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AFLW 2024 - Round 10 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
List Mgmt. 2024 Draft & Trade Hypotheticals
- Thread starter hairy biker
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Our Cat B slots are currently occupied by Will Edwards and Indhi Kirk.
Wheresbuddy
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So to guarantee we get him, we would have to pick / match a bid in the main draft, otherwise teams before us in the rookie draft could pick him?
There are people more expert than me but I would imagine so, especially since we have committed to taking Francis and Hamling in the ND or Rookie Draft.
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I am not sure if that rule exists or not.
But I remember reading articles about that rule being introduced several years ago when GWS were having multiple 1st round players from the Riverina.
Giants lose access to top talent in academy overhaul
Two potential top-five picks removed from GWS academy zone
www.afl.com.au
I see it mentioned in this article from 2017. But I am not sure if it was officially implemented.
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LukeParkerno1
Post-Human
Surely we can just delist Indhi Kirk anyway, but we will match a bid late in the ND
LukeParkerno1
Post-Human
The restriction is the value in the points- ie picks only worth anything till the 3rd round (it’s 4th round now). Earlier picks worth significantly more (as they should)
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It was a quote in the media
From HSun:
Some clubs believe Sydney Swans Academy defender Joel Cochran could attract a bid anywhere from pick 25 onwards, with one scout saying the Swans had done “a good job of hiding him away”.
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“If a northern academy or NGA player isn’t bid on in the national draft, the team he’s eligible for can add the player directly to the list as a Category B rookie (or Category A if they don’t have any spots free for Category B).”
There’s a post draft list lodgement on Friday before the rookie draft, and then a final one on Mon 25th
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Matching Limits
Northern Academy teams are limited to matching 1 academy bid in the top 20 if they finish top 4, 2 if they finish top 8, and unlimited if they don’t make the finals.
I gather that means that if Cochran slides through he can be added straight to the Rookie List (Cat A in our case) without going to the Rookie Draft but that would not apply to Francis or Hamling?
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- Mar 29, 2019
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This is a good collection of docs and a summary of the various rules: https://discourse.bomberblitz.com/t/the-2024-draft-explainer-confuser/33438
I’m sure it’s in one of the many docs but just not able to pinpoint it whilst overseas….
Callipygian
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He's Melbourne based, from around Essendon way. Aged in his mid 30s. He has worked for Brisbane Lions and GWS as a talent scout/recruiter (about 10 years in total). And he spent 7 years at Champion Data as a statistician. (Mostly sourced from Linked In.)
It's unclear to me whether those rules (which I don't ever yet remember having played a role) survived the revamp of all the points system.
We have already extended Kirk for next year: https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/news/1686292/afl-list-update-francis-hamling-kirk.
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My question is more of how does he recruit as a recruiter? What traits/skills/personalities etc. does he specifically look for in the players we would be looking at and targeting? How may his approach differ from that of Kinnear, as opposed to when Dalrymple and KB were in charge of recruiting?
Callipygian
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OK. Short answer: I don't know.
Slightly longer answer: Keane was always talked about for his number crunching and stats analysis. And now Giramondo has a pedigree with working as a statistician at Champion Data. Looks like 'moneyball' has taken over sports recruiting in high level professional sport worldwide.
Sorry I can't offer more than that.
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HSun phantom draft has us taking Dattoli and M Whitlock
Callipygian
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My draft thoughts (which I am collecting for the first time, unlike those of you that have posted hundreds of times and looked at this in way more depth):
With our first pick I feel like it's really about seeing who is left on the board. Could someone like Trainor or Lindsay or Hotton slide through? Otherwise, will Shanahan? If noone we especially like remains, I'd consider trading back for a good deal. I'll be satisfied if we take Jack Whitlock or Jesse Dattoli, but not super excited.
Very happy for us to bid on Marshall (and to get him if Brisbane didn't match, which of course they will).
With our second pick, I'm less keen on Gross and Hynes (I think I'd prefer Hamish Davis to Hynes - but not at this pick). I get Oliver Hannaford and Harrison Oliver mixed up but I think I'd be happy with Oliver (the small defender) but they both look like good, small types. Faull or Whitlock would be ok too if we haven't already taken a tall.
