Player Watch #40: Callum Coleman-Jones

[RJKTiger]

It’s great list management and it’s why we became a powerhouse. From the moment the club stood their ground with Dusty and retained their offer when he was getting a tour of GWS is the day that this club stopped the tail wagging the dog.

We offered CJ 2-years at probably $350k. Norf offered 4-years at probably $450k. We didn’t budge from our 2-year length offer, because it remained in line with what other players have accepted as part of sacrifice over many years to play at a successful club. How does the club look Cotchin or Reiwoldt or Grimes or Edwards in the eye if they hand out a 4-year deal for $1.8m to a bloke who has played 8-games, cost the club $100k in the soft cap, cost someone their job and almost derailed our 2020 flag hopes with off-field stupidity?

This retains the standards of not overpaying and making sure we keep money in the cap in 2-years time when Bolton comes out of contract. Imagine we lost Bolton because we’d committed $450k to CJ, which means other players would have all come with the cap in hand asking for more.

This is not evidence we are falling off the cliff or regressing … this to me is evidence the club is not desperate, is not panicked and is not letting the tail wag the dog as they’ve done so often in the past.

Well done for standing your ground Tigers, it’ll come back in spades from current players who have taken less to stay!!




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LOL, your explanation to why its not bad management because they chose not to entertain a bidding war for a relatively young and unproven talent who has cost the club $100k is very sound, however...... if this is the hill they were willing to die on with CCJ, they should have made sure they had Chol sorted out - the poor management part is not "losing either 1" - its " losing both at the same time".

The club deserved to lose Mabor tbh. We cut him, re-rookied, then kept him on the rookie roster and right up until the very very very last year we could. He debuted for us in 2016, BEFORE our dynasty began. He was still only on our rookie list. - can hardly expect him to stay for unders - he has been playing for unders for years as a rookie

 

[tigs2010]

When’s trade period end? Don’t want to read about North’s rebuild for too long. FMD name a less interesting topic in footy. Even carlton’s search for a coach trumps it.

 

[RJKTiger]

The “gain” is that North are rebuilding and can’t be in the business of just handing out second round picks they don’t need to.

righto random Nth fan. I don't reckon your club will think like that. Keeping player managers happy and good relationships with your fellow GM's is good management 101. Making your club and its newest player (who already has kebab-mudd all over him) go through a 2 month drama at a time when they likely will still be in a lockdown. The gain in pick spot will not be worth all the bad media and blood it creates. Would be stupid and short visioned approach for a minnow club - you rely on a lot of goodwill

 

[Tiger2709]

western bulldogs flankers dont go missing for months on end to be fair,yes it is the toughest position but

He has stood up at some very important times during our 3 flags, had a very ordinary year this year like most of the team.

I think he's earned another chance though, averages nearly a goal a game.

 

[tugga]

He will have Goldy for a couple more years. By that point CCJ will be 24/25 & Larkey/Zurhaar will be 25/26.

The fixture narrative is an interesting one. Could equally argue that Richmond were a much better side so would be an easier forward line to play in this year.

did you watch any of our games this year other than the north one, and even then you would have seen how badly we delivered the ball inside 50.

 

[Psicosis]

righto random Nth fan. I don't reckon your club will think like that. Keeping player managers happy and good relationships with your fellow GM's is good management 101. Making your club and its newest player (who already has kebab-mudd all over him) go through a 2 month drama at a time when they likely will still be in a lockdown. The gain in pick spot will not be worth all the bad media and blood it creates. Would be stupid and short visioned approach for a minnow club - you rely on a lot of goodwill

Appreciate your opinion.

My opinion is that a deal will be done amicably between both parties, and will land around a third round pick with potentially a swap of later picks.

No bridges will be burnt. It will be a bit less then Richmond hoped, however it’ll be expected given the circumstances (OOC, wants out, fringe player).

Balme & co. won’t share the same level of emotion as some of the posts in here. It’ll get done relatively quickly.

 

[Psicosis]

Did you watch any of our games this year other than the north one and even then you would have seen that playing in our forward like this ye

did you watch any of our games this year other than the north one, and even then you would have seen how badly we delivered the ball inside 50.

Yeah I watched plenty. Wasn’t ideal, but can assure you it was silver service compared to ours.

 

[db26]

Appreciate your opinion.

My opinion is that a deal will be done amicably between both parties, and will land around a third round pick with potentially a swap of later picks.

No bridges will be burnt. It will be a bit less then Richmond hoped, however it’ll be expected given the circumstances (OOC, wants out, fringe player).

Balme & co. won’t share the same level of emotion as some of the posts in here. It’ll get done relatively quickly.

