Player Watch #44: Cameron Zurhaar - [AFL.com] CZ mgr says 'wants to see improvement' & 'team success' - CZ 4.1 vs MFC

[The Nostradamus]

Twomey on Zurhaar - has had a 5 year deal on table since the start of the season at around '$700-750k'

He really should be signing this now

In case we pull the offer

Only needs to refer to ben brown to see how those negotiations played out

The signs are there in terms of young talent and all our key players have signed long term which shows faith in the direction

 

[lockheed]

I've come to realise I'd like to see improvements and team success before committing to supporting Cameron Zurhaar any further.

I'd like to see Cam show some improvement before we support him any further

 

[Its a Process]

He's been much better since the bye - probably as we have some extra tall timber around him.

I would love to see tackle numbers increase, still my biggest annoyance with Cam is the drop off of his tackle/pressure game. Defenders used to fear him running around in the forward line.

 

[Sphynx]

He's been much better since the bye - probably as we have some extra tall timber around him.

I would love to see tackle numbers increase, still my biggest annoyance with Cam is the drop off of his tackle/pressure game. Defenders used to fear him running around in the forward line.

Per 120 min numbers since Port:

All 4 are above their season averages. Zurhaar goals kicked right up.

Even with CZ hot run of form, Ford matches him in most categories.

Ford, CZ and Taylor pressure and tackle numbers are all similar to their season averages.

Paul Curtis is the one with the massive increase.

20+ pressure rating and 5.2 tackles per game is getting up there for medium forwards.

Neale-Bullen, McCreary and Pickett average around those numbers. But remembering these are adjusted for 100% TOG, so Curtis is still 20% off that level even now.

Cam Zurhaar has only ever had 2 x 20+ pressure rated games in his career to date.

Player

Age_Decimal

Kicks

Handballs

Disposals

ContestedPossessions

GroundBallGets

Marks

ContestedMarks

MarksInside50

Tackles

TacklesInside50

Goals_Total

Goals_Avg

Behinds

ShotsAtGoal

GoalAssists

ScoreInvolvements

ScoreInvolvementPercentage

OnePercenters

PressureActs

Spoils

Cameron Zurhaar

26.61​

11.1​

6.3​

17.4​

6.3​

3.7​

5.8​

1.4​

2.3​

3.0​

1.9​

12.7​

2.5​

1.2​

4.2​

0.9​

7.4​

42.6​

1.2​

13.7​

0.9​

Curtis Taylor

24.73​

12.4​

6.1​

18.5​

5.3​

3.7​

5.8​

0.5​

0.5​

3.7​

0.8​

2.6​

0.5​

0.0​

0.5​

0.8​

4.5​

25.8​

1.1​

12.4​

0.5​

Eddie Ford

22.52​

12.2​

7.2​

19.4​

7.5​

6.1​

7.2​

1.4​

2.3​

3.8​

2.3​

5.8​

1.2​

1.2​

2.9​

1.2​

6.7​

38.3​

0.3​

11.0​

0.3​

Paul Curtis

21.82​

8.7​

7.5​

16.2​

8.7​

6.0​

5.2​

1.2​

0.2​

5.2​

2.0​

7.5​

1.5​

0.0​

2.2​

0.2​

6.2​

35.8​

2.0​

20.4​

0.7​

These are per 100 min numbers (80%) TOG since the bye, adjusted for identical game time more reflective of standard averages:

Player

Age_Decimal

Kicks

Handballs

Disposals

ContestedPossessions

GroundBallGets

Marks

ContestedMarks

MarksInside50

Tackles

TacklesInside50

Goals_Total

Goals_Avg

Behinds

ShotsAtGoal

GoalAssists

ScoreInvolvements

ScoreInvolvementPercentage

OnePercenters

PressureActs

Spoils

Cameron Zurhaar

26.61​

9.3​

5.2​

14.5​

5.2​

3.1​

4.8​

1.2​

1.9​

2.5​

1.5​

10.6​

2.1​

1.0​

3.5​

0.8​

6.2​

35.5​

1.0​

11.4​

0.8​

Curtis Taylor

24.73​

10.4​

5.1​

15.4​

4.4​

3.1​

4.9​

0.4​

0.4​

3.1​

0.7​

2.2​

0.4​

0.0​

0.4​

0.7​

3.7​

21.5​

0.9​

10.4​

0.4​

Eddie Ford

22.52​

10.1​

6.0​

16.2​

6.3​

5.1​

6.0​

1.2​

1.9​

3.1​

1.9​

4.8​

1.0​

1.0​

2.4​

1.0​

5.6​

31.9​

0.2​

9.2​

0.2​

Paul Curtis

21.82​

7.3​

6.2​

13.5​

7.3​

5.0​

4.4​

1.0​

0.2​

4.4​

1.7​

6.2​

1.2​

0.0​

1.9​

0.2​

5.2​

29.9​

1.7​

17.0​

0.6​

 

[Its a Process]

Per 120 min numbers since Port:

All 4 are above their season averages. Zurhaar goals kicked right up.

