AFL Player # 9: Dylan Shiel - 3AW interview -16/8

[Beerfish]

Contract Status: Out of contract 2024 2025
My Boy Draft 2024: Pick 35, eth-dog

 

[DERO]

Just trying to help you out with the facts to pull you out from your delusion. Don't base your opinions in fantasies you've created in your head. Shiel wasn't sold a lemon, contemporaneous accounts show that.

Not to mention that he has also been paid handsomely for his time!

 

[Lore]

If he doesn’t want to be here then he should go. Sounds like someone will get a bargain.

 

[The Donners]

If the plan this off-season is to bring in quality and experienced heads who lead by (good) example then Shiel leaving would be counterproductive. I also understand our midfield balance isn’t right and I personally have no interest in playing Shiel as a small forward particularly if Gresham does find his way to Essendon. It’s a conundrum.

 

[Wahooti Fandango]

The type of player that could be a weapon in a really good team. So move him on, I say.

 

[yodellinhank]

If he doesn’t want to be here then he should go. Sounds like someone will get a bargain.

 

[faible]

Just trying to help you out with the facts to pull you out from your delusion. Don't base your opinions in fantasies you've created in your head. Shiel wasn't sold a lemon, contemporaneous accounts show that.

Your facts are the kind that are very selective and very misrepresented though, so they’re largely worthless to discuss.

 

[yodellinhank]

Your facts are the kind that are very selective and very misrepresented though, so they’re largely worthless to discuss.

Selected for the conversation at hand. Looking at the relevant information is a better way of analysing a situation than simply making up your mind and creating fantasy stories around that.

What was Shiel sold when he came to the club? Sounds like he knew we were a couple of players short. If you have information to the contrary I'm happy to hear it?

 

[Lore]

Selected for the conversation at hand. Looking at the relevant information is a better way of analysing a situation than simply making up your mind and creating fantasy stories around that.

What was Shiel sold when he came to the club? Sounds like he knew we were a couple of players short. If you have information to the contrary I'm happy to hear it?

It's kinda like he was shopping for lemons anyway.

In 2018 he was apparently picking from Essendon, Carlton, and Hawthorn.

Essendon's coach was John "Learnings" Worsfold, and went from 11th to 16th most experienced list in that off-season. Our most recent finals appearance was 12 months earlier, in 2017, and we hadn't won a final since 2004.

Since 2018, Essendon has changed their coach twice and earned a finals berth twice, but haven't won one. The list was and remains one of the least experienced in the competition, but as of the end of the bye rounds in 2023 were sitting 8-6 and looked like playing finals.

In 2018, Carlton's coach was Brendon "Clarko's apprentice" Bolton, they'd just won a wooden spoon and went from 14th to 17th most experienced list in the comp that off-season. Their most recent finals appearance was 2013, when they made finals from 9th after Essendon was evicted. That was also the last time they'd won a final; the most recent time that they'd earned a win other than that was in 2011, with that also being their most recently earned finals berth until 2023.

Since 2018, Carlton has changed their coach twice and earned a finals berth once, being this year, and winning their first final in a decade just in the last month. As of the 2023 bye they were sitting 5-1-8 and looking for all the world like they were aiming for the spoon rather than the flag.

In 2018, Hawthorn's coach was Alastair "GOAT" Clarkson, and they'd just played in and lost a final. They were the most experienced team in the comp in 2018 and remained so after the 2018 off-season. Their most recent finals win was 2015, which coincidentally is also the last time they won a flag.

Since 2018, Hawthorn have changed their coach, missed finals in 2019 and haven't got anywhere near it since, with the amount of experience on their list toppling from 1st to 18th in the comp in the space of 3 years. They have a combined 66 losses out of 106 games played. If he'd chosen to go there they'd have on-traded him 3 years ago already.


Carlton only looks good through the lens of strong recency bias. Otherwise he was choosing between bad and worse, and he chose bad.

 

[DERO]

If only he could make lemonade.

 

[Squeaky]

Fair to say we have been a dysfunctional club. Would he have come to us if he had have known?

 

[Darealrath]

The type of player that could be a weapon in a really good team. So move him on, I say.

Agree. If he wants to go then the club should facilitate it unless he and the clubs that are after him make completely unreasonable demands/offers. I wouldn't be expecting more than a late second rounder given his age.