3 rd round pick and a swap of later picks mate atleast come on the page be realistic not fairyland stuff.

 

[Football Tragic]

He will have Goldy for a couple more years. By that point CCJ will be 24/25 & Larkey/Zurhaar will be 25/26.

The fixture narrative is an interesting one. Could equally argue that Richmond were a much better side so would be an easier forward line to play in this year.

You can have CJ for what you're willing to pay for him. He's no Dusty and we can't justify what he's asking for at the risk of jeopardizing the future of our list for it. The last thing we want to do is become another Collingwood and crap the bed over an average role player.

Saying that, I think CJ will be really good for you. His greatest weakness is his bulk - he may development in this way or he may not. At Richmond, we've had players that we thought would bulk up but never did.

His height enables him to take a good grab and his goal from the boundary later in the season showed what he is capable of. Unfortunately for CJ, we had two far more experienced and more skilled forwards ahead of him and equally talented players beneath him. There was no guarantees that he would ever make it at our club. He plays far too much like Lynch to play alongside him in tandem, so it would have taken another 5 odd years before there was a spot for him.

In the ruck, he needs work. He struggles to get off the ground and is easily battered away in ruck contests. He may improve his ruck craft but he was always a better forward than ruck. At Richmond, we have two 25ish year old ruckman who are infinitely better than CJ.

I hope he works out for you but don't expect him to be a star for you. I think he'll be a good honest role player for you for years to come though.

More importantly though, what will you give us for him?! Pick 20 swap for our Pick 40, plus your third rounder (38) pick would be nice

 

[RJKTiger]

Appreciate your opinion.

My opinion is that a deal will be done amicably between both parties, and will land around a third round pick with potentially a swap of later picks.

No bridges will be burnt. It will be a bit less then Richmond hoped, however it’ll be expected given the circumstances (OOC, wants out, fringe player).

Balme & co. won’t share the same level of emotion as some of the posts in here. It’ll get done relatively quickly.

i think you underestimate how badly this boy ****ed up last year - I was happy for him to be sacked on the spot. He quitting on us a year later will not go down well - if you want to add a shitshow to your pre-season then brave strategy Cotton, lets see if it pays off for ya

 

[Sir_Loin]

The kebab incident isn't the only indiscretion he's had. The blokes a dickhead, will fit in nicely at North.

What else was there?

 

[Serenity_Now]

The kebab incident isn't the only indiscretion he's had. The blokes a dickhead, will fit in nicely at North.

 

[Noidnadroj]

You raise a lot of really good points here and you're spot on about asking blokes to make sacrifices on one hand then paying ccj massive overs on the other. The only thing I would say about the club holding its ground is that it is not necessarily always the best decision. Take the Dusty example, if he had have signed with GWS as he was very close to doing, we wouldn't have won any flags and would have been absolute mugs for not increasing his offer, even after some of his off field discretions. As it turned out he stayed and everyone's happy, but there is a lot of risk with that strategy.

Now I'm obviously not saying ccj is going to be anywhere near as important as Dusty, and honestly CCJ could turn out to be a complete spud and we'll all look stupid, but sometimes it actually is really important to keep a player, even if the club has to concede and pay more than it would like. Personally I would have liked us to up our offer (not to something stupid like north of course) as I think for the make-up of our list in 2-3 years it will be worth swallowing our pride and paying him overs.

You can’t pay overs to ‘anyone’ no matter the circumstances when you’ve spent 5-years paying unders. And you’ve had a bunch of high quality Premiership players take unders just within the last 12-18 months… Jack, Vlastuin, Rioli, Baker, Bolton etc… so we’ve probably been telling everyone there’s no money left to pay any more than offered so they accept that and sign… how’s the culture of the joint if you stump up another 1-2 years and a heap more money for a bloke who has played 8 games and almost cost us a flag.

Look at Adelaide. They were telling players such as Mitch McGovern (yes, a dud i know) they were tight for cap space so he signed on the trust …. Then they went and got Bryce Gibbs and paid him a fortune. McGovern and others left and that club imploded. Not saying that was the reason, but it’s a good lesson in being careful not to disrespect your loyal players in favour of others.




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[Tortured Tiger]

What is the compensation for CCJ if we were to delist him? If we can? Would it be end of first round or after our 2nd pick?


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It would be nothing

 

[Noidnadroj]

LOL, your explanation to why its not bad management because they chose not to entertain a bidding war for a relatively young and unproven talent who has cost the club $100k is very sound, however...... if this is the hill they were willing to die on with CCJ, they should have made sure they had Chol sorted out - the poor management part is not "losing either 1" - its " losing both at the same time".