Even with CZ hot run of form, Ford matches him in most categories.

Ford, CZ and Taylor pressure and tackle numbers are all similar to their season averages.

Paul Curtis is the one with the massive increase.

20+ pressure rating and 5.2 tackles per game is getting up there for medium forwards.

Neale-Bullen, McCreary and Pickett average around those numbers. But remembering these are adjusted for 100% TOG, so Curtis is still 20% off that level even now.

Cam Zurhaar has only ever had 2 x 20+ pressure rated games in his career to date.

Player

Age_Decimal

Kicks

Handballs

Disposals

ContestedPossessions

GroundBallGets

Marks

ContestedMarks

MarksInside50

Tackles

TacklesInside50

Goals_Total

Goals_Avg

Behinds

ShotsAtGoal

GoalAssists

ScoreInvolvements

ScoreInvolvementPercentage

OnePercenters

PressureActs

Spoils

Cameron Zurhaar

26.61​

11.1​

6.3​

17.4​

6.3​

3.7​

5.8​

1.4​

2.3​

3.0​

1.9​

12.7​

2.5​

1.2​

4.2​

0.9​

7.4​

42.6​

1.2​

13.7​

0.9​

Curtis Taylor

24.73​

12.4​

6.1​

18.5​

5.3​

3.7​

5.8​

0.5​

0.5​

3.7​

0.8​

2.6​

0.5​

0.0​

0.5​

0.8​

4.5​

25.8​

1.1​

12.4​

0.5​

Eddie Ford

22.52​

12.2​

7.2​

19.4​

7.5​

6.1​

7.2​

1.4​

2.3​

3.8​

2.3​

5.8​

1.2​

1.2​

2.9​

1.2​

6.7​

38.3​

0.3​

11.0​

0.3​

Paul Curtis

21.82​

8.7​

7.5​

16.2​

8.7​

6.0​

5.2​

1.2​

0.2​

5.2​

2.0​

7.5​

1.5​

0.0​

2.2​

0.2​

6.2​

35.8​

2.0​

20.4​

0.7​

These are per 100 min numbers (80%) TOG since the bye, adjusted for identical game time more reflective of standard averages:

Player

Age_Decimal

Kicks

Handballs

Disposals

ContestedPossessions

GroundBallGets

Marks

ContestedMarks

MarksInside50

Tackles

TacklesInside50

Goals_Total

Goals_Avg

Behinds

ShotsAtGoal

GoalAssists

ScoreInvolvements

ScoreInvolvementPercentage

OnePercenters

PressureActs

Spoils

Cameron Zurhaar

26.61​

9.3​

5.2​

14.5​

5.2​

3.1​

4.8​

1.2​

1.9​

2.5​

1.5​

10.6​

2.1​

1.0​

3.5​

0.8​

6.2​

35.5​

1.0​

11.4​

0.8​

Curtis Taylor

24.73​

10.4​

5.1​

15.4​

4.4​

3.1​

4.9​

0.4​

0.4​

3.1​

0.7​

2.2​

0.4​

0.0​

0.4​

0.7​

3.7​

21.5​

0.9​

10.4​

0.4​

Eddie Ford

22.52​

10.1​

6.0​

16.2​

6.3​

5.1​

6.0​

1.2​

1.9​

3.1​

1.9​

4.8​

1.0​

1.0​

2.4​

1.0​

5.6​

31.9​

0.2​

9.2​

0.2​

Paul Curtis

21.82​

7.3​

6.2​

13.5​

7.3​

5.0​

4.4​

1.0​

0.2​

4.4​

1.7​

6.2​

1.2​

0.0​

1.9​

0.2​

5.2​

29.9​

1.7​

17.0​

0.6​

Excellent analysis and I guess it begs the question what is Cam's worth to us - especially considering Zane is probably going to be playing a similar role.

