugh.

Shiel contracted limits his ability to move to his prefered club. Of course Shiel when nominating a club will say his preference is x club but in reality backroom negotiations b/w player, manager & club would have settled on a ‘preference’ that suits all parties & y club will not be known. As such, the club with the ability & willingness to trade the chips GWS demand will obtain Shiel next year & beyond.

Hawks don’t have the picks, Carlton will not trade pick 1 nor will GWS accept a future pick & the Bombers are not in the conversation because their offer to Shiel is unacceptable.

Welcome to the StK FC club Dylan Shiel.

According to McClure the Saints have pick 4 on the table. Seems their strategy is to satisfy the Giants in a trade, which may help broker a deal b/w the three parties (Saints, Giants & player). The Giants may hold Sheil to his contract if he chooses a club that isn’t willing or cannot satisfy the Giants in a trade.

 

[triggering bro]

Let's say shiel happens and it's for this years first and next years with maybe a 2nd or something coming back

How do people see the midfield lining up with shiel and hanners at the club

Do we think we could get aggressive with someone like Dunstan or even armitage where he's moved for basically nothing?

Shiel, Steele & Steven starting centre bounce mids.

Hanners wing/half back flank.

Ross, Acres, Gresh & Clark mid rotations.

Armo at Sandy.

 

[CaptainRisky]

700k a year was his last contract

If that's true , he is getting ripped , id be mighty pissed if Sheil came in on 1.2 if i was Jack

 

[SaintersUnite]

If that's true , he is getting ripped , id be mighty pissed if Sheil came in on 1.2 if i was Jack

I doubt Jack would give a rats ass what anyone at the club was being paid, he’s there because he wants to win. Getting in players of Shiel’s quality would be making him jump with joy more than anything.

 

[St Kilda Death]

I for one find Sheil vastly overrated.
Can think of 20 mids id rather get.

That said, he is a good player. Straight into our starting midfield and make us a better team, no doubt about it.

If we've asked dusty, fyfe, gaff, and they said no, if sheil is best we can get, get it done. No matter the price.
(I would only hope gaff gets the same offer)

If we offer a fortune and he doesn't come... Well guess what? We didnt offer enough.

 

[TheJackal]

I find it fascinating that St Kilda and the Giants are in the same predicament, just conversely.

The Giants don't 'have to' trade out a player but are chosing to because they are sick of constantly putting off contracts for future years to fit in the cap max.

Saints however are the opposite, we are sick of bringing forward contracts to pay the minimum cap and are looking to spend spend spend.

Means very little, but I just find that it's a nice little correlation of how the cap should work.

Now, has Laverde signed yet?

 

[STK2020]

Dylan Shiel is contracted ?
I think we would hold all the cards ?
1 .money
2. Pick 4
GWS would want highest pick possible and if Shiel doesn’t wanna go , he will see out his contract in an awkward environment.

 

[TheJackal]

I doubt Jack would give a rats ass what anyone at the club was being paid, he’s there because he wants to win. Getting in players of Shiel’s quality would be making him jump with joy more than anything.

Imagine Stuv warming up for a match realising he wasn't going to get beaten up with the heavy tag that day. Happy as a pig in you know what I'd say.

 

[CaptainRisky]

I doubt Jack would give a rats ass what anyone at the club was being paid, he’s there because he wants to win. Getting in players of Shiel’s quality would be making him jump with joy more than anything.

So some bloke comes to work with you and your a better worker and he is near on double your salary , you dont mind ? Bulls---t
Anyway how would you know what Jacks thinking , just a question

 

[Keg on legs]

Shiel (and gaff's) manager on trade radio after 11. Should be interesting

 

[Mikka84]

What we are hoping is that Dylan emulates the words to an old Ben Folds song...

"Money talks
I hate to listen
But lately it's been screaming in my ear."

Shiel’s a brick and I’m drowning slowly...

 

[Joffaboy]

So you dont believe Barrett when he said the preference is hawthorn and Essendon?

I don't know why Shiel is meeting with the saints. It's the first I've heard it. Where was that reported? It's interesting given Barrett thinks we aren't even a 50/50 chance of landing him.

No I don't believe anything until it h happens.
I don't believe Barrett, I don't believe managers or players or anyone at else this time of the season.

What I don't do is spin speculative radio conversations so I can forward an agenda on the club.

As for reports on Sheil meeting the club, why do you care? Reports are anything you want it to be.

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[STK2020]

So some bloke comes to work with you and your a better worker and he is near on double your salary , you dont mind ? Bulls---t
Anyway how would you know what Jacks thinking , just a question