List Mgmt. 2023 List Management and Trading

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Mostyn said:
Sorry, but actual game time in the reserves is FAR more valuable for the development of a young player than sitting twiddling their thumbs as a sub.
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I just hope the coaches take note of the word tactical in tactical sub and the days of using cripples, duds and imminent delistees are behind us.
 
Mostyn said:
I'm actually arguing that you're being completely over the top. The club gave fewer games to Worrell than you would have liked, but he still got enough games to know he belonged at the higher level.

The club prioritised some mature heads in defense and you wouldn't have. They kept playing a player with a niggle.

Ultimately, I just think you're carrying on over something that isn't that big a deal. And I say that mostly agreeing with you.
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Having Doedee behind on his preseason just to get some late season games in is pretty silly though. If we were contending, sure, but given we weren’t, just don’t see the sense behind it.
 
AFC979810 said:
Except Berry didn't do that his first season. Berry has played 35 of a possible 44 games including the first 5 games of his rookie season.

To suggest that Berry was put into the SANFL for development and to learn to be the #1 player at his best position complete bullshit - He was dropped for Matt Crouch.

EDIT - What makes it even worse is that the SANFL didn't even play the first two weeks of the season. So our development plan must have been to have Berry play 17 games in his first year at AFL level. Have a great preseason, but give him the first two rounds off. Let him learn how to play at his best position in the SANFL for 2 weeks and then finally bring him back to the AFL in round 5 because he was ready (Not because Schoenberg was playing terrible).
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Berry played his first season as a forward which gave him a good taste of AFL footy but he hardly played any midfield time - which is true of majority of first year players (even JHF and Daicos played minimal mid time last year)

After another preseason he was moved into the mid mix but started the year behind Crouch, Harry etc.
Started the year in the SANFL as a starting mid, dominated - and then went up to the AFL where he went from strength to strength. Didn’t get dropped from there

You clearly don’t value experience and wins during a rebuild as your posts have indicated. Pretty much everyone else thinks it’s important. That’s why an injured Doedee played over Worrell because the other defenders were Hinge,Butts, Murray, Parnell , Jones who have all hardly played
Dawson goes back to support Doedee and Smith hold the ship together. That’s what happens otherwise you get smashed every week and the Racheles, Fogartys Soligo don’t see much of the ball and their development stops as well.
Everywhere you look in professional sport experience is number 1 - excluding superstar talent - you choose to believe otherwise and that’s fine. Doesn’t make you correct though


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Vader said:
I didn't say that the players are no good. I said they are young and inexperienced. They are still developing, and are still well short of their full potential. This is what happens when you play a team with 15+ players with less than 50 games each.

The problem here is not the team's performance, it's your completely unrealistic expectations, which are completely divorced from the reality of our team list's demographics.

On SM-X205 using BigFooty.com mobile app
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No this started as a perfectly reasonable view that a player picked in the MSD, Turner in this case, should have been given a chance to show how he performs at AFL level over someone facing delisting.

His SANFL form with us was pretty good, and his form before that was the very reason they picked him.

You have a view that the coaches always get it right, which I doubt even the coaches themselves would agree with. I and many others are of the view they don’t.
 
Apsaalooke said:
No this started as a perfectly reasonable view that a player picked in the MSD, Turner in this case, should have been given a chance to show how he performs at AFL level over someone facing delisting.

His SANFL form with us was pretty good, and his form before that was the very reason they picked him.

You have a view that the coaches always get it right, which I doubt even the coaches themselves would agree with. I and many others are of the view they don’t.
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Exactly, Turner had already had an SANFL career, it’s not like he needed/wanted a different SANFL career.
 
Apsaalooke said:
No this started as a perfectly reasonable view that a player picked in the MSD, Turner in this case, should have been given a chance to show how he performs at AFL level over someone facing delisting.

His SANFL form with us was pretty good, and his form before that was the very reason they picked him.

You have a view that the coaches always get it right, which I doubt even the coaches themselves would agree with. I and many others are of the view they don’t.
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I would have given Turner a game near the end - though I probably wouldn't have supported drafting him.

I'm actually surprised Turner acted a bit oddly near the end, as we absolutely could have taken him instead of Brown. Maybe we weren't planning to no matter what happened, and saw all we needed to see.

The whole thing is weird.
 
Mostyn said:
I would have given Turner a game near the end - though I probably wouldn't have supported drafting him.

I'm actually surprised Turner acted a bit oddly near the end, as we absolutely could have taken him instead of Brown. Maybe we weren't planning to no matter what happened, and saw all we needed to see.

The whole thing is weird.
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Depends what he was told though. We told Brown we might rookie him, I can’t see how we could do that and still think Turner was a chance when he thought he was
 
rabidcrow said:
You clearly don’t value experience and wins during a rebuild as your posts have indicated. Pretty much everyone else thinks it’s important. That’s why an injured Doedee played over Worrell because the other defenders were Hinge,Butts, Murray, Parnell , Jones who have all hardly played
Dawson goes back to support Doedee and Smith hold the ship together. That’s what happens otherwise you get smashed every week and the Racheles, Fogartys Soligo don’t see much of the ball and their development stops as well.
Everywhere you look in professional sport experience is number 1 - excluding superstar talent - you choose to believe otherwise and that’s fine. Doesn’t make you correct though
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Great post 👍 .....best summary of the situation i've seen posted
 
Apsaalooke said:
No this started as a perfectly reasonable view that a player picked in the MSD, Turner in this case, should have been given a chance to show how he performs at AFL level over someone facing delisting.

His SANFL form with us was pretty good, and his form before that was the very reason they picked him.

