Autopsy 2024 AFL Season Round 17 vs Sydney Swans

[gringo2011]

This discussion should be in the trade thread.

But I agree with Bergholt on this one, there is a balance between drafting and trading to fill list gaps. We all know the long term affects on the list that trading out high draft picks and poor recruiting has caused. I dont think Bergholt is suggesting going all out at the draft and not looking to trade, rather than drafting a number a good kids each year and hopefully nailing those selections.

The better teams draft well, develop and release players to trade most years, thats mostly how they have been able to remain competitive for so long eg Sydney, Geelong, Collingwood. They have also had the benefit of NGA and father son players but smart clubs continue to do things well for decades, thats how they win flags.

We are not going to get a player like Henry for a 2nd round pick every year, sometimes its a matter of balancing the quality of the draft with whats available trade wise. Basically the list build policy should be fluid depending on all of the above. Just on Henry perhaps now you are prepared to give Gubby and SOS the kudos of identifying and getting this kid across, it was a master stroke but we need more!

Of course it's a balance and you can't get Henry every year but it shouldn't be a rule that we only draft players in. We should be looking at any opportunity to bring in talent when it's available.

Good side aren't shedding their good players. Often a side like Geelong let ordinary players go for picks who are desirable because they are from a good system. If you have a better younger kid coming through and have surplus sometimes it's smart business to let a few go. If you don't it's pushing yourself backwards and usually costs more time, money and picks to replace.

 

[malevu]

That is insane. Even when you're down you should look at trading. Henry is probably the best 2nd round pick we've used in years. The trick is not to completely ignore any one area.

I think Henry's acquisition is a perfect example as to why you shouldn't be totally draft focused. Freo didn't want to lose him but he chose to come to us, probably aided by the Hill factor. But no doubt buoyed by our promising season last year under Lyon, which was probably significant in his decision making. If he was making the choice this year with us parked down the ladder around 14-15th he might have not come.

We might not be a destination club but Hill, Crouch, Henry and the likes of Carlisle and Hannebery chose us. Money talks but most players want to see a team capable of future success.

Ask yourself would Battle be considering joining the Hawks if they hadn't improved from their 0-5 start to the season and were still anchored at the bottom? Probably not.

 

[Pardon me]

Not sure if anyone else noticed, but I think it was Wilkie (or maybe Howard?) leading the song after the match and when finished Steele jokingly looks and points at Higgins like "what happened there mate?"
Good to see a bit of levity from the captain.

 

[gringo2011]

I think Henry's acquisition is a perfect example as to why you shouldn't be totally draft focused. Freo didn't want to lose him but he chose to come to us, probably aided by the Hill factor. But no doubt buoyed by our promising season last year under Lyon, which was probably significant in his decision making. If he was making the choice this year with us parked down the ladder around 14-15th he might have not come.

We might not be a destination club but Hill, Crouch, Henry and the likes of Carlisle and Hannebery chose us. Money talks but most players want to see a team capable of future success.

Ask yourself would Battle be considering joining the Hawks if they hadn't improved from their 0-5 start to the season and were still anchored at the bottom? Probably not.

Having an indigenous all stars environment I could get behind. If that was a way to tempt across players like Geelong have the surf coast it would be massive.

 

[Verdun66]

The rumour is that the turnaround in the teams fortunes has been largely due to the input of the trainee receptionist, who is applying a hard tag on Ross the Floss. The trainee receptionist has been reading the match day thread and passing on valuable instructions on which levers to pull, and whose buttons to push.

Whenever Ross objects, the receptionist shows him a collage of posts from the Man On A Plank thread.

Good stuff BF we did it! He's finally being held accountable.

View attachment 2042510

Saw that young guy next to Ross a few times. Who is he and what does he do? At least Ross doesn’t go off his scone like Longmire. Sitting next to him would be danger money territory. Ross just seems to whinge when things go south.

 

[CursingFijian]

 

[CursingFijian]

DougalHoward. Get around him. Seems to have cut out a lot of his shenanigans and looks very tidy indeed. Starting to get the confidence to pluck a few contested marks instead of always going the chaos punch as well. How good was that tackle on a rampaging Chad Warner

1

Chad Warner

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

1star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

2star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

2star

CL

0.0

1star

D

7.0

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

2.5

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.5

4star

CL

0.0

1star

.

