Opinion 2021 Non-Crows AFL 3: Things Fall Apart!

[Crow till I die]

Your view of success in the AFL landscape is a little old fashioned.

Craig was a very good AFL coach. Couple of small things go different(Roo getting Parvo /roo getting suspended / cousins on crack) and we are perhaps talking about a completely different legacy.

This sport is a game of inches. You think we talk about Blight in the same light if Libba's goal stands with 10 minutes to go in that 97 prelim? I certainly don't.

Dont forget that wce midfield were drug fuelled

 

[1970crow]

Think you have finally lost the plot old fella.

The 2017 success was a direct result of the system and people we put in place at the end of 2014.

The failings we had as a club post September 2017 do not eradicate the correct things we did between 2014-2017.

"success"? And you reckon I've lost the plot. It was those people that destroyed the club and won us our first spoon. They had 2 decent years. It just happened that in 2017 15 wins got you top spot. We won 2 home finals and fell apart half way through the GF. The decisions made previously then resulted in the total dysfunction that ensued.

 

[1970crow]

Your view of success in the AFL landscape is a little old fashioned.

Craig was a very good AFL coach. Couple of small things go different(Roo getting Parvo /roo getting suspended / cousins on crack) and we are perhaps talking about a completely different legacy.

This sport is a game of inches. You think we talk about Blight in the same light if Libba's goal stands with 10 minutes to go in that 97 prelim? I certainly don't.

then so is Kenny.

 

[1970crow]

By your logic the failings post September 2017 were also a result of the people we put in place at the end of 2014.

Because they were the same people

how can he not see that.

 

[AFC979810]

By your logic the failings post September 2017 were also a result of the people we put in place at the end of 2014.

Because they were the same people

Absolutely. I addressed this in the original post.

I can make it a little simpler for ya mate:

Those people from 2014 - 2nd quarter of grand final - GOOD

Those people from Sept 2017 onwards - BAD.

Things change. The AFL landscape is not black and white. This isn't the corporate world where everyone can be successful. There are 17 losers and 1 winner.

Its all about putting yourself in the window and giving yourself the best chance of success.

 

[Crow till I die]

"success"? And you reckon I've lost the plot. It was those people that destroyed the club and won us our first spoon. They had 2 decent years. It just happened that in 2017 15 wins got you top spot. We won 2 home finals and fell apart half way through the GF. The decisions made previously then resulted in the total dysfunction that ensued.

And there is the rub. Had it resulted in a flag in 2017 in liue of the GF loss, the entire narrative changes. You go all in for a flag and anything after getting it is a footnote and worth it. You come up just short and it looks like a sh1tshow when it then fell apart

 

[1970crow]

I never said they were on the edge of a cliff like the Cats, but Boak, Gray & Dixon are key contributors that they need their output replacing.

I don't think Dixon's output was too involved in getting them to a prelim this year and Robbie missed a block, but he was otherwise pretty handy. Boak was the only one that delivered week in and week out. Remove Tex from our early season form and we're 3 wins short. I think the key is bringing Rozee into the midfield group and transitioning Boak and Gray out. Dixon is nearing a liability and Jonas is easily replaced.

 

[AFC979810]

then so is Kenny.

So the only good coaches are premiership winners?

But yeah - I think history will look back on Kenny pretty favorably. Took over a power side that won a combined 8 games between 2011 and 2012 and has coached 203 games for 121 wins. Of the 30 coaches in AFL history who have coached 200+ games he is 6th in winning percentage. Lost Two prelims by a kick or less to dynasty clubs who went on to win the flag and then got blown out in his 3rd prelim. Not bad at all in my book.

But then again - I doubt this resonates with you. You seem to be one of those deep thinkers that says if you don't win the flag you are a shit.

 

[1970crow]

And there is the rub. Had it resulted in a flag in 2017 in liue of the GF loss, the entire narrative changes. You go all in for a flag and anything after getting it is a footnote and worth it. You come up just short and it looks like a sh1tshow when it then fell apart

It was the character flaws of the Pyke's, Burton's and campos that destroyed it though. They destroyed the group with their attempt to fix what they believed was the sole reason for the loss. Every year a team loses a GF, how many totally shit the bed in the manner we did? Pies have equaled our bed shitting, but as a result of blowing their cap. We destroyed trust and relationships.

 

[1970crow]

Your view of success in the AFL landscape is a little old fashioned.

Craig was a very good AFL coach. Couple of small things go different(Roo getting Parvo /roo getting suspended / cousins on crack) and we are perhaps talking about a completely different legacy.

This sport is a game of inches. You think we talk about Blight in the same light if Libba's goal stands with 10 minutes to go in that 97 prelim? I certainly don't.

ultimately, there are successful coaches and unsuccessful coaches. When you get 10 years at the one club and don't build that into a couple of genuine flag opportunities, then you're a failure. Many coaches get cut off before that. By your metrics, Teague will be looked back on as a successful coach.

 

[AFC979810]

"success"? And you reckon I've lost the plot. It was those people that destroyed the club and won us our first spoon. They had 2 decent years. It just happened that in 2017 15 wins got you top spot. We won 2 home finals and fell apart half way through the GF. The decisions made previously then resulted in the total dysfunction that ensued.

2017 wasn't successful?

You telling me right now that you ask 18 clubs right now if they wouldn't take being up 26 - 15 at qtr time of a grand final. What more can a club do?

Sure it didn't go our way and we royally shat the bed afterward - but you simply cannot fault the club in the lead up to it.

As a club - our build up to 2017 was far better than our dream runs in 97/98.

 

[Scorpus]

2017 wasn't successful?

You telling me right now that you ask 18 clubs right now if they wouldn't take being up 26 - 15 at qtr time of a grand final. What more can a club do?