Is pick 19ish adequate compensation for a player who could be somewhat surplus to requirements?

 

[Sphynx]

Excellent analysis and I guess it begs the question what is Cam's worth to us - especially considering Zane is probably going to be playing a similar role.

Is pick 19ish adequate compensation for a player who could be somewhat surplus to requirements?

I think that would ruffle a few feathers on here.

You also have to factor in off field influence, leadership, training standards and loyalty.

I don't think it would legitimately be received well by the playing group if we simply didn't offer him a contract and forced him out.

However, 5 x $750k is way too generous for our own player in my opinion.

It's somewhere inbetween. As I said, without know what Ford or Curtis are on, I'd be offering him 3 x $500k. The tenure is the big one from me, he could honestly be overtaken by a few players in 3 years.

That would be considered lowballing him given he's a free agent, but free agent doesn't mean you are automatically entitled to overs.


The fact he hasn't accepted $750k x 5 years and it's been on the table for 3-4 months is actually wild. Almost insulting for the club imo.

It's really close to Band 1, which might be the long game from Brady and the club, we may have set the market for him to explore his options, with that contract offer we have set his management the minimum asking price for rival clubs.

$850k x 6 is probably Band 1 if he left and they adjust the criteria to include tenure. It's not too much more for a club to push the boat out on if they had to pay draft capital in the event of matching.

I think we would match if it was Band 2. At a minimum we are getting Collingwoods F1 if it was where he went.

 

[cybercrab]

I think that would ruffle a few feathers on here.

You also have to factor in off field influence, leadership, training standards and loyalty.

I don't think it would legitimately be received well by the playing group if we simply didn't offer him a contract and forced him out.

However, 5 x $750k is way too generous for our own player in my opinion.

It's somewhere inbetween. As I said, without know what Ford or Curtis are on, I'd be offering him 3 x $500k. The tenure is the big one from me, he could honestly be overtaken by a few players in 3 years.

That would be considered lowballing him given he's a free agent, but free agent doesn't mean you are automatically entitled to overs.


The fact he hasn't accepted $750k x 5 years and it's been on the table for 3-4 months is actually wild. Almost insulting for the club imo.

It's really close to Band 1, which might be the long game from Brady and the club, we may have set the market for him to explore his options, with that contract offer we have set his management the minimum asking price for rival clubs.

$850k x 6 is probably Band 1 if he left and they adjust the criteria to include tenure. It's not too much more for a club to push the boat out on if they had to pay draft capital in the event of matching.

I think we would match if it was Band 2. At a minimum we are getting Collingwoods F1 if it was where he went.

Would a band 2 compensation pick be before or after our PP last year?

 

[Sphynx]

Would a band 2 compensation pick be before or after our PP last year?

I think I recall based on last year, it was before the PP?

Weren't there some Band 2 results from other clubs which jumped our PP?

 

[chubbspeterson]

I think that would ruffle a few feathers on here.

You also have to factor in off field influence, leadership, training standards and loyalty.

I don't think it would legitimately be received well by the playing group if we simply didn't offer him a contract and forced him out.

However, 5 x $750k is way too generous for our own player in my opinion.

It's somewhere inbetween. As I said, without know what Ford or Curtis are on, I'd be offering him 3 x $500k. The tenure is the big one from me, he could honestly be overtaken by a few players in 3 years.

That would be considered lowballing him given he's a free agent, but free agent doesn't mean you are automatically entitled to overs.


The fact he hasn't accepted $750k x 5 years and it's been on the table for 3-4 months is actually wild. Almost insulting for the club imo.

It's really close to Band 1, which might be the long game from Brady and the club, we may have set the market for him to explore his options, with that contract offer we have set his management the minimum asking price for rival clubs.

$850k x 6 is probably Band 1 if he left and they adjust the criteria to include tenure. It's not too much more for a club to push the boat out on if they had to pay draft capital in the event of matching.

I think we would match if it was Band 2. At a minimum we are getting Collingwoods F1 if it was where he went.

New base salary will be around 520k under the new CBA going forward so your 500k x 3 is far too low an offer
I'd have offered more 650-700k but they might be thinking he takes TT's money or it might be enough to trigger band 1 from other clubs offers, but we can't be sure if 800k will trigger band 1 under the new CBA to be honest.
We'll see how it plays out I guess.

 

[giantroo]

Would a band 2 compensation pick be before or after our PP last year?