Some of the names I like who will likely be available to be picked in the 30s at the ND (if we were to trade back):
Alger
Barratt
Davis
Mraz
Sims
Boxshall
Later in the draft there are also good options including ones discussed much here: Adrian Cole, Gabriel Stumpf and Clancy Dennis, Luke Kennedy and Josh Murphy. These are the guys I'm weighing Cochran up against. We will know if any of them are off the board when a bid for Cochran comes but we won't know if they will still be there by the time our pick comes around if we decline to match the bid for Cochran.
A great draft for me might look like: Shanahan, bid on Marshall, trade back for two picks in the 30s and take Alger and Mraz, then Luke Kennedy late and Cochran in the rookie draft. Many other combinations would work too.
With our first pick I feel like it's really about seeing who is left on the board. Could someone like Trainor or Lindsay or Hotton slide through? Otherwise, will Shanahan? If noone we especially like remains, I'd consider trading back for a good deal. I'll be satisfied if we take Jack Whitlock or Jesse Dattoli, but not super excited.
Very happy for us to bid on Marshall (and to get him if Brisbane didn't match, which of course they will).
With our second pick, I'm less keen on Gross and Hynes (I think I'd prefer Hamish Davis to Hynes - but not at this pick). I get Oliver Hannaford and Harrison Oliver mixed up but I think I'd be happy with Oliver (the small defender) but they both look like good, small types. Faull or Whitlock would be ok too if we haven't already taken a tall.
Some of the names I like who will likely be available to be picked in the 30s at the ND (if we were to trade back):
Alger
Barratt
Davis
Mraz
Sims
Boxshall
Later in the draft there are also good options including ones discussed much here: Adrian Cole, Gabriel Stumpf and Clancy Dennis, Luke Kennedy and Josh Murphy. These are the guys I'm weighing Cochran up against. We will know if any of them are off the board when a bid for Cochran comes but we won't know if they will still be there by the time our pick comes around if we decline to match the bid for Cochran.
A great draft for me might look like: Shanahan, bid on Marshall, trade back for two picks in the 30s and take Alger and Mraz, then Luke Kennedy late and Cochran in the rookie draft. Many other combinations would work too.
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That restriction has been in for many years. But it only applies to academy selections, not father/sons or a combination of father/sons and academy selections. So it doesn’t restrict the reigning premier selecting Ashcroft in the first handful of picks and then Marshall a dozen or so picks later.
Re the Cat B situation, are we not obliged to promote Edwards to the Cat A list anyway, after he’s spent two years on the Cat B list? A club can apply for special dispensation to keep a player as a Cat B rookie for any extra year but that’s meant to be for special circumstances. It arose after the Covid years when players had restricted opportunities in the seconds/state leagues. But the default remains two years, does it not? Or was that softened when they recently softened the rules around how long players could stay on any part of the rookie list?
Where is this sourced?
The only information I can find on the AFL website that alludes to this, says the opposite.
AFL player movement and list management changes
The AFL Commission has approved changes related to AFL Player Movement and List Management for 2024 and 2025
www.afl.com.au
2025 changes
Draft value index (DVI)/bidding system
New framework for the DVI/bidding system will be implemented aiming to restore fair value.
The new DVI will see points allocated up until the end of the natural third round. (Link to new DVI model)
A 10% discount will be applied on all bids from selection 1 to 18 followed by an 84-point deduction (being 10% of selection 18) for all bids from selection 19 to 36.
Matching a bid - first round: Matched using equivalent DVI points.
Matching a bid - after first-round:
Matched using equivalent DVI points up to selection 36.
Match with next selection from selection 37.
Restriction on Northern Academies: There will be no restrictions based on ladder finishing position for Northern Academy clubs.
TBH that would do me. Luke Kennedy with third pick and Cochran slides to Rookie A direct or our 4 th pick.
Dattoli might be up to seniors by the end of the season, Whitlock can be developed for either end, Kennedy looks decent as a mid in the pipeline and Cochran has been discussed ad nauseum.
Does sound like Kennedy has a few clubs keen so may not make it to our 3rd. Hugh Boxshall maybe, but possibly goes in the 30s. Ough likely to go earlier too. That said, one might be there. If not, Phoenix Hargrave, Luke Urquhart or Cody Anderson maybe (probably in that order). Or just go early on a mature ager given we're in the window.
Those names all good. I'd prefer a youngster to develop rather than a mature ager who might rot in the VFL.
