Discussion 2021 General AFL Discussion

[St Kilda Death]

Who cares if we move to tassie or Timbuktoo
Can’t go to dock lands these days anyway

That's probably a bit unfair, even if he's able to delegate well that's still a good coach. I think there is a bit of luck to timing and lists that all good coaches need but he's not arsed a few flags. Richmond actually took the best of the pressure and surge game plan that we beat them with under Richo. He just had better players to execute it.

A lot of people see Richmond as a systems side that don't require good players to execute the game plan. This isn't true, their system hides how good their individuals are but they are struggling because a lot of their best players are injured and too many younger or inexperienced players are having to step up.

I don't think this group can win another premiership, guys like Riewoldt who are absolutely stars are getting towards the end. They aren't easy to find replacements for and they'll struggle once that generation goes.

It will be interesting to see how Ross Lyon goes at Carlton. I reckon they play finals next year, their list looks quite good with some stars, depth and developing talent. I reckon they could be a surprise packet next year. RL times his runs better than any one.

ross will get that team humming.
Lots of talent there underachieving.

 

[Sully111]

That's probably a bit unfair, even if he's able to delegate well that's still a good coach. I think there is a bit of luck to timing and lists that all good coaches need but he's not arsed a few flags. Richmond actually took the best of the pressure and surge game plan that we beat them with under Richo. He just had better players to execute it.

A lot of people see Richmond as a systems side that don't require good players to execute the game plan. This isn't true, their system hides how good their individuals are but they are struggling because a lot of their best players are injured and too many younger or inexperienced players are having to step up.

I don't think this group can win another premiership, guys like Riewoldt who are absolutely stars are getting towards the end. They aren't easy to find replacements for and they'll struggle once that generation goes.

It will be interesting to see how Ross Lyon goes at Carlton. I reckon they play finals next year, their list looks quite good with some stars, depth and developing talent. I reckon they could be a surprise packet next year. RL times his runs better than any one.

I'd like to see what Lyon could do with our list

 

[St Kilda Death]

B. Astbury, Grimes, Houli.
M. Dusty, Cotchin,
F. Lesser Reiwoldt, Edwards.

the linchpins of the tiger dynasty.
All the wrong side of 30 now.

add to that Prestia 29 with the body of a 40yo.
Rance left, lost a lot of their good depth (Higgins, Butler, Ellis)
Important B graders caddy and lambert are about finished.
Nank can’t stay on the park.

cooked IMO
Maurice jr should have chose freo.

 

[plugger66]

I'd like to see what Lyon could do with our list

Well you won’t.

 

[gringo2011]

B. Astbury, Grimes, Houli.
M. Dusty, Cotchin,
F. Lesser Reiwoldt, Edwards.

the linchpins of the tiger dynasty.
All the wrong side of 30 now.

add to that Prestia 29 with the body of a 40yo.
Rance left, lost a lot of their good depth (Higgins, Butler, Ellis)
Important B graders caddy and lambert are about finished.
Nank can’t stay on the park.

cooked IMO
Maurice jr should have chose freo.

Houli was an absolute architect of that side and time has caught up with him. So many games we lost to them were Houli ripping us apart on the counter attack. You'd kick it in and he'd intercept and set up a goal the other end with his elite distribution. He'd just see the game unfold in front of him.

Grimes is probably one of the most underrated defenders in history too. Can do it all and has a bit of Matthew Scarlett about him. Hardly anyone gets the better of him no matter what size they are. Edwards more irreplaceable than Cotchin IMO.

But yeah, they are cooked. That's a very hard group to replace.

 

[Joffaboy]

Coaches are overrated.

You don't have the cattle, you don't win much.
Has Clarko suddenly become a bad coach? Jeans going to Richmond, Malthouse and Pagan at Carlton?
You have the cattle and you have the structure around you and you are good during the week and competent on game day, you will go ok.

 

[gringo2011]

Coaches are overrated.

You don't have the cattle, you don't win much.
Has Clarko suddenly become a bad coach? Jeans going to Richmond, Malthouse and Pagan at Carlton?
You have the cattle and you have the structure around you and you are good during the week and competent on game day, you will go ok.