I asked Jon Ralph about this a few months ago and it was mentioned that any compo picks will come after the PP picks.

 

[The Filth Wizard]

I asked Jon Ralph about this a few months ago and it was mentioned that any compo picks will come after the PP picks.

It's nice when they answer you back. I got a reply from Paul Scheer on Facebook today, felt well chuffed.

 

[Sphynx]

I asked Jon Ralph about this a few months ago and it was mentioned that any compo picks will come after the PP picks.

The priority picks were already allocated when those compo picks came in also.

 

[Sphynx]

Peter Ryan on SEN just stated “fair chance to go”

Collingwood and Essendon the two interested, said he was unsure how interested Essendon actually are.

Seems to intimate to be Collingwood vs our offer.

 

[giantroo]

Zurhaar is the other player in the quartet who is in demand as he weighs up whether to keep the faith with the Kangaroos or move to a contender, with Collingwood one of the clubs monitoring the bustling forward.

If he decides to leave and the compensation was inadequate, North Melbourne could match any offer if they wanted to enforce a trade for Zurhaar.

Musical chairs in Blues’ attack as club favourite waits on new deal; Restricted free agent numbers dwindle

A key member of Carlton’s modern-day mosquito fleet is waiting patiently for a new deal, the (restricted) free agent four and the unrestricted free agent in demand.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Devski]

personally I think by far the best outcome for the club would be to match an offer and force a trade.

Decent player. Loved most of his work. But I don’t think he is a required player personally.

Ford and Duursma are replacements to my eye and they’ll peak at a better time for the club. In the mean time cash in Cam for the most value he will bring and try and secure a leadership player with whatever we get for him.

If he does leave I hope he scrapes every dollar he can and sets himself up for life. I’d wish him all success except for beating North

 

[Orange Peanut]

I just want to hear he wants to stay. No begging or overpaying. There are enough top- tier blokes committing to the place, I don't know that Cam offers so much you'd bend over backwards to appease him.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

I've come to realise I'd like to see improvements and team success before committing to supporting Cameron Zurhaar any further.

The f*cking cheek of the guy saying that then doing a Dennis Lillie windup to the season, only really playing good football post-bye.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

Excellent analysis and I guess it begs the question what is Cam's worth to us - especially considering Zane is probably going to be playing a similar role.

Is pick 19ish adequate compensation for a player who could be somewhat surplus to requirements?

I don’t know how you do it Rawlings, but if you were to cash in Cam and through picks swaps turn him into Kako or another awesome crumbing forward, that would be a massive win.

Cam is a match-winner, and more than that, the guy has star power and pull. He would be perfect for any club like Essendon who panders to their fan base.

 

[SpiderBurton22]

Peter Ryan on SEN just stated “fair chance to go”

Collingwood and Essendon the two interested, said he was unsure how interested Essendon actually are.

Seems to intimate to be Collingwood vs our offer.

Peter Ryan is a Collingwood nuffie

 

[lockheed]

Peter Ryan is a Collingwood nuffie

Collingwood nuffie - isn't that a tautology?

 

[Jimmy's Hot Dogs]

It's nice when they answer you back. I got a reply from Paul Scheer on Facebook today, felt well chuffed.

 

[King Corey]

personally I think by far the best outcome for the club would be to match an offer and force a trade.

Decent player. Loved most of his work. But I don’t think he is a required player personally.

Ford and Duursma are replacements to my eye and they’ll peak at a better time for the club. In the mean time cash in Cam for the most value he will bring and try and secure a leadership player with whatever we get for him.

If he does leave I hope he scrapes every dollar he can and sets himself up for life. I’d wish him all success except for beating North

Nice. Good for you.

If Cam can't see a future for himself at a club where several high quality team mates showed their faith, where the supporters love him and he's made his name and would rather join the sheep at * or Collingwood..

..Then I couldn't give a **** how it turns out for him. I don't generally cheer on * and Collingwood players on big money.

 

[Engimal v3]

If another club is offering him $800k+, I couldn't blame him for taking it - but $750k is a more than fair offer from us.

 

[harper2bastinac]

The club better match if he does choose * or the pies, don’t care about another top 3 pick, would rather make either of them pay premium which includes a best 22 player and pick.
no way do we help these clubs fill holes for free

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

Collingwood nuffie - isn't that a tautology?

Match any bid. First rounder to North> Cam and Change back to the Pies.