Coach Adam Simpson Megathread est. 2017 - Staying for 2024, Lyon’s Cryin’

[NYRB]

As for Simpson, clearly there was a change in gameplan in the first few games we saw it, then half way through the derby after the injuries we got struck by a dead elephant rolling down hill.

Yeh Saturday was shithouse, but how are they supposed to train with 26??

A lot of teams have adopted a fast paced , free-flowing style of footy. The Eagles and Freo were one of the last few teams to change their outdated styles from previous seasons. The Eagles preferred to play the chip-mark , moving the ball more methodically out of defence in 2019-2022. The game has evolved in that time, and the Eagles are paying a price now adapting to this new style.

The style will mean the Eagles will suffer more heavy defeats at the cost of narrow 4-6 goal losses.

With the season over now, I think Simpson will be prepared to accept a 1-2 win season at the cost of a future game style that the Eagles will most likely adapt. Players that will suffer as a result of the new game style? Gaff, Duggan, Withered, Cole to name a few.

 

[the harry]

China nuke us....100% Trev survives!

I can see the nickname "cockroach" having traction with some

 

[VicBased]

Thats just a money saving attitude. What you say may happen, probably will as we are so conservative but what should happen is one simple question. Do we believe Adam will be our next premiership coach? Yes Or No. If it is No then he should be removed immediately. Money should not even be discussed or come into it.

Yeah, and then we will have a new coach to pay out on and drag through the mud because, well it's just what we do.

 

[Chump Change]

Yeah, and then we will have a new coach to pay out on and drag through the mud because, well it's just what we do.

That's a massive issue. We give a new coach a list that is bottom 4 for the next 3 years. We're almost guaranteeing failure. So many rookie coaches try to force results when the list is really bad, and then make a meal of the whole thing. Matthew Nicks from Adelaide is a rare exception who held his nerve and didn't buckle to pressure. But most coaches like Noble and Teague - they buckle. I bet if David Noble was thrown into another club, he'd be able to coach.

So for me timing is critical. We have a coach that on one hand has made some serious mistakes, but on the other has won a flag. He wants to coach. He's completely bought into a full rebuild. He's able to stand up to pressure of losing. He's essentially going about business how I would expect an experienced coach to go about business given the dire state of our list.

He's the perfect guy to nurse us through a list regeneration. The only reason I would be punting him is if another coach became available who we had to have. The only guy I'd want is Pyke. Hypothetically, Clarko and Lyon are no. And as good as Hardwick and Longmire are, there are also no.

Let's see where we are at at the end of next year. My expectation will be:

Reid/Moir, Ginbey, Hewitt, Culley
OA and another KPF potentially taken top 5
Barrass, Bazzo, and another KPD taken in Rnd 2
and some gems out of Hough, Long, Chez, Burgiel and 6-8 other players taken over the next 2 drafts

You can't build that list being 10th - 12th. You have to have some downtime. So why wouldn't we use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure?

 

[garlic munchers]

That's a massive issue. We give a new coach a list that is bottom 4 for the next 3 years. We're almost guaranteeing failure. So many rookie coaches try to force results when the list is really bad, and then make a meal of the whole thing. Matthew Nicks from Adelaide is a rare exception who held his nerve and didn't buckle to pressure. But most coaches like Noble and Teague - they buckle. I bet if David Noble was thrown into another club, he'd be able to coach.

So for me timing is critical. We have a coach that on one hand has made some serious mistakes, but on the other has won a flag. He wants to coach. He's completely bought into a full rebuild. He's able to stand up to pressure of losing. He's essentially going about business how I would expect an experienced coach to go about business given the dire state of our list.

He's the perfect guy to nurse us through a list regeneration. The only reason I would be punting him is if another coach became available who we had to have. The only guy I'd want is Pyke. Hypothetically, Clarko and Lyon are no. And as good as Hardwick and Longmire are, there are also no.

Let's see where we are at at the end of next year. My expectation will be:

Reid/Moir, Ginbey, Hewitt, Culley
OA and another KPF potentially taken top 5
Barrass, Bazzo, and another KPD taken in Rnd 2
and some gems out of Hough, Long, Chez, Burgiel and 6-8 other players taken over the next 2 drafts

You can't build that list being 10th - 12th. You have to have some downtime. So why wouldn't we use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure?

Probably just as well the Hawks/Tigers didn't respectively decide against taking the inexperienced Clarkson and Hardwick after both finished 2nd last.

7 odd premierships later and just maybe, you don't have to "use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure".

Arguably the Western Bulldogs also appointed the inexperienced Beveridge after they bottomed out with two 15 places in 2013 and 2014 and were in the middle of the rebuild and then way overperformed to win the premiership before anyone predicted it happening.

The AFL and WC now have a lot in common with the inner need to circle the wagons and protect the boys, because if one wagon goes then this may expose the others to scrutiny.

Instead of 3 F's we now have the 3 S's, Sycophants, Simmo and Shite.

If Simmo/the club are so great how do you explain this assistant coach assortment?






Really?

 

[bzparkes]

Probably just as well the Hawks/Tigers didn't respectively decide against taking the inexperienced Clarkson and Hardwick