List Mgmt. 2024 Father Son watch MKIII. Operation Ashcroft jnr. Featuring various academy boys.

[Jivlain]

 

[Nathan Barley]

If the Melbourne schools are so good at developing footballers then that just makes the argument for a need for academies and priority access stronger

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Really doesn’t seem too out of line to me.

I think the point being made was that Miller1971 could support St Kilda, Collingwood or Koroit - it wouldn't have anything to do with what he's saying in this instance.

 

[briztoon]

Really doesn’t seem too out of line to me.
Sam Marshall doesn’t live in Melbourne, he boards in Melbourne, his parents still obviously pay his Academy fees and still live inside the Academy Zone and his home address is still up here and not in Melbourne.
Many people seem to suggest that it is a loophole that is being exploited by Brisbane when all criteria is actually being met.
And as p4p1 suggests it would be an even bigger loophole for Melbourne Clubs to exploit if all they had to do was arrange for an academy player to be offered a Scholarship in Melbourne to null and void any academy rights.
And something that you can bet Melbourne clubs would exploit at first opportunity.

As for development of academy players against players getting their development elsewhere. Who cares really, the cream will always rise to the top and the players that don’t make it probably don’t make it because they simply aren’t good enough.

There was obvious talent picked up in Sam Marshall many years ago otherwise he would never have been offered a scholarship in the first place.

I wasn’t entering the debate about whether Marshall should retain academy eligibility or not.

I was focused on the last paragraph by p4p1 where he had a shot at, “your club, (meaning St Kilda) entering its 154th year of not winning anything…”

It added nothing to the discussion, was a distraction and out of line, in context to the points first made by Miller1971.


Remember I actually believe the academies shouldn’t exist, and they are a rort, but there are many things I believe are inequitable about the AFL, and how the AFL decides to address these issues often doesn’t solve anything.

 

[briztoon]

I think the point being made was that Miller1971 could support St Kilda, Collingwood or Koroit - it wouldn't have anything to do with what he's saying in this instance.

Thank you.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Thank you.

It's very nice of you to stick up for Miller. I'm sure he's appreciative

 

[BrisVegasDru]

It's very nice of you to stick up for Miller. I'm sure he's appreciative

I am pleased he did because Miller would be one of my favourite posters, the knowledge he brings to this board really enhances it. I bet Brisbane is his 2nd team, many ex Victorians who move up here find it treasonous to ditch their original team. Not me moved up in 1995 jumped on the Bears then Lions and hated watching every Richmond premiership thereafter...

Poor Miller probably feels quite conflicted and guilty that he finds the local team more attractive to watch than his poor Ross Lyon coached mob.

Anyway please keep posting Miller love your insights!

 

[Dalions]

I wasn’t entering the debate about whether Marshall should retain academy eligibility or not.

I was focused on the last paragraph by p4p1 where he had a shot at, “your club, (meaning St Kilda) entering its 154th year of not winning anything…”

It added nothing to the discussion, was a distraction and out of line, in context to the points first made by Miller1971.


Remember I actually believe the academies shouldn’t exist, and they are a rort, but there are many things I believe are inequitable about the AFL, and how the AFL decides to address these issues often doesn’t solve anything.

Yeah, I still really don’t see any issue.

I have read all of Millers posts over the years and I have seen a lot of posts bagging the Academy and intern the Lions for their handling of the Academy so a little dig at Sts in return, meh!

 

[lionraven]

I feel so bad for Shane Warne. One of the greatest cricketers ever. Has won everything he could possibly win in cricket. He made so much money. He drank and smoked to his absolute tip top best. He got to regrow his hair. He retired and could enjoy all the cocaine and ladyboys to his hearts content in Thailand. Yet he never got to see his beloved Saints win the premiership whilst sitting in his stand. We are all richer than Shane this year. We should be more humble

 

[Miller1971]

Wow.

Just for the record, I am a diehard Saints man, that will never change. I also enjoy holding my hand over the cooktop for as long as possible until I can't stand it any longer and poking my eyes with hot needles, but I keep coming back!

Yes, for the other poster who mentioned it - Brisbane is my second team, I am invested in their success because having been up here since the 1980's I want to see footy grow and succeed in Brisbane and broader QLD. I am also a very strong believer in the academies and their place in footy and don't think the academy system should be changed, its perfectly fine until footy is genuinely the #1 sport up here, which may not be that far away.

I have no official role in clubland or footy in general, but I do know many coaches, recruiters and player managers so I'm partial to the odd bit of juicy gossip or info. I also unashamedly watch hours of footy every weekend across all levels from u13 through to Seniors.

However, the Marshall thing is a rort and for the record he was recruited to Melbourne Grammar for an Athletics scholarship, then turned out he was pretty good at footy!