100% true but you can be a shit coach with a good list too. You can't help but wonder what GWS would have looked like with a Ross Lyon type of high expectation, no bullshit coach. Probably would have allowed them to keep players and stay competitive. Carlton will be a great test case. Externally their list looks good but they look mentally weak and a bit lazy. Lyon looks the perfect fit.

Lists make coaches but coaches can waste lists as well.

Melbourne Storm show just how much coaching can do. How they can move out stars and bring in youth who not only cover the loss but seems to improve them is hard to fathom.

 

[Mowman]

100% true but you can be a sh*t coach with a good list too. You can't help but wonder what GWS would have looked like with a Ross Lyon type of high expectation, no bullshit coach. Probably would have allowed them to keep players and stay competitive. Carlton will be a great test case. Externally their list looks good but they look mentally weak and a bit lazy. Lyon looks the perfect fit.

Lists make coaches but coaches can waste lists as well.

Melbourne Storm show just how much coaching can do. How they can move out stars and bring in youth who not only cover the loss but seems to improve them is hard to fathom.

Was Ross the boss that good he had 2 great list ?

 

[Dr Spaceman]

I'd like to see what Lyon could do with our list

 

[Mowman]

100% true but you can be a sh*t coach with a good list too. You can't help but wonder what GWS would have looked like with a Ross Lyon type of high expectation, no bullshit coach. Probably would have allowed them to keep players and stay competitive. Carlton will be a great test case. Externally their list looks good but they look mentally weak and a bit lazy. Lyon looks the perfect fit.

Lists make coaches but coaches can waste lists as well.

Melbourne Storm show just how much coaching can do. How they can move out stars and bring in youth who not only cover the loss but seems to improve them is hard to fathom.

Storm have the best coach of any club or sport in the country i have seen, he demands excellence and no one comes before the team he turns ordinary players into very good players.just listen players that leave all say how great the club and culture is and how they don’t want to leave

 

[Sully111]

Was Ross the boss that good he had 2 great list ?

I think he's a very good coach

I remember when games wouldn't be going our way and he'd turn it around at half time frequently. I just trusted him. Haven't felt that way since.

Pav says he's the best coach he ever played under. I know many Saints players who played under him rate him highly.

Reckon he'll kill it at Carlton

Would swap Ratts for RTB in a heartbeat

 

[Joffaboy]

100% true but you can be a sh*t coach with a good list too. You can't help but wonder what GWS would have looked like with a Ross Lyon type of high expectation, no bullshit coach. Probably would have allowed them to keep players and stay competitive. Carlton will be a great test case. Externally their list looks good but they look mentally weak and a bit lazy. Lyon looks the perfect fit.

Lists make coaches but coaches can waste lists as well.

Melbourne Storm show just how much coaching can do. How they can move out stars and bring in youth who not only cover the loss but seems to improve them is hard to fathom.

Personally reckon RTB would have been way too much for a fledgling club full of kids.
He needs a very experienced core group to mould the team around.
Yes would be a great fit for Carlton.

Bellamy is amazing. Thought he was good but had Slater, Smith and Cronk, but they are gone and he just brings in blokes who play their role and blokes like Grant and Smith as halves. Papenhauzen comes in and we say Billy who? He goes down and Nico Hines comes in like he had been the fullback for years.
The club is amazing and Bellamy is unbelievable.

 

[gringo2011]

Was Ross the boss that good he had 2 great list ?

Still straightened two lists up. He probably weakened ours on paper and replaced them with role players with work ethic. He definitely needs the lists but he's a pro and won't accept a lack of effort. He got two sides to the big dance and both where a whisker off winning one.

 

[Mowman]

Still straightened two lists up. He probably weakened ours on paper and replaced them with role players with work ethic. He definitely needs the lists but he's a pro and won't accept a lack of effort. He got two sides to the big dance and both where a whisker off winning one.

Agree

 

[Plugger35]

Ross is a good coach but some of his selections were questionable.