 

[sauce_head]

They didn't even have a goal review. I'm ****en sure it wasn't touched.

About 3:20 left in the third. Between then and 1:20 left, the umpires lifted as a team with a series of free kicks that were not there provided to Sydney, and the ignoring of others that were there for StKilda, including Webster facial by Heeney resulting in blood.

Overall the umpires combined to:

• take the ball from an almost certain goal to StKilda following an illegal shepherd in the goal square off Arie’s bomb from 65, instead awarded to as head high contact to Sydney,
• deliver the ball down the ground including fabricating an deliberate out of bounds again Battle,
• then into Sydney forward 50 by ignoring an actual head high contact resulting in Webster’s face bleeding against Heeney ensuring he was able to mark unopposed and convert (they stopped short of kicking it for him to be fair).
• Then again into Sydney forward 50 by awarding a free kick against Battle (of course) to Heeney (or course) after the latter propped on a lead and was awarded a non specific free kick when Battle neither chopped the arms nor landed in his back.

A classic 18 point turn around in 120 seconds. Great work by the umpires - interstate bonuses achieved for the quarter.

 

[Diehard Saint]

No because pies were already 0-1 before round 1 due to round watchumacallit (opening round) and 0-2 when they played us round 3

Yeah, but it was OUR first game, so that has to count for something

What a stupid thing that was - hope they ditch that concept.
Imagine the Lions having 2 byes before we’d had one when we played them.

 

[Verdun66]

About 3:20 left in the third. Between then and 1:20 left, the umpires lifted as a team with a series of free kicks that were not there provided to Sydney, and the ignoring of others that were there for StKilda, including Webster facial by Heeney resulting in blood.

Overall the umpires combined to:

• take the ball from an almost certain goal to StKilda following an illegal shepherd in the goal square off Arie’s bomb from 65, instead awarded to as head high contact to Sydney,
• deliver the ball down the ground including fabricating an deliberate out of bounds again Battle,
• then into Sydney forward 50 by ignoring an actual head high contact resulting in Webster’s face bleeding against Heeney ensuring he was able to mark unopposed and convert (they stopped short of kicking it for him to be fair).
• Then again into Sydney forward 50 by awarding a free kick against Battle (of course) to Heeney (or course) after the latter propped on a lead and was awarded a non specific free kick when Battle neither chopped the arms nor landed in his back.

A classic 18 point turn around in 120 seconds. Great work by the umpires - interstate bonuses achieved for the quarter.

Loved how Ross laughingly called the Heeney free kicks ‘Interesting’. Particularly the second one. Like he’d found some gem detail deep in a book he had been reading. Classic Ross drive by.

 

[Diehard Saint]

What was different against the Swans?


Our ball use has been improving. IMO a lot of the reason for us scoring less in many games this year was not our gameplan, but rather too many players were missing targets by hand and foot and/or just trying to give it toa dumb option, or even worse just blind disposal.

Our disposal was certainly much improved against the Swans.

The other big factor was the ball did not waltz out of our forward line as easily as it has in many games.
1/ Because we were not just simply kicking it to defenders as much as we often have.
2/ And two our forward half pressure was much better. I think in part as we had a much more agile forward line than we have often played this year, and in part as the players were just a lot hungrier and more switched on this game.

One of the points made last night is that St Kilda are ranked 1st for scores from the back half, but a woeful last for scores from the front half.

Last night our scoring from the front half was good.

Our midfield unit was very good last night. In particular they were effective.
Congrats to Pou coming back much improved. But also Steele probably played his best game for the year. And Sincs also played one of his best midfield game ever against quality opponents. Henry was the igniter as a link man. The support cast all chipped in as well.

Howard back into the backline playing one of his best every games. This also freed up Wilkie and Battle. our backline was humming last night. It has in the main been excellent this season, but last night in was really onsong. And that was withtou Sincs!!!



All of the above translated into better ball movement AND also the opposition not getting as much easy ball movement to set up easy goals such as we have often seen in games this season.

We were also more daring. I loved seeing them with the confidence to attempt that angles kick into the corridor, even if it didn’t always come off.

Then also, the 1%-ers. There were many, but when Sincs ran through and intercepted that ball between the 2 Swans players, the people around me went nuts.

