List Mgmt. 2024 List Management Part 2 📃

[BlueJet]

I forget the poster who posted this in another thread, but i thought it good to mention here.

For those making age related comments about Houston, thinking he’s too old and his age is concerning.

Houston is the same draft class as Weits, Harry and Charlie. Funny though, as no one seems to have concerns with their age.

Whilst not the point, I do from a succession planning standpoint.
Playing devils advocate to a degree, an argument can certainly be made against having your stars declining at the one time too.

 

[GT619]

Game plan or ability?

They looked very good against WCE when we kicked it into space instead of bombing it

game plan isn't letting them have a say

 

[GT619]

I’d rather get Rosas than wicks

why the love for him

 

[Curnivore]

Houston was in Jsos wedding party and told his management he wanted to come to Carlton and our management said ‘no, your price tag is too high’
He then had all but committed to Melbourne before all the off field problems with their culture came to light and pulled the pin and nominated to stay at port. I don’t know why the rumour has raised its head again but unless our list management thinks he is worth McKay money or he is willing to drop $150k a year from his asking price I don’t see it happening.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

Probably because Watson was barely born when Farmer was playing footy and has been retired for donks, if you used to watch Farmer, like me, you’ve got old.

Farmer doesnt own the name, time to move on, Watson is a gun

Ha i forgot tight pants butt slapper high flying Capper. i think he was called the Wiz first he was the real deal. I think Capper tried to play for us just like Jason Dunstall but club thought different of him being good.

 

[Curnivore]

Ha i forgot tight pants butt slapper high flying Capper. i think he was called the Wiz first he was the real deal. I think Capper tried to play for us just like Jason Dunstall but club thought different of him being good.

Was the real deal until he left Sydney for, if memory serves me, Brisbane and the playing list hated him and refused to kick it to his lead and ruined his career.
Ran in to him recently and was absolutely on the pipe. Glad we missed him.

 

[DangerousD]

Whilst not the point, I do from a succession planning standpoint.
Playing devils advocate to a degree, an argument can certainly be made against having your stars declining at the one time too.

I think too many people assume that without 1st round draft picks, your side falls apart, surely everyone can look to Geelong who over the past 11 years have traded in 6 players using 1st round picks, 7 if you include Ablett as it was a band 2 compo pick.

Even by bringing in a player like Houston, we would still be taking at least 3 kids in the draft and probably 2 in the rookie draft.

5 years also is a long time in football

 

[Coona Blues]

Have been in the camp that Houston would be too expensive in draft collateral. A friend suggested to me yesterday that a deal is being discussed which could cost our current first rounder and future first rounde, BUT returning us a later first rounder in the upcoming draft.

I could get on board with that. I maintain we must draft a (small) forward option and a young key defender to develop. That remains possible if we drop back a half a dozen spots in this draft. Houston, some organic internal improvement and better availability through the year should have us at the pointy end in 2025.

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

Have been in the camp that Houston would be too expensive in draft collateral. A friend suggested to me yesterday that a deal is being discussed which could cost our current first rounder and future first rounde, BUT returning us a later first rounder in the upcoming draft.

I could get on board with that. I maintain we must draft a (small) forward option and a young key defender to develop. That remains possible if we drop back a half a dozen spots in this draft. Houston, some organic internal improvement and better availability through the year should have us at the pointy end in 2025.

Houston would be great if the price was reasonable.
Perfect UFC target, but not at the expense of missing out on higher priority areas.
I didn't think Port had a first pick, and were trying to get one for Luko?

 

[ABigOlDoofus]

I forget the poster who posted this in another thread, but i thought it good to mention here.

For those making age related comments about Houston, thinking he’s too old and his age is concerning.

Houston is the same draft class as Weits, Harry and Charlie. Funny though, as no one seems to have concerns with their age.

I was in the camp of "he's older than I'd like him to be"

Then I did the math and realised he's only one year older than me...

sigh

 

[Ninja Worrier]

Have been in the camp that Houston would be too expensive in draft collateral. A friend suggested to me yesterday that a deal is being discussed which could cost our current first rounder and future first rounde, BUT returning us a later first rounder in the upcoming draft.

I could get on board with that. I maintain we must draft a (small) forward option and a young key defender to develop. That remains possible if we drop back a half a dozen spots in this draft. Houston, some organic internal improvement and better availability through the year should have us at the pointy end in 2025.

Houston, Dattoli would be a better outcome than Berry alone

 

[HarryFlashman]

I think too many people assume that without 1st round draft picks, your side falls apart, surely everyone can look to Geelong who over the past 11 years have traded in 6 players using 1st round picks, 7 if you include Ablett as it was a band 2 compo pick.