He seemed to be the only person that thought that Robert Eddy

Robert Eddy

Age

37

Ht

182cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.6

3star

K

5.7

2star

HB

5.9

4star

M

3.5

4star

T

3.5

5star

CL

0.8

3star

No current season stats available

D

12.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.0

4star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.6

5star

was an AFL standard footballer, no surprise he was delisted shortly after Ross left.

 

[StFly]

RTB is great for his focus, not great for anything that is not his focus though, you want him to make a pony it'll have 4 legs and look a bit lopsided.
Blues as a club intrinsically know they've under-achieved, but are largely blind that they have anything to do with it.

Say in a different universe, Richo goes to Brissie and we get Fagan instead, sure, 3 years diff but that only puts him during Hawks 3 peat and new horizons push, so say we suffer with Watters longer than we did or shook him loose earlier, this iteration of Ratts would look much much much different.

Instead, we go "we need to develop" and Brissie got journeyman multi role coach guy to straighten them up, we later try and grab Bevo to do the same to us, and here we are, umming and aahing about our coaching divisions with Lethers and Rath.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Who cares if we move to tassie or Timbuktoo
Can’t go to dock lands these days anyway

ross will get that team humming.
Lots of talent there underachieving.

We should keep an eye out on disgruntled young players too

 

[plugger66]

Ross is a good coach but some of his selections were questionable.

He seemed to be the only person that thought that Robert Eddy was an AFL standard footballer, no surprise he was delisted shortly after Ross left.

Before.

 

[Plugger35]

Before.

His last year on our list was 2011 which was also Ross Lyon's last year as our coach.

 

[plugger66]

His last year on our list was 2011 which was also Ross Lyon's last year as our coach.

Yep but he retired straight after the last game before we knew Lyon was leaving.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Ross is a good coach but some of his selections were questionable.

He seemed to be the only person that thought that Robert Eddy was an AFL standard footballer, no surprise he was delisted shortly after Ross left.

I think it finally sunk into Lyon's thick scull when Rob only got 5 disposals in the Grand Final replay.
He was delisted, but then retained on the rookie list. But he never got another game.

 

[L_W_P]

Having an odd amount of teams is crap. If a 19th team is added, then a 20th team also needs to come in.

Why would 20 be so much better than 19?

Sure, you have 10 games every week, but what do you do with your fixture? Everyone play once? 9 home, 9 away, 1 "neutral"?

I guess that could work. Would just have to ensure that the neutral venue games really were such.

Where would you base Team 20? I've seen people talk about both Cairns & the "Perth Royal Falcons" before.

 

[Plugger35]

Yep but he retired straight after the last game before we knew Lyon was leaving.

Lyon knew he was leaving well before the rest of us did.

I think it finally sunk into Lyon's thick scull when Rob only got 5 disposals in the Grand Final replay.
He was delisted, but then retained on the rookie list. But he never got another game.

What made it even worse was that he played Eddy in the GF replay when he had a broken hand, even fully fit he was a spud so why play him injured?

Armitage or Steven would have been better options although with how badly we went in the replay it probably wouldn't have made much difference.

 

[plugger66]

Lyon knew he was leaving well before the rest of us did.



What made it even worse was that he played Eddy in the GF replay when he had a broken hand, even fully fit he was a spud so why play him injured?

Armitage or Steven would have been better options although with how badly we went in the replay it probably wouldn't have made much difference.

Steven had bad op.

 

[BrutThough]

Why would 20 be so much better than 19?

Sure, you have 10 games every week, but what do you do with your fixture? Everyone play once? 9 home, 9 away, 1 "neutral"?

I guess that could work. Would just have to ensure that the neutral venue games really were such.

Where would you base Team 20? I've seen people talk about both Cairns & the "Perth Royal Falcons" before.

The floating bye is crap. No club would want to be the team stuck with the rd1 bye. Or having the bye in rd22 when you know you cant make finals then coming back for 1 meaningless game.

Competition having an event amount of teams is just better symmetry.

There isn't anywhere to put a 20th team which is one of the reasons why I don't think Tassie should be added.