 

[Teflon]

Yep n game plan fine

 

[Diehard Saint]

He must average close to 30 quality possessions a week over his whole career but a lot still don't know who he is.

Well he shouldn’t have cut the bloody mullet!
( and I hate mullets)
There was nothing better than seeing him streaming through the middle of the ground with the hair flying behind him!

 

[Remboy]

We were also more daring. I loved seeing them with the confidence to attempt that angles kick into the corridor, even if it didn’t always come off.

Then also, the 1%-ers. There were many, but when Sincs ran through and intercepted that ball between the 2 Swans players, the people around me went nuts.

It was really noticeable that we were trying to use the corridor as much as possible. Got a couple of end to end goals too. Cant remember the last time that happened.

 

[John2010362340]

We were also more daring. I loved seeing them with the confidence to attempt that angles kick into the corridor, even if it didn’t always come of.

Then also, the 1%-ers. There were many, but when Sincs ran through and intercepted that ball between the 2 Swans players, the people around me went nuts.

I heard this after the game by some "experts" Ross had to take the shackles off after HT.. So i went and watched the first Half again. This is the biggest misconception in AFL media. We went just as fast, took as many risks in the first half as we did in the second.. Gaps open up more in the second half as teams tire in the second half and don't cover the ground as well defensively. We started hitting targets and sticking tackles. Last quarter we ran over the top of them and really should've won by more as we had a lot of good looks and as we do a lot, butcher the entry. Not to mention Marshall's bounce.

Our talent level forward of centre is the reason we don't score as much as we should. And obviously midfield talent also.
It was great to see our more gifted players being the final kick inside 50.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

NEXT BARRAMUNDI!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[St Kilda Death]

Centre bounce crew of Steele, Sincs, Mattaes and Hunter.

Best it’s looked all year.

 

[TheJackal]

Watching the replay is always interesting. Guys like Hill are absolutely more appreciated from fans at games where you can see his workrate.

One thing I noticed, as much as this week was Mattaes' breakout game, he still has so much room for improvement. He should be a seriously scary prospect after 100 games.

Darcy has an issue with the overlap handball, both receiving and giving. With time his decision making will improve and again, with his attributes could be anything.

Sharman telling Membrey he's going back as the spare then doing that final spoil - I hope the coaches see what most of us see.

We've all applauded Pou, Nas, Wilks, Henry & Dougs but on the replay, I noticed Jack Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

29

Ht

187cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

HB

11.8

5star

M

2.6

3star

T

6.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

was absolutely inspirational. Live, I thought he did a few good things, but on the replay I've realised he was huge and probably the best mid out there

 

[Coconut_twirl]

Any Byrnes haters care to make the case to delist him after that performance? Some wonderful kicking in there as well.

It's fine to have players on your list who might not be in form enough all the time to warrant selection, but are good enough if their form warrants selection. Premiership sides are replete with them.

I would keep him around for at least another couple of seasons. Good midfield depth, but not necessarily in our starting 22. Saints are short of midfielders and he a lot more serviceable than a 2024 Seb or Jones. He will most likely receive interest from other clubs if he was delisted in my opinion.

 

[Ads734]

I heard this after the game by some "experts" Ross had to take the shackles off after HT.. So i went and watched the first Half again. This is the biggest misconception in AFL media. We went just as fast, took as many risks in the first half as we did in the second.. Gaps open up more in the second half as teams tire in the second half and don't cover the ground as well defensively. We started hitting targets and sticking tackles. Last quarter we ran over the top of them and really should've won by more as we had a lot of good looks and as we do a lot, butcher the entry. Not to mention Marshall's bounce.

Our talent level forward of centre is the reason we don't score as much as we should. And obviously midfield talent also.
It was great to see our more gifted players being the final kick inside 50.

Hundred per cent the commentators even noticed that Sydney were flooding our forward line.

 

[Joffaboy]

Watching the replay is always interesting. Guys like Hill are absolutely more appreciated from fans at games where you can see his workrate.

One thing I noticed, as much as this week was Mattaes' breakout game, he still has so much room for improvement. He should be a seriously scary prospect after 100 games.

Darcy has an issue with the overlap handball, both receiving and giving. With time his decision making will improve and again, with his attributes could be anything.