Gotta say I don't really like the "sold a lemon" argument though - Goddard's case is the exception given the saga. We brought in players like Shiel on big money to elevate the level to achieve success, not to be a passenger along for the ride to success. Therefore they have some accountability for the lack of success as senior star players who should be leading on and off the field.

 

[Wahooti Fandango]

View attachment 1812280

 

[faible]

Selected for the conversation at hand. Looking at the relevant information is a better way of analysing a situation than simply making up your mind and creating fantasy stories around that.

What was Shiel sold when he came to the club? Sounds like he knew we were a couple of players short. If you have information to the contrary I'm happy to hear it?

Or it’s confirmation bias.

 

[yodellinhank]

Or it’s confirmation bias.

Confirmation bias based on evidence, as opposed to your delusion based on pure fantasy?

It just makes more sense, to me, that comments at the time from Shiel or attributed to him by his management would be a better indicator of what he was sold by the club than some story you seem to have made up off the top of your head and think you can pass off with authority.

 

[Godzke]

Fair to say we have been a dysfunctional club. Would he have come to us if he had have known?

I wouldn't exactly say Hawthorn or Carlton have been that "functional" over recent years.

I'm not convinced Shiel's future would've been any better at either of those two clubs, particularly when they had Patrick Cripps and Tom Mitchell as clear #1 inside ball winners. Shiel had a decent head start on Parish, and still couldn't hold onto a secondary role into the team.

 

[Lore]

Confirmation bias based on evidence, as opposed to your delusion based on pure fantasy?

It just makes more sense, to me, that comments at the time from Shiel or attributed to him by his management would be a better indicator of what he was sold by the club than some story you seem to have made up off the top of your head and think you can pass off with authority.

Speaking of authorities... I presume the OED counts as one when it comes to defining the meaning of words:

confirmation bias (n.) The tendency to seek or favour new information which supports one’s existing theories or beliefs, while avoiding or rejecting that which disrupts them.​

 

[yodellinhank]

Speaking of authorities... I presume the OED counts as one when it comes to defining the meaning of words:

confirmation bias (n.) The tendency to seek or favour new information which supports one’s existing theories or beliefs, while avoiding or rejecting that which disrupts them.​

What information have I avoided/rejected? Where is the information that suggests Shiel was promised finals? I haven't been presented any.

 

[Old Campaigner]

I don't have any sources and I cbf looking it up but I'd be very surprised if our presentation to Shiel was "wanna help us rebuild?"

Also the club clearly had finals on the mind at the time and was busily topping up with Smith, Stringer et al.

Reading between the lines I'd be extremely confident that being part of Essendon's next premiership was part of the discussions we had with Shiel.

 

[Lore]

I don't have any sources and I cbf looking it up but I'd be very surprised if our presentation to Shiel was "wanna help us rebuild?"

Also the club clearly had finals on the mind at the time and was busily topping up with Smith, Stringer et al.

Reading between the lines I'd be extremely confident that being part of Essendon's next premiership was part of the discussions we had with Shiel.

Yeah, the conversation he had with the player representatives; Heppell, Merrett, Daniher and Fantasia.

 

[Kong]

 

[Runk]

If only he could make lemonade.

View attachment v09044g40000cjvk6nrc77u29v161o90.mov

Straight from the playbook....

 

[jmoo wan]

now that Massimo is leaving we desperately need to keep him

 

[The Donners]

now that Massimo is leaving we desperately need to keep him

Why? I mean I’m more than ok with keeping him.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I certainly agree we need his experience as we're so young... but pick 13 for him would be ridiculous overs. He played 12 games this year and was sub / subbed in three of them.

I'd take that and run.

 

[Phone]

if you need experience...just call travis boak

10

Travis Boak

Age

36

Ht

183cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.7

5star

K

11.6

4star

HB

12.0

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

22.0

5star

K

11.0

4star

HB

11.0

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.9

5star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

9.0

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.4

4star

up or something. like, it's so obviously the right thing to move shiel on, particularly when it'd basically be a 'created' pick anyway. we stupidly went for it when the players returned from the ban (smith, stringer, saad then shiel the next season) and when it went bad (saad, daniher, faz, conor leaving), we should have traded shiel. if we can trade shiel now we need to take it and run