The club deserved to lose Mabor tbh. We cut him, re-rookied, then kept him on the rookie roster and right up until the very very very last year we could. He debuted for us in 2016, BEFORE our dynasty began. He was still only on our rookie list. - can hardly expect him to stay for unders - he has been playing for unders for years as a rookie

I don’t begrudge either of them going, but I don’t think either offer would have been offered massive ‘unders’ either. Chol was offered 4-years by GC …4-years! So probably $1.6m. Our offer would have been 2-years at $600k give or take. A very fair offer for an inconsistent footballer in his mid-20’s who can’t run out a game despite 6 years in the system. As if we could get anywhere near that offer - good on him for taking the deal.

And if it’s true CJ was offered 5-years at around $2.25m …. even if we boosted our offer to 3-years on $400k (slight overs)…. we are still $1m guaranteed short on a bloke with 8-games under his belt. And he’s guaranteed senior game time at Norf. If Nank, Soldo, JRoo and Lynch are fit round one next year CJ and Chol would not get a game.

So one Chol and CJ made the decision they wanted to be guaranteed senior footy, and once they were offered $1m more than they were ever going to get at Richmond, of course they were gone and I don’t begrudge either going.

Let’s face it - if CJ was a model citizen off field, and we thought he was going to turn into a star player on-field, do we only offer 2-years and not budge …?? Really…???

One final point … a few years back when Melbourne let Hogan go I thought they were stuffed. Who on earth was going to kick them a winning score? They didn’t have Ben Brown. Fritsch had only ever kicked 20-goals. They didn’t have Pickett. They didn’t have Jackson. Spargo wasn’t getting a game. McDonald was horribly out of form.

Just 2-years later now look. I’m sure every Demon supporter was panicked about their woeful forward line depth when Hogan left as many seem to be panicking about ours. Our next gun forward line is probably in this years draft, a trade, a free agent, Lynch and someone like Stack or Baker. It’s obviously not CJ, just as it wasn’t Hogan.


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[RFCGloryJC]

Don't really begrudge CC leaving.
If Nank and Ivan play next year, CC would only play a few games again.
We have to develop a new coterie of running players, since our midfield is ageing.
We don't want to end up like Geelong with five or six midfielders in their 30s.

 

[tigers12]

I hope CCJ likes playing in front of no crowds and playing in tassie and playing at shitihad

 

[RoyalTigerrr]

I hope CCJ likes playing in front of no crowds and playing in tassie and playing at shitihad

As opposed to... not playing at all?

 

[DeLaCon]

We arenot going to get anything decent from north so I would delist him now and force them to use their pick probably pick 20 in the national draft. At least then they cant nab another junior player player in the draft to improve their list.

 

[SunshineBoy]

The kebab incident isn't the only indiscretion he's had. The blokes a dickhead, will fit in nicely at North.

Are you suggesting there were more?

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Anyone who thinks this is about opportunity rather than money is naïve. #lolNorf picked up the 2nd most talented ruck/forward in this years draft crop during the mid-season draft. He'll be well ahead of Judas Jones by the end of next year.

Pretty naive to think a kid with 0 development would be ahead of someone with 4yrs.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Poor list management by RFC to have both Chol and CCJ out of contract at the same time.

LoL.
You can put a blanket over all the OOC players we have in any given year.But but because their KP it somehow more important to stagnate each one.I'd love to know how you manage that without exceeding the ave contract of 2yrs.
Goodluck.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

The “gain” is that North are rebuilding and can’t be in the business of just handing out second round picks they don’t need to.

And as the old saying goes.
What goes around comes around.
Now it may not be us but i can assure you clubs do take notes on each other.
Young Powell a SA boy.Crows have form on bringing home kids via the psd.
Bet you won't too smug about it if that happens eh.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

LOL, your explanation to why its not bad management because they chose not to entertain a bidding war for a relatively young and unproven talent who has cost the club $100k is very sound, however...... if this is the hill they were willing to die on with CCJ, they should have made sure they had Chol sorted out - the poor management part is not "losing either 1" - its " losing both at the same time".

The club deserved to lose Mabor tbh. We cut him, re-rookied, then kept him on the rookie roster and right up until the very very very last year we could. He debuted for us in 2016, BEFORE our dynasty began. He was still only on our rookie list. - can hardly expect him to stay for unders - he has been playing for unders for years as a rookie

One good game in 6ys
And you wanna keep him.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

As opposed to... not playing at all?

We get bigger crowds that Norf can only dream about.
And thats just us at vfl level.