Sharman telling Membrey he's going back as the spare then doing that final spoil - I hope the coaches see what most of us see.

We've all applauded Pou, Nas, Wilks, Henry & Dougs but on the replay, I noticed Jack Steele was absolutely inspirational. Live, I thought he did a few good things, but on the replay I've realised he was huge and probably the best mid out there

Phillipou - developed in the 2's reaps dividends
Coops - developed as a backman, reaps dividends

My pre and post preseason evaluation of Liam Henry

23.Liam Henry – my BOG for pre season training. Is quick very enthusiastic, and trains like it’s the last time he will ever do it. If he plays as he has trained, we are in for a treat. Seems to have fit in really well, like Brad Hill, always a smile on his face, looks like he is well liked by the playing group and coaches. Is Freo really that bad? Must have hated it there. Disposal has been fine. Early sessions it looked a bit rusty, but as the training has gone on it has gotten sharper and sharper (with the usual caveat about no pressure)

Post – his linking up with Naz, and Hill is something to see. Played out of the middle for a time in match sim and looked good, then moved to a flank and was getting oodles of space to be the link up coming out of defence through the mids. Certain R1

The post preseason is what I was expecting all year but with his prolonged injury, it was the first time I have seen it in games. His running through the top half of the square and finding space had me very excited in pre season match sim.

I hope everyone can understand why now.

 

[Bill Crouse]

I would keep him around for another couple of seasons yet. Good midfield depth, but not necessarily in our starting 22. Saints are short of midfielders and he a lot more serviceable than a 2024 Seb or Jones. He will most likely receive interest from other clubs if he was delisted in my opinion.

Collingwood would probably take him. They should remember him well after he showed Daicos how a real footballer plays their 50th game.

 

[Ads734]

Watching the replay is always interesting. Guys like Hill are absolutely more appreciated from fans at games where you can see his workrate.

One thing I noticed, as much as this week was Mattaes' breakout game, he still has so much room for improvement. He should be a seriously scary prospect after 100 games.

Darcy has an issue with the overlap handball, both receiving and giving. With time his decision making will improve and again, with his attributes could be anything.

Sharman telling Membrey he's going back as the spare then doing that final spoil - I hope the coaches see what most of us see.

We've all applauded Pou, Nas, Wilks, Henry & Dougs but on the replay, I noticed Jack Steele was absolutely inspirational. Live, I thought he did a few good things, but on the replay I've realised he was huge and probably the best mid out there

Hundred per cent Re Pou.

Off the top of my head.

I think he can improve

• His stoppage work
• Decision making when he has time and space. The goal he kicked was a prime example of what he will get better at. It's funny he kicked an almost identical goal n the VFL the week before.
• Just overall timing which will come at 50 games.
• Using his speed.
• Strength in contest.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

About 3:20 left in the third. Between then and 1:20 left, the umpires lifted as a team with a series of free kicks that were not there provided to Sydney, and the ignoring of others that were there for StKilda, including Webster facial by Heeney resulting in blood.

Overall the umpires combined to:

• take the ball from an almost certain goal to StKilda following an illegal shepherd in the goal square off Arie’s bomb from 65, instead awarded to as head high contact to Sydney,
• deliver the ball down the ground including fabricating an deliberate out of bounds again Battle,
• then into Sydney forward 50 by ignoring an actual head high contact resulting in Webster’s face bleeding against Heeney ensuring he was able to mark unopposed and convert (they stopped short of kicking it for him to be fair).
• Then again into Sydney forward 50 by awarding a free kick against Battle (of course) to Heeney (or course) after the latter propped on a lead and was awarded a non specific free kick when Battle neither chopped the arms nor landed in his back.

A classic 18 point turn around in 120 seconds. Great work by the umpires - interstate bonuses achieved for the quarter.

Hawks should back off on Battle, he gives away too many free kicks.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Hundred per cent Re Pou.

Off the top of my head.

I think he can improve

• His stoppage work
• Decision making when he has time and space. The goal he kicked was a prime example of what he will get better at. It's funny he kicked an almost identical goal n the VFL the week before.
• Just overall timing which will come at 50 games.
• Using his speed.
• Strength in contest.

That square up kick into inside 50 to Ryan I think it was….seriously underrated stuff