Win the grand final?

 

[Rotayjay]

not normally a betting man but just took a Power nuffie on for $100 that Crows won't win spoon in 2022

Even if we finish 17th, $100 to me

Just don't see us spooning it

What a stupid bet for that person to make. Almost impossible for you to lose.

 

[Crow till I die]

It was the character flaws of the Pyke's, Burton's and campos that destroyed it though. They destroyed the group with their attempt to fix what they believed was the sole reason for the loss. Every year a team loses a GF, how many totally sh*t the bed in the manner we did? Pies have equaled our bed shitting, but as a result of blowing their cap. We destroyed trust and relationships.

No arguments from me. Just that had we won in 2017, the fallout would be looked at in a different light because the end justifies the means

 

[AFC979810]

ultimately, there are successful coaches and unsuccessful coaches. When you get 10 years at the one club and don't build that into a couple of genuine flag opportunities, then you're a failure. Many coaches get cut off before that. By your metrics, Teague will be looked back on as a successful coach.

Wow. Really?

In no way do any of the metrics I brought up have anything to do with Teague being a successful coach.

David Teague - 50 games. 21 wins. Winning 42% of games. No Finals.

And Port had 2 genuine flag cracks. 2014 / 2020. Losing by a kick to the eventual premier in a prelim constitutes a flag crack in my book.

Your thinking is a little one dimensional and lacks depth. But that's okay.

 

[1970crow]

No arguments from me. Just that had we won in 2017, the fallout would be looked at in a different light because the end justifies the means

But we didn't win because they refused to prepare a group for a tilt, instead focussing on the continuity that comes with playing as few players as possible. A trophy we did win. They failed at strategy and then failed to correctly dtermine why we couldn't keep up with Richmond for 4 quarters.

 

[AFC979810]

Win the grand final?

What can a club do?

There is a point where its up to the players. When a club and players are at a point where they have a lead at qtr time of a grand final - it is what it is.

I can't fault the club for 2017. IMO were the best team that year. Losing Brodie Smith/McGovern was a massive blow for us, but we were beaten by a better team on the day. That happens in sport.

 

[AFC979810]

But we didn't win because they refused to prepare a group for a tilt, instead focussing on the continuity that comes with playing as few players as possible. A trophy we did win. They failed at strategy and then failed to correctly dtermine why we couldn't keep up with Richmond for 4 quarters.

Let this post be a lesson for us all. Senility is a horrible affliction.

Go back and watch the 2017 prelim. We were primed.

Its sport mate. Sometimes you just lose. Sometimes ya need a bit of luck. Sometimes there are no right answers.

 

[Dirty Bird]

I'm just creating a 2022 fixture atm, but screw the AFL agreements

I have to move 1 game from the MCG (or GMHBA ) to Marvel Stadium just to meet contract requirements

 

[Crow till I die]

But we didn't win because they refused to prepare a group for a tilt, instead focussing on the continuity that comes with playing as few players as possible. A trophy we did win. They failed at strategy and then failed to correctly dtermine why we couldn't keep up with Richmond for 4 quarters.

I see it differently. We worked our way up to the GF off the back of finals the previous seasons..2017 we easily beat GWS in the qualifying final then belted Geelong in the prelim. We also towelled richmond earlier in that season so we had no reason to think we were on the wrong path and then the stars aligned for richmond..cotchin and edwards? Both cleared in the gf leadup when both should have been suspended, multiple vic umps thqt gave them an armchair ride on the day and getting to play the game on their home deck. We couldnt put enough distance between us and them in tge first half on the back of dead set cheating by the umps then we dropped the bundle in the second half. We were close..very close and had it gone differently i could not have cared about the fallout as its all about winning the flag. That we didnt magnified everything and the rest is history. That is how i see it

 

[1970crow]

Let this post be a lesson for us all. Senility is a horrible affliction.

Go back and watch the 2017 prelim. We were primed.

Its sport mate. Sometimes you just lose. Sometimes ya need a bit of luck. Sometimes there are no right answers.

GFs aren't played at night on Adelaide Oval. Yes, we were primed and had a 22 that could heat Cats at home, but that doesn't win you the cup.

Let this be a lesson for us all, some people are incapable of thinking any deeper than what is bleedingly obvious.

 

[1970crow]

Let this post be a lesson for us all. Senility is a horrible affliction.

Go back and watch the 2017 prelim. We were primed.

Its sport mate. Sometimes you just lose. Sometimes ya need a bit of luck. Sometimes there are no right answers.

In a few posts you'll be telling me how we had Tigers' measure having blown them away in the ladt 3 quarters in round 5 or 6. Such is your depth of thought.

 

[AFC979810]

GFs aren't played at night on Adelaide Oval. Yes, we were primed and had a 22 that could heat Cats at home, but that doesn't win you the cup.

Let this be a lesson for us all, some people are incapable of thinking any deeper than what is bleedingly obvious.

Love to hear what we could have done different going into grand final day.

 

[AFC979810]

In a few posts you'll be telling me how we had Tigers' measure having blown them away in the ladt 3 quarters in round 5 or 6. Such is your depth of thought.

This is the 2nd time you have tried to tell me what I will be saying next. I don't think Teague is a good coach. I don't think I would say the above.

Its very unfortunate. I haven't been on here in a while, but I remember you used to post insightful commentary. Not sure if I am confusing you with another poster or whether you have just rapidly declined. Either way its a sad situation.

 

[Scorpus]

Love to hear what we could have done different going into grand final day.

So what you're saying is there is absolutely nothing we could have done any better to get us the win.

That we were always going to lose because nothing more could have been done at any stage.

I'm sorry, but that's not true