There was another boy part of the academy who has SA roots, he was offered a scholarship to go back to a big private school in Adelaide and was told he couldn't as he would lose his eligibility - so rules seem to apply very inconsistently as well. Ironically, Brisbane then didn't pick him in their academy team!

There are also pockets of kids being 'courted' by the Suns and aren't allowed to be in their academy due the zoning rules, but the Lions aren't interested in them. Kind of like dumping your girlfriend, but not wanting her to date anyone else! These kids then just get left in no mans land without a pathway, so there a few little things that probably need a bit of attention.

End of the day, if the Lions don't want them, they're probably not good enough anyway, as like I have said many times before...they do miss plenty of kids and get alot wrong in the shaping of their squads and teams, but I can't recall an actual draftable top end talent missing out since Harris Andrews

31

Harris Andrews

Age

28

Ht

200cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.8

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.6

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

151.7

2star

D

17.0

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

8.0

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.0

3star

D

9.8

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.8

4star

M

3.4

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

94.0

2star

, and thankfully that was corrected eventually thanks to a persistent club volunteer (who should now have a recruiting job somewhere, as he obviously knows talent!)

St Kilda jibes are fine, not like I have a comeback to them. But loyalty as a character trait isn't something I'm ashamed of!

 

[noobermensch]

And as @p4p1 suggests it would be an even bigger loophole for Melbourne Clubs to exploit if all they had to do was arrange for an academy player to be offered a Scholarship in Melbourne to null and void any academy rights.

Well aware that I'm tempting fate by posting the following response here but here goes anyway.

You think that a vic based AFL club, all of which have zero direct connection to private schools, would somehow persuade those schools (bribe them?) to offer scholarships to Brisbane based kids in order for those kids to be available in the open pool so they might have a slim chance of having a draft pick that lands close enough that they might pick them?

This is some deep state #VICBIAS conspiracy stuff right here.

 

[BrainOfMorbius]

If the Lions are paying for the player's scholarship, presumably out of academy funds but it doesn't really matter, I don't see what the issue is

 

[Dalions]

Well aware that I'm tempting fate by posting the following response here but here goes anyway.

You think that a vic based AFL club, all of which have zero direct connection to private schools, would somehow persuade those schools (bribe them?) to offer scholarships to Brisbane based kids in order for those kids to be available in the open pool so they might have a slim chance of having a draft pick that lands close enough that they might pick them?

This is some deep state #VICBIAS conspiracy stuff right here.

It’s not what you know, it’s who you know!
You don’t think people within the AFL community have connections within the Private School community?

As far as the drafting goes, I didn’t suggest that any one club would do it to pick a particular player in the draft.

 

[p4p1]

I feel so bad for Shane Warne. One of the greatest cricketers ever. Has won everything he could possibly win in cricket. He made so much money. He drank and smoked to his absolute tip top best. He got to regrow his hair. He retired and could enjoy all the cocaine and ladyboys to his hearts content in Thailand. Yet he never got to see his beloved Saints win the premiership whilst sitting in his stand. We are all richer than Shane this year. We should be more humble

Mate, if he was able to watch his team win a premiership on top of all of that it just wouldn't have been fair.

I think the saddest thing, if it is indeed sad, is that despite being the greatest spin bowler to ever live, I always got the feeling that Warney would have preferred to be good enough to play for the saints.

 

[bungalow_bill]

As I have said before Bill Burr describing Lance Armstrong as a psychopath on a bicycle is the perfect description for Will.

We are so lucky he chose AFL as his passion. Imagine putting Will through a law degree and an MBA. He would somehow get beer vending machines into primary schools and get Bluey sponsored by a tobacco company. He is the exact guy Lockhead Martin are looking for to head a project on AI driven thermonuclear warhead management. Lucky for us Will just wants to be the LeBron of the AFL

Another good analogy is the title of the McEnroe biography, A Rage For Perfection.

 

[Gadzorks]

As I have said before Bill Burr describing Lance Armstrong as a psychopath on a bicycle is the perfect description for Will.

We are so lucky he chose AFL as his passion. Imagine putting Will through a law degree and an MBA. He would somehow get beer vending machines into primary schools and get Bluey sponsored by a tobacco company. He is the exact guy Lockhead Martin are looking for to head a project on AI driven thermonuclear warhead management. Lucky for us Will just wants to be the LeBron of the AFL

In the business world he would be focused and productive and CEO of a major company by 35.

He is no different to Olympic level athletes, whose dedication and focus we laud.

Sure he will never be a party boy, but that's youth these days. Less drugs, alcohol and sex than my generation apparently.

What he will do is amass a fortune by 30 (his app is going to be popular with teenage footy players everywhere) then live a life a absolute luxury doing whatever the hell be wants.

Wish I'd been him.

 

[Miller1971]

Well aware that I'm tempting fate by posting the following response here but here goes anyway.