Even by bringing in a player like Houston, we would still be taking at least 3 kids in the draft and probably 2 in the rookie draft.

5 years also is a long time in football

We aren’t Geelong!
Geelong & Sydney shouldn’t be used as a reference or example.
They both have proven attributes we only wish for.

Great talent identification & development, strong culture/leadership, clearly identifiable & structured game plan, well coached & drilled. They can actually identify deficiencies in there list & succession plan without ego.
They are really well run footy clubs.

You can go on about “they get this & that, have advantages blah blah blah” but it doesn’t make the above less true.

Once we get somewhere near their level as a well run footy club we can start doing what they do, trying to do it before then is setting ourselves up for failure

 

[Blue Pulse]

Mate we don't have any line breakers. We play to this lists strengths which is stoppage, contested ball and contested marking.

Everyone around here seems to think we have the Daicos brothers and prime Isaac Smith running around but it's Vossy telling them to play another way. Reality is we just have a lod of slow, poor by foot players on our team.

That's part of the problem, bash and crash football is not sustainable for 24 rounds plus finals unless they rotate the list. Once you get sore players, your skills drop off. Weitering, Saad, Boyd, Mcgovern, Newman, were all capable of breaking lines with their kicking or dash, back end of this year they had trouble hitting targets 30m away.

Watching at ground level last year, we were brutal, to the opposition and to ourselves. It is hard to hold this type of gameplan for 24 weeks on end which is why we do it in fits and spurts.

There has to be a happy medium and each team will take different planning to squash their strengths and expose their weaknesses

 

[Blue Pulse]

We aren’t Geelong!
Geelong & Sydney shouldn’t be used as a reference or example.
They both have proven attributes we only wish for.

Great talent identification & development, strong culture/leadership, clearly identifiable & structured game plan, well coached & drilled. They can actually identify deficiencies in there list & succession plan without ego.
They are really well run footy clubs.

You can go on about “they get this & that, have advantages blah blah blah” but it doesn’t make the above less true.

Once we get somewhere near their level as a well run footy club we can start doing what they do, trying to do it before then is setting ourselves up for failure

Sydney are at a different level to Victorian clubs

Read about their academy and it makes it clear how they get their academy picks so right, even though they still pick up some late gems

https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/academy

 

[HarryFlashman]

Sydney are at a different level to Victorian clubs

Read about their academy and it makes it clear how they get their academy picks so right, even though they still pick up some late gems

https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/academy

Wow, that would be kinda handy

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

That's part of the problem, bash and crash football is not sustainable for 24 rounds plus finals unless they rotate the list. Once you get sore players, your skills drop off. Weitering, Saad, Boyd, Mcgovern, Newman, were all capable of breaking lines with their kicking or dash, back end of this year they had trouble hitting targets 30m away.

Watching at ground level last year, we were brutal, to the opposition and to ourselves. It is hard to hold this type of gameplan for 24 weeks on end which is why we do it in fits and spurts.

There has to be a happy medium and each team will take different planning to squash their strengths and expose their weaknesses

I agree on the game style being an issue in terms of sustainability. I just don't think we have the players to play a different way at this stage.

Given the current trade targets being mentioned I think its very likely Voss and the List Team think likewise. Bringing in better users and better runners unlocks our ability to play different methods, just as Melbourne were able to do when they brought in Langdon, Rivers, Bowey etc

 

[HarryFlashman]

Sydney are at a different level to Victorian clubs

Read about their academy and it makes it clear how they get their academy picks so right, even though they still pick up some late gems

https://www.sydneyswans.com.au/academy

Just asking for a friend, Any chance we can buy a place & change the clubs mailing address to Tassie/NT & open our own academy?

 

[DangerousD]

We aren’t Geelong!
Geelong & Sydney shouldn’t be used as a reference or example.
They both have proven attributes we only wish for.

Great talent identification & development, strong culture/leadership, clearly identifiable & structured game plan, well coached & drilled. They can actually identify deficiencies in there list & succession plan without ego.
They are really well run footy clubs.

You can go on about “they get this & that, have advantages blah blah blah” but it doesn’t make the above less true.

Once we get somewhere near their level as a well run footy club we can start doing what they do, trying to do it before then is setting ourselves up for failure

Couldn’t agree, well i can a little, we aren’t Geelong or Sydney that’s right and i think they both seem to be better run clubs, but that doesnt mean you get put off a strategy you believe will build the best list.

You could use your argument to avoid the draft all together, or we could look to the past and see half a dozen first round draft pick busts as a reason to never pick one again.

My point being, adopt the best strategy to build the best list, if our issues are as you say, we will struggle either way but you need to try and i hope there’s moves being made to improve the club all the time.

