Player Watch #38 Noah Cumberland - Delisted

[Wooden Robot]

Bank on it.
'Benedict' Cumberland will be our next great half back flanker.
He'll find his mojo eventually ... away from the forward line.
As with most threads, lots of assumptions being made, but a safe bet he hasn't put the work in.
But he has recycled half back flanker written all over him.

 

[tiger_tough]

Noah Cumberland (11 disposals, two tackles, three goals)

"Really proud of the way he went about it on the day. His attitude was fantastic, he had a big influence on the match, and we loved the way he invested in his teammates."

attaboy. Few more of them please.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Bank on it.
'Benedict' Cumberland will be our next great half back flanker.
He'll find his mojo eventually ... away from the forward line.
As with most threads, lots of assumptions being made, but a safe bet he hasn't put the work in.
But he has recycled half back flanker written all over him.

He won't go to half back. He needs to learn to not get nilled all the time when he doesn't win a contest forward of the ball. Our forward line functioned exceptionally well v Geelong with all the forwards working to create opportunities for each other. Hopefully the penny drops with Noah that playing in such a way as to add 2-3 goals to his goal tally per game is not netting 2-3 extra goals to the team, in fact it may be having quite the opposite effect.

 

[Vassp]

He won't go to half back. He needs to learn to not get nilled all the time when he doesn't win a contest forward of the ball. Our forward line functioned exceptionally well v Geelong with all the forwards working to create opportunities for each other. Hopefully the penny drops with Noah that playing in such a way as to add 2-3 goals to his goal tally per game is not netting 2-3 extra goals to the team, in fact it may be having quite the opposite effect.

can’t blame it on Cumbo with our form being as bad as it was. or any one player for that matter.
he has forwards smarts that can’t be bought, just needs some confidence to get himself back.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

Bank on it.
'Benedict' Cumberland will be our next great half back flanker.
He'll find his mojo eventually ... away from the forward line.
As with most threads, lots of assumptions being made, but a safe bet he hasn't put the work in.
But he has recycled half back flanker written all over him.

 

[Charlie Pannam]

can’t blame it on Cumbo with our form being as bad as it was. or any one player for that matter.
he has forwards smarts that can’t be bought, just needs some confidence to get himself back.

I’m still on the Cumbo bandwagon, he’s a talent.

I’ve got him in my best 22,best 18 when in form.

at the very least he is really good sub option. With his potential to kick multiple goals quickly he’s a game breaker .

Certainly think a run higher up the ground occasionally would be beneficial
A to get back in form
B add another string to his bow

 

[juss]

I just think he should be playing AFL, personally another good VFL game I'd have him back.

Willing to persist with him because he's talented. God knows Hardwick has persisted with far less talented players for far longer than the shot we gave Cumberland.

 

[Charlie Pannam]

He won't go to half back. He needs to learn to not get nilled all the time when he doesn't win a contest forward of the ball. Our forward line functioned exceptionally well v Geelong with all the forwards working to create opportunities for each other. Hopefully the penny drops with Noah that playing in such a way as to add 2-3 goals to his goal tally per game is not netting 2-3 extra goals to the team, in fact it may be having quite the opposite effect.

it Doesn’t hurt to play him a bit higher occasionally just to break things up.

plenty of teams do it with their small forwards eg Pickett , Papley, Heeney, are used in midfield roles.

Noah predraft highlights showed footage of him breaking the lines hb/wing.

 

[Vassp]

I’m still on the Cumbo bandwagon, he’s a talent.

I’ve got him in my best 22,best 18 when in form.

at the very least he is really good sub option. With his potential to kick multiple goals quickly he’s a game breaker .

Certainly think a run higher up the ground occasionally would be beneficial
A to get back in form
B add another string to his bow

He is in my best 22. Its all up the the coaching staff on how they handle him and upto hom to find confifence

 

[Meteoric Rise]

it Doesn’t hurt to play him a bit higher occasionally just to break things up.

plenty of teams do it with their small forwards eg Pickett , Papley, Heeney, are used in midfield roles.

Noah predraft highlights showed footage of him breaking the lines hb/wing.

I guess it doesn't hurt only if it doesn't hurt. If he doesn't get the structures and intent right as indicated by Morris, then I suppose it does hurt, even more than when he doesn't get it right deep forward.

 

[_RT_]

I just think he should be playing AFL, personally another good VFL game I'd have him back.

Willing to persist with him because he's talented. God knows Hardwick has persisted with far less talented players for far longer than the shot we gave Cumberland.

There is a very good reason why that happens and it's the area of Noah's game that he needs to work on the most if he wants to become a regular AFL player.

 

[Charlie Pannam]

I guess it doesn't hurt only if it doesn't hurt. If he doesn't get the structures and intent right as indicated by Morris, then I suppose it does hurt, even more than when he doesn't get it right deep forward.

That’s all part of educating the player. If you don’t play him in those roles, he doesn’t learn, becomes one dimensional.