You think that a vic based AFL club, all of which have zero direct connection to private schools, would somehow persuade those schools (bribe them?) to offer scholarships to Brisbane based kids in order for those kids to be available in the open pool so they might have a slim chance of having a draft pick that lands close enough that they might pick them?

This is some deep state #VICBIAS conspiracy stuff right here.

nothint stopping the Lions from putting a kid in a good school footy program in Brisbane while exposing to them academy.

The suns move the kids down from NQ and put them up and into private schools on the GC.

I believe there is a boy from Lions at Marist on some sort of academy based scholarship

 

[Miller1971]

In the business world he would be focused and productive and CEO of a major company by 35.

He is no different to Olympic level athletes, whose dedication and focus we laud.

Sure he will never be a party boy, but that's youth these days. Less drugs, alcohol and sex than my generation apparently.

What he will do is amass a fortune by 30 (his app is going to be popular with teenage footy players everywhere) then live a life a absolute luxury doing whatever the hell be wants.

Wish I'd been him.

IO believe he is running summer clinics and kids are paying north of $1k to attend. (not one off days, but programs over a few weeks/months)

Good on him!

 

[Johnny Bananas]

nothint stopping the Lions from putting a kid in a good school footy program in Brisbane while exposing to them academy.

The suns move the kids down from NQ and put them up and into private schools on the GC.

I believe there is a boy from Lions at Marist on some sort of academy based scholarship

Our schools can't compete with Victorian private schools in how good their footy program is.

 

[briztoon]

If the Lions are paying for the player's scholarship, presumably out of academy funds but it doesn't really matter, I don't see what the issue is

As far as I’m aware, there’s been no suggestion the Lions are paying for Marshall’s scholarship at Melbourne Grammar. That would be highly unusual.

 

[briztoon]

As I have said before Bill Burr describing Lance Armstrong as a psychopath on a bicycle is the perfect description for Will.

We are so lucky he chose AFL as his passion. Imagine putting Will through a law degree and an MBA. He would somehow get beer vending machines into primary schools and get Bluey sponsored by a tobacco company. He is the exact guy Lockhead Martin are looking for to head a project on AI driven thermonuclear warhead management. Lucky for us Will just wants to be the LeBron of the AFL

Yeah, I’m not comfortable comparing Will to Lance Armstrong.

Armstrong was the biggest cheat, in an era of cheating, and a massive bully in his sport, and had no problem ruining other people’s careers to protect his great lie.

 

[Dalions]

As far as I’m aware, there’s been no suggestion the Lions are paying for Marshall’s scholarship at Melbourne Grammar. That would be highly unusual.

As Miller said above there is one boy from up North that the Academy helped attain a Scholarship down here in Brissy, but I very much doubt they are paying for it.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Not Mitch Cleary though? No idea who Mitch Keating is, might have a really good handle on the draft I suppose.

Anyway pretty sure gallop will be our final pick.

Interesting to compare Stumpf and Gallop. Stumpf is an athletic freak, late developer with a late year birthday, good leap, lots of speed to get on the lead and up the ground, but needs to work on his contested marking and set shots. Gallop throws his body around and crashes packs, physical and strong in the air. I wonder if we could potentially get both as they're different types of forward who could complement each other. If we only go for one, I guess Gallop brings that physical presence we don't really have in abundance.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Yeah, I’m not comfortable comparing Will to Lance Armstrong.

Armstrong was the biggest cheat, in an era of cheating, and a massive bully in his sport, and had no problem ruining other people’s careers to protect his great lie.

Sounds to me that Armstrong is a classic sociopath.

 

[Miller1971]

Interesting to compare Stumpf and Gallop. Stumpf is an athletic freak, late developer with a late year birthday, good leap, lots of speed to get on the lead and up the ground, but needs to work on his contested marking and set shots. Gallop throws his body around and crashes packs, physical and strong in the air. I wonder if we could potentially get both as they're different types of forward who could complement each other. If we only go for one, I guess Gallop brings that physical presence we don't really have in abundance.

Gallop definitely needs to work on his engine and workrate up the ground.

He also can't play the role he likes to play at Senior level, because he actually just isn't that big, and won't be a physically dominant presence when playing VFL/AFL.

He's certainly a big boy, but he isn't a freak specimen 200cm athlete like a King or a DK, nor is he quick and powerful like say a Jed Walter.

Having said that, he could still grow.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Gallop definitely needs to work on his engine and workrate up the ground.

He also can't play the role he likes to play at Senior level, because he actually just isn't that big, and won't be a physically dominant presence when playing VFL/AFL.

He's certainly a big boy, but he isn't a freak specimen 200cm athlete like a King or a DK, nor is he quick and powerful like say a Jed Walter.

Having said that, he could still grow.

At least he has the mongrel attitude. If that was easy to teach, every key forward prospect would have it. I wonder if the club believes he'll get any taller.