Sydney weren’t a well run club in the 90s but things built and changed slowly, hopefully we are moving slowly in the right direction, i have doubts over our coach but then what’s better, bringing in kids or bringing in senior players?

 

[BlueJet]

I think too many people assume that without 1st round draft picks, your side falls apart, surely everyone can look to Geelong who over the past 11 years have traded in 6 players using 1st round picks, 7 if you include Ablett as it was a band 2 compo pick.

Even by bringing in a player like Houston, we would still be taking at least 3 kids in the draft and probably 2 in the rookie draft.

5 years also is a long time in football

Definitely.
The Cats do a great job of identifying players that can play a role in their system, they know that not everyone needs to be an AA calibre talent but the overall blend of skillsets is what matters. (Hawks & Swans fit here too)

5 years isn't that long when it comes to KPP, even taking it for granted that the player makes it, it takes a few years to get it up to speed. I feel it's an overlooked need that is usually addressed earlier on in the draft. With picks to be allocated to Walker & the incoming Tassie team, I'm not sure we can continue to kick the can.

It'll be interesting to see what plays out.

 

[DangerousD]

I agree on the game style being an issue in terms of sustainability. I just don't think we have the players to play a different way at this stage.

Given the current trade targets being mentioned I think its very likely Voss and the List Team think likewise. Bringing in better users and better runners unlocks our ability to play different methods, just as Melbourne were able to do when they brought in Langdon, Rivers, Bowey etc

Play a different way? When i complain about how we play, I’m not calling for a new game style, I’m complaining that i constantly see forwards refusing to lead at the ball carrier to create space behind them, i complain about constantly seeing our mids and backs kick the ball to Harry and Charlie standing still, that i constantly see Harry and Charlie contesting the same ball instead of creating separation, i complain about our inability to improve our D50 stoppage structures.

I could list so many more but none of this means we have to change the game style.

The long bomb to the heads of our forwards instead of space created for them is not a change in style, we can still be a tough contested footy side.

 

[DangerousD]

Definitely.
The Cats do a great job of identifying players that can play a role in their system, they know that not everyone needs to be an AA calibre talent but the overall blend of skillsets is what matters. (Hawks & Swans fit here too)

5 years isn't that long when it comes to KPP, even taking it for granted that the player makes it, it takes a few years to get it up to speed. I feel it's an overlooked need that is usually addressed earlier on in the draft. With picks to be allocated to Walker & the incoming Tassie team, I'm not sure we can continue to kick the can.

It'll be interesting to see what plays out.

For sure but again, people assume that if we are giving a 1st and a 2nd for Houston or even 2 firsts, that we can’t still take picks in the 1st round of the draft, its not true.

The latest chat going around is that we will offer our 1st this year and next for Houston but will get a later 1st back this year, that still allows us to take a KPD in the 1st round or a quality player of need in another area.

That’s before you factor in a possible 2nd for Owies, 3rd for Carrol and 4th for Martin.

It’s common for clubs to offer two 2nds or more to move up the board which we could still do to get a pick ahead of Ben.

We could get picks say 18 and 24 at the draft and still bring in Houston, plus the Campo twins.

Deals like this dont neglect the draft and they dont risk our future.

 

[Blue Pulse]

I agree on the game style being an issue in terms of sustainability. I just don't think we have the players to play a different way at this stage.

Given the current trade targets being mentioned I think its very likely Voss and the List Team think likewise. Bringing in better users and better runners unlocks our ability to play different methods, just as Melbourne were able to do when they brought in Langdon, Rivers, Bowey etc

I think this year we are restricted with the number of players we can bring in due to contract etc, (hence the no offer to Owies) Next year will be interesting as we have quite a few players coming out of contract and some hard calls will need to be made.

I don't think we should panic as yet, our first priority is a fit list and hopefully Inness will help this. Strengthening our VFL with our AFL listed players will hopefully help development, improve our playing group and have them ready AFL ready.

Our game plan just needs some tweaks to get away from being reliant on contested football all the time:

• a couple of options for kick ins to become a bit more unpredictable
• become a bit more unpredictable with guys at the centre clearances so the opposition second guessing
• stop bombing forward to H &C, it is too predictable and easy to defend

Easier said than done, but I feel we rely too much on talent alone rather than assisting that talent

 

[LanceRomance]

First lot of exit interview today.

Bound to get some sad news

 

[katmanblue]

Collingwood should be all over Stringer at that price.

On Pixel 7a using BigFooty.com mobile app

Why aren't we?

On SM-F926B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Bluechip66]

Stringer ‘played last game for Bombers’ as Pies circle; Blues trade ‘watch’ amid big calls: Whispers

Stringer ‘played last game for Dons’ as rival closes in; shock Blues ‘watch’: Whispers

www.foxsports.com.au

Cerra up for trade?