He’s always going to be picked based on his forward craft, but just think it helps his cause if can play higher.

 

[Grrr]

At Cumberland's size and skill set there are very few permanent forwards in the league. Toby Greene

4

Toby Greene

Age

31

Ht

182cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.7

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

10.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.0

5star

G

1.2

4star

D

17.5

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

8.0

4star

M

4.8

4star

T

1.0

2star

G

2.3

5star

D

26.6

5star

K

12.4

5star

HB

14.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.6

5star

G

0.0

1star

is the no.1, but even he goes up the ground and even into the middle sometimes.

If Cumberland is to play AFL he needs to play as a mid/forward in the VFL before even being considered as a permanent forward. The deep forward is the hardest position on the ground to play, name one good one. (I'm sure they will be pointed out to me, but I can't think off the top of my head any).

 

[Meteoric Rise]

That’s all part of educating the player. If you don’t play him in those roles, he doesn’t learn, becomes one dimensional.

He’s always going to be picked based on his forward craft, but just think it helps his cause if can play higher.

I agree. But he needs to round out that part of his game in the VFL, rather than costing us wins at AFL level. It doesn't just cost us wins either, it costs other players who are playing their roles the way the club wants very dearly. If they do their part in the structure, and he doesn't do his, he makes them all look like fools.

 

[Charlie Pannam]

I agree. But he needs to round out that part of his game in the VFL, rather than costing us wins at AFL level. It doesn't just cost us wins either, it costs other players who are playing their roles the way the club wants very dearly. If they do their part in the structure, and he doesn't do his, he makes them all look like fools.

Agreed, I thought you were talking about his VFL education from Morris , no doubt that’s where he needs to learn those roles and structures.
VFL always about educating your players for AFL action rather than W/L

 

[domin8]

What the Dees game showed up is that when the goals dry up by a player putting the clamps on him he needs to be able to contribute it other ways. This is something that he will eventually understand. Can’t have 2 kicks in 3/4s of footy and allow your man to run riot which Hibberd did.

He can get away with only 2 kicks of he is still able to nullify the influence of his man or the oppos ability to run the ball out of defence ie. block lanes etc.

 

[_RT_]

What the Dees game showed up is that when the goals dry up by a player putting the clamps on him he needs to be able to contribute it other ways. This is something that he will eventually understand. Can’t have 2 kicks in 3/4s of footy and allow your man to run riot which Hibberd did.

He can get away with only 2 kicks of he is still able to nullify the influence of his man or the oppos ability to run the ball out of defence ie. block lanes etc.

Disagree with this as his talent is too good for him to only have 2-5 kicks for a game, regardless of his defensive efforts.

For mine he should be aiming, at averaging the following across a season:

Disposals - 17
Disposal efficiency - 69.6%
Kicking efficiency - 61.8%
I50s - 3
Contested possessions - 45%
Uncontested Possessions - 55%
Ground Ball Gets - 5.4
Clearances - 2
Marks - 5 with 1 contested, 1 I50 & 1 on the lead
Scoring - 1.3 goals with 5.8 score involvements
Defensive Work - 3.9 tackles & 16 pressure acts

This is what Issac Heeney averages for his career at 27 years of age

Now people might look at this and think it's unrealistic however here are Noahs current career averages at just 22:
Disposals - 9
Disposal efficiency - 57%
Kicking efficiency - 48.9%
I50s - 1.9
Contested Possessions - 53%
Uncontested Possessions - 47%
Ground Ball Gets - 2.9
Clearances - 0.5
Marks - 2 with 0.5 contested, 1.1 I50 & 0.7 on the lead
Scoring - 1.7 with 5.1 score involvements
Defensive Work - 2.4 with 11.6 pressure acts.

As you can see in some areas Noah is right around the mark that Heeney puts up, but then there are those he falls short in and those areas all come down to one thing work ethic and Noah has time on his side to work on this and reach his full potential.

 

[domin8]

Disagree with this as his talent is too good for him to only have 2-5 kicks for a game, regardless of his defensive efforts.

For mine he should be aiming, at averaging the following across a season:

Disposals - 17
Disposal efficiency - 69.6%
Kicking efficiency - 61.8%
I50s - 3
Contested possessions - 45%
Uncontested Possessions - 55%
Ground Ball Gets - 5.4
Clearances - 2
Marks - 5 with 1 contested, 1 I50 & 1 on the lead
Scoring - 1.3 goals with 5.8 score involvements
Defensive Work - 3.9 tackles & 16 pressure acts

This is what Issac Heeney averages for his career at 27 years of age

Now people might look at this and think it's unrealistic however here are Noahs current career averages at just 22:
Disposals - 9
Disposal efficiency - 57%
Kicking efficiency - 48.9%
I50s - 1.9
Contested Possessions - 53%
Uncontested Possessions - 47%
Ground Ball Gets - 2.9
Clearances - 0.5
Marks - 2 with 0.5 contested, 1.1 I50 & 0.7 on the lead
Scoring - 1.7 with 5.1 score involvements
Defensive Work - 2.4 with 11.6 pressure acts.

