List Mgmt. 2024 List Management discussion
- Thread starter M Malice
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Naughton does not want to play back. Sees himself as a forward. Bevo might lose him if he plays him back. Good idea though. What do you reckon Bevo?
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
By end of 2025 we'll hopefully be flush with options between Lloyd and Gallop.
Gettable today:
- Twomey reckons Levi is a certainty to play OR/Rd. 1 if he recovers from his shoulder surgery alright.
- Brandon Starcevic is one of the biggest FAs next year. Twomey didn't specifically say anything, but mentioned him as one of the contract stories for next year.
- Who the Lions get as a key fwd will also be one of the major storylines of next year. Lions couldn't get a key fwd this year because of matching bids/Daniher retiring, but they will have time next year to attract a player. "Giving the Lions time is one of the most dangerous things in footy."
- "Not many FAs next year, so keep an eye on the contracted players." "If Sam Darcy goes bananas next year, will the Lions come knocking for JUH?"
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Section 5
Norm Smith Medallist
- Nov 26, 2018
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Out with the old: How much experience has your club lost?
Check out how many games of experience your club has lost heading into the 2025 campaign
www.afl.com.au
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
Jamarra always feels like the next Buddy for Sydney. Expecting him to move to Harbour city as part of next contract.
Sydney didn't even explore landing a Key Forward this year via draft or trade.
Been mulling over a couple of things.
1. Getting a key forward will be hard. I was trying to think of those who have RECENTLY moved clubs who were the club's best key forward. Daniher and Lynch came to mind - both from struggling clubs and players who had been there for a while very keen for a move. Both free agents giving good compo to clubs. Jeremy Cameron similar story although Giants were a more solid club. Noteworthy that 2/3 were from the 2 smallest clubs to 2 of the bigger ones.
I was trying to think of others but struggling. McStay obviously but left as a 2nd / third best key tall. Go back a while to Franklin (and look what it took him to leave!) and Dixon (another from the small suns).
I am sure i have forgotten some but it says to me it's very hard to land a gun key forward. They are so rare that they are usually overpaid at the club they are at, hence it's hard for them to shift. So we would have to pay up big AND hope someone wants to leave for success AND probably make it a free agent. We also don't have that advantage or a Richmond or Collingwood or Geelong in offering off-field cash. We can offer the leave the fishbowl carrot which was a huge part of Joe coming.
2. I have previously been very focused on 30+ players - as in gee we don't want too many of them. I am starting to think the bigger issue is having too FEW of them.
Thinking of our crew from 2024:
Neale - awesome year, finals player of the year, should have won norm smith
Daniher - leading goalkicker, incredible semi, sneaky good granny
Cameron - not his best year but still took the best small defender and took his team-work to a new level. Crucial in the Prelim late
Oscar / Fort - Oscar had his best year, Darcy able to step up in the granny despite his lack of afl a big part of us winning
Lester - career best year, awesome last 2 finals
Zorko - AA year, turned back the clock, even in his poor semi kicks 2 goals by just attacking and refusing to give up
Lyons - fell further off the cliff
Linc - knee injury, was playing well before that
Looking at that cohort there is no way we get near the flag without them. Looking at Collingwood and Geelong the previous two years tells a similar story.
There is clearly a danger in having too many oldies - the main one is too many of them of them falling off the cliff at once. So you need to avoid carrying too many, and you obviously need enough of a balance to be bringing through younger players.
But when i see lists of the clubs with the most 30yos stating they are about to fall off the cliff, or a list with the best under 25s, i am somewhat skeptical. To me in the modern game, 30yo is still peak age - an age at which players can deliver consistency and have not yet slowed down. John Longmire retired at 28yo because he was beaten up! Doesn't really happen any more.
I would think it's more about how many 30yo do you have that are crucial to your side who might go downhill quickly?
We have some risk in that area but i think enough depth in each position
Neale - no sign of slowing down but let's see how the foot goes - plenty of gun mids coming through
Cameron - could be a big drop off i think BUT might have just had a down year off no pre season - again plenty of good smalls
Linc - no guarantee of anything coming off a knee, again plenty of smalls already
Zorko - probably our biggest risk given Kiddy is an unknown. Has to slow down one day! Could gun it again or his body could pack it in
Oscar / Fort - Both had delayed starts to the highest level so should be good for another year or two at least
Day - break glass
1. Getting a key forward will be hard. I was trying to think of those who have RECENTLY moved clubs who were the club's best key forward. Daniher and Lynch came to mind - both from struggling clubs and players who had been there for a while very keen for a move. Both free agents giving good compo to clubs. Jeremy Cameron similar story although Giants were a more solid club. Noteworthy that 2/3 were from the 2 smallest clubs to 2 of the bigger ones.
I was trying to think of others but struggling. McStay obviously but left as a 2nd / third best key tall. Go back a while to Franklin (and look what it took him to leave!) and Dixon (another from the small suns).
I am sure i have forgotten some but it says to me it's very hard to land a gun key forward. They are so rare that they are usually overpaid at the club they are at, hence it's hard for them to shift. So we would have to pay up big AND hope someone wants to leave for success AND probably make it a free agent. We also don't have that advantage or a Richmond or Collingwood or Geelong in offering off-field cash. We can offer the leave the fishbowl carrot which was a huge part of Joe coming.
2. I have previously been very focused on 30+ players - as in gee we don't want too many of them. I am starting to think the bigger issue is having too FEW of them.