You have a view that the coaches always get it right, which I doubt even the coaches themselves would agree with. I and many others are of the view they don’t.
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Turner is/was a good SANFL player, who never threatened to be more than that. There's nothing wrong with that - history is littered with ex-AFL players who fall into the same category.
 
rabidcrow said:
Berry played his first season as a forward which gave him a good taste of AFL footy but he hardly played any midfield time - which is true of majority of first year players (even JHF and Daicos played minimal mid time last year)

After another preseason he was moved into the mid mix but started the year behind Crouch, Harry etc.
Started the year in the SANFL as a starting mid, dominated - and then went up to the AFL where he went from strength to strength. Didn’t get dropped from there

You clearly don’t value experience and wins during a rebuild as your posts have indicated. Pretty much everyone else thinks it’s important. That’s why an injured Doedee played over Worrell because the other defenders were Hinge,Butts, Murray, Parnell , Jones who have all hardly played
Dawson goes back to support Doedee and Smith hold the ship together. That’s what happens otherwise you get smashed every week and the Racheles, Fogartys Soligo don’t see much of the ball and their development stops as well.
Everywhere you look in professional sport experience is number 1 - excluding superstar talent - you choose to believe otherwise and that’s fine. Doesn’t make you correct though


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
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Curious, if Doedee isn’t ready round 1 because his surgery was delayed to play those late games, what then? We are in the same boat with lack of experience but we are starting the year from scratch with early wins very important.
 
George Kramer said:
Curious, if Doedee isn’t ready round 1 because his surgery was delayed to play those late games, what then? We are in the same boat with lack of experience but we are starting the year from scratch with early wins very important.
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Ironically, it would give a young player an opportunity. We all get what we want.:D
 

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George Kramer said:
Curious, if Doedee isn’t ready round 1 because his surgery was delayed to play those late games, what then? We are in the same boat with lack of experience but we are starting the year from scratch with early wins very important.
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Two points on that - the whole squad has got another preseason into them. When you think about getting players to 50-80 games before they are any good it’s not just about the games, it’s also about the pre seasons they do

In terms of Doedee playing those last two games, I wouldn’t have played him.
Seemingly Burgess and his team didn’t think Tom could do more damage and were expecting him to avoid surgery as well so they cleared him to play. Coaches on balance decided to play him for the experience he provides and obviously felt their wasn’t anyone in the SANFL they wanted to play
I doubt the thought was that he would have surgery given it didn’t appear the surgery took place until a few weeks after the season.
I also expect he will be available round 1 but if he isn’t then fair enough you would have to review the injury to see if they could have called it earlier


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rabidcrow said:
Two points on that - the whole squad has got another preseason into them. When you think about getting players to 50-80 games before they are any good it’s not just about the games, it’s also about the pre seasons they do

In terms of Doedee playing those last two games, I wouldn’t have played him.
Seemingly Burgess and his team didn’t think Tom could do more damage and were expecting him to avoid surgery as well so they cleared him to play. Coaches on balance decided to play him for the experience he provides and obviously felt their wasn’t anyone in the SANFL they wanted to play
I doubt the thought was that he would have surgery given it didn’t appear the surgery took place until a few weeks after the season.
I also expect he will be available round 1 but if he isn’t then fair enough you would have to review the injury to see if they could have called it earlier


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This seems like a pretty reasonable analysis.
 
1990crow said:
The argument we didn't know Rankine was coming until after we had wasted the second half of the season on Rowe is flimsy at best. We would have known Rankines intentions at the latest halfway through the year, more likely closer to the beginning of the year.
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Wasn't it the GC v Port game here last season that really was the catalyst for rankine to want to look at coming home
 
We played an injured Talia in the last few games of 2020, believing that we needed his experience and some wins at the back end of the season would be crucial for a developing team to take momentum & confidence into 2021.

It cost Talia his career and he never played again.

We continued to struggle in 2021.

When presented with the same situation we would do (and did) the exact same thing again.
 
Last edited:
Mutineer said:
Kaine Baldwin is the one I'll be keeping a close eye on...
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BIG BALDWIN

Fringe forward Kaine Baldwin has produced one of the most encouraging performances of his time at Essendon to put his hand up for Round 1 consideration.

Without Peter Wright, Sam Weideman or Stringer on Wednesday, Baldwin took his opportunity to show Scott he can provide a strong aerial contest.

Baldwin was clearly the most threatening key forward and took a swathe of marks including a brilliant contested grab flying three back in the second term.

It is a make-or-break year for the big man who was considered one of the best junior talents in the country before he suffered two knee reconstructions.
 
rabidcrow said:
Berry played his first season as a forward which gave him a good taste of AFL footy but he hardly played any midfield time - which is true of majority of first year players (even JHF and Daicos played minimal mid time last year)

After another preseason he was moved into the mid mix but started the year behind Crouch, Harry etc.
Started the year in the SANFL as a starting mid, dominated - and then went up to the AFL where he went from strength to strength. Didn’t get dropped from there

You clearly don’t value experience and wins during a rebuild as your posts have indicated. Pretty much everyone else thinks it’s important. That’s why an injured Doedee played over Worrell because the other defenders were Hinge,Butts, Murray, Parnell , Jones who have all hardly played
Dawson goes back to support Doedee and Smith hold the ship together. That’s what happens otherwise you get smashed every week and the Racheles, Fogartys Soligo don’t see much of the ball and their development stops as well.
Everywhere you look in professional sport experience is number 1 - excluding superstar talent - you choose to believe otherwise and that’s fine. Doesn’t make you correct though


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Click to expand...

I kind of agree but experience only counts when the experience players are still performing

My concern kicks in when we select experience played just for their game experience, and their game day performance is poor



On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
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