As you can see in some areas Noah is right around the mark that Heeney puts up, but then there are those he falls short in and those areas all come down to one thing work ethic and Noah has time on his side to work on this and reach his full potential.

Na I didn’t say it was acceptable it’s no where near acceptable. However if he isn’t finding the footy he needs to be doing other acts to benefit the team.

 

[_RT_]

Na I didn’t say it was acceptable it’s no where near acceptable. However if he isn’t finding the footy he needs to be doing other acts to benefit the team.

My point still stands his talent is too good for him to have games where he is only having a couple of kicks, regardless of what he is doing defensively and it comes down to the lack of work rate

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Disagree with this as his talent is too good for him to only have 2-5 kicks for a game, regardless of his defensive efforts.

For mine he should be aiming, at averaging the following across a season:

Disposals - 17
Disposal efficiency - 69.6%
Kicking efficiency - 61.8%
I50s - 3
Contested possessions - 45%
Uncontested Possessions - 55%
Ground Ball Gets - 5.4
Clearances - 2
Marks - 5 with 1 contested, 1 I50 & 1 on the lead
Scoring - 1.3 goals with 5.8 score involvements
Defensive Work - 3.9 tackles & 16 pressure acts

This is what Issac Heeney averages for his career at 27 years of age

Now people might look at this and think it's unrealistic however here are Noahs current career averages at just 22:
Disposals - 9
Disposal efficiency - 57%
Kicking efficiency - 48.9%
I50s - 1.9
Contested Possessions - 53%
Uncontested Possessions - 47%
Ground Ball Gets - 2.9
Clearances - 0.5
Marks - 2 with 0.5 contested, 1.1 I50 & 0.7 on the lead
Scoring - 1.7 with 5.1 score involvements
Defensive Work - 2.4 with 11.6 pressure acts.

As you can see in some areas Noah is right around the mark that Heeney puts up, but then there are those he falls short in and those areas all come down to one thing work ethic and Noah has time on his side to work on this and reach his full potential.

I think he just needs to do what the team's game plan requires him to do, and not think of how many kicks he gets or whatever. Noah is probably frustrated with himself. He grew up playing in a pretty rustic style of footy where he mainly just had to see the ball and try to get it, then use it to advantage. This does not seem to have set him up well for the mentality required by an AFL player. He just needs to develop all the team first instincts, like never peeling out of a contest to receive before the ball is won, providing blocks, screens shepherds and leads to help other forwards. We have all seen what he can do on the scoreboard when he doesn't do all these things. The club seems to really rate him talent wise. He just has to learn the right way to play for the team, and who cares if that ends up at Dusty stats, Heeney stats, Neal-Bullen stats or Castagna stats. Please, just not Rohan stats.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

I think he just needs to do what the team's game plan requires him to do, and not think of how many kicks he gets or whatever. Noah is probably frustrated with himself. He grew up playing in a pretty rustic style of footy where he mainly just had to see the ball and try to get it, then use it to advantage. This does not seem to have set him up well for the mentality required by an AFL player. He just needs to develop all the team first instincts, like never peeling out of a contest to receive before the ball is won, providing blocks, screens shepherds and leads to help other forwards. We have all seen what he can do on the scoreboard when he doesn't do all these things. The club seems to really rate him talent wise. He just has to learn the right way to play for the team, and who cares if that ends up at Dusty stats, Heeney stats, Neal-Bullen stats or Castagna stats. Please, just not Rohan stats.

Said it before and will say it again
99% of this kids issue's are in his head and stems from him wanting to do everything every time

Just needs to listen to what the coaches ask him to do and follow it and not get down on himself when things dont go his way
Just put it behind him and go again

 

[Mr Magic]

I’m still on the Cumbo bandwagon, he’s a talent.

I’ve got him in my best 22,best 18 when in form.

at the very least he is really good sub option. With his potential to kick multiple goals quickly he’s a game breaker .

Certainly think a run higher up the ground occasionally would be beneficial
A to get back in form
B add another string to his bow

I am actually interested to see how he would go in the middle.

If he plays in the guts it might just blow Kane Cornes mind!!

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I am actually interested to see how he would go in the middle.

If he plays in the guts it might just blow Kane Cornes mind!!

If he played in the middle before developing a much stronger team-first intent we would get slaughtered.

 

[Mr Magic]

If he played in the middle before developing a much dtronger team-first intent we would get slaughtered.

not in the reserves we wont

 

[Meteoric Rise]

not in the reserves we wont

I am with you there Magic, even into the role now vacated by Mcdonagh due to his long term injury, whatever the injury is. They look a bit alike so by your reasoning Cumbo should be able to play like him.