Thinking of our crew from 2024:
Neale - awesome year, finals player of the year, should have won norm smith
Daniher - leading goalkicker, incredible semi, sneaky good granny
Cameron - not his best year but still took the best small defender and took his team-work to a new level. Crucial in the Prelim late
Oscar / Fort - Oscar had his best year, Darcy able to step up in the granny despite his lack of afl a big part of us winning
Lester - career best year, awesome last 2 finals
Zorko - AA year, turned back the clock, even in his poor semi kicks 2 goals by just attacking and refusing to give up
Lyons - fell further off the cliff
Linc - knee injury, was playing well before that
Looking at that cohort there is no way we get near the flag without them. Looking at Collingwood and Geelong the previous two years tells a similar story.
There is clearly a danger in having too many oldies - the main one is too many of them of them falling off the cliff at once. So you need to avoid carrying too many, and you obviously need enough of a balance to be bringing through younger players.
But when i see lists of the clubs with the most 30yos stating they are about to fall off the cliff, or a list with the best under 25s, i am somewhat skeptical. To me in the modern game, 30yo is still peak age - an age at which players can deliver consistency and have not yet slowed down. John Longmire retired at 28yo because he was beaten up! Doesn't really happen any more.
I would think it's more about how many 30yo do you have that are crucial to your side who might go downhill quickly?
We have some risk in that area but i think enough depth in each position
Neale - no sign of slowing down but let's see how the foot goes - plenty of gun mids coming through
Cameron - could be a big drop off i think BUT might have just had a down year off no pre season - again plenty of good smalls
Linc - no guarantee of anything coming off a knee, again plenty of smalls already
Zorko - probably our biggest risk given Kiddy is an unknown. Has to slow down one day! Could gun it again or his body could pack it in
Oscar / Fort - Both had delayed starts to the highest level so should be good for another year or two at least
Day - break glass
- Aug 16, 2010
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Great to see Twomey has My boy Hagan linked to the Lions
Bucking Beads
Brownlow Medallist
Jamara is happening
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
I think midfield is being replenished quickly and I was shocked at the level Ashcroft reached in finals. He was outdoing Neale and was pretty much our "follow me boys" leader in GWS final and Grand final. We'll have 2 Ashcrofts running around next year is an amazing feeling.
My biggest worry is small forward. Just like Gun KPF, we lucked out with Charlie wanting to come here and produce consistent 50+ goal seasons year after year. It's hard to replicate and Kai Lohmann could potentially do it, but takes a lot to maintain the level that Charlie did for us.
Henry Smith has to play next year and become our primary ruck by second half of the season. I believe Big O will do a half decent job playing deep forward/third tall ruck.
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- Jun 27, 2017
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I have it on good authority that I would enjoy getting JUH.
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Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Can Henry Smith step into the Joe role? I believe he's got "it" and just needs time and building confidence. (I didn't think that watching his debut but 2nd game showed some nice moments). I'll trust Max Gawn who said when interviewed before the Granny. " Henry Smith,he's not ready for the Grannie but..he's the next big thing!"
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I'd have him as the eventual Big O replacement. When he did play at AFL level and replaced Oscar in the ruck, when Oscar was on the bench, he was significantly better than purely as a forward
- Mar 20, 2016
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One of the things I hope to see next year is Linc return as the forward line general, mustering the troops and being the defensive small, allowing Charlie to go back to being less accountable but more creative. Charlie did a great job of taking on the defensive/mentoring roll in Linc's absence but let's face it, it affected his output. Theres no reason why Charlie can't return to his elusive, attacking best and drive back lines mad trying to deal with him.
- Oct 13, 2015
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Charlie averaged 3.4 shots per game last year - his lowest total since 2020 but still a very very good number. Really think most of the issue was accuracy. Hopefully he comes in refreshed and bumps it up a bit to get back to his best.
EDIT - checked Charlie's raw (i.e. not expected) accuracy and it was at 48%. He's consistently been well above 50% accuracy in his time with us.
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- Mar 20, 2016
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So perhaps he was getting the ball further up the ground, in his new more defensive roll, than his old running back towards goals days? He has himself said he has needed to change his game to become more defensive recently.
Cause and effect.
All I am saying is that knowing Linc is around doing the more defensive work should free him up to be more creative and be closer to goal, like the Charlie of old.
Don't underestimate the value of Linc to our forward line, if fit he is in for me.
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Kind of ironic when Sydney tried to make Naughton the next Buddy, which is what led to the Bulldogs giving him an absurdly long contract.
Section 5
Norm Smith Medallist
- Nov 26, 2018
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- 11,576
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You could see his goal kicking confidence was not their last year starting from the early rounds
Indecision on round the corner or basic shot, also missed some very easy goals.
We all probably just expect better, but he still had a good year apart from a few things.
He played all 27 games last year being a career high so that does inflate some of his stats.
Since joining the Lions
Most kicks in a season 230
Most marks in a season being the first time he passed the ton with 109.
Most I50's in a season with 67
Most uncontested possession in a season with 186
Most meters gained in a season with 5447
Second most effective disposals in a season with 173
Most turnovers in a season with 71
Most clangers in a season with 63
- Mar 12, 2003
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It would be worth knowing whether they count kicking a behind as a turnover.
What about set shot percentage compared to goals on the run? my perception, no data, was that Charlie when he went back and lined the shot up he missed it more than when he was on the run and it may have been his worst year for for set goals. Just a bit like a golfer that is missing, 'greens in regulation' with something slight that has developed in their swing I though Charlie's set shots were off.
- Aug 16, 2010
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Being that Charlie worked more on he's pressure game will suit us well when he actually has a full Preseason this year
Wow, didn't kick one behind!
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
Nah, he'll be a better ruck than forward in my view. He seems pretty switched on and able to release players with a quick handball in traffic. He doesn't seem to have the instinct to kick goals and tries to pass it off when seen forward so I'd put Big O forward and let Smith build on his primary skill which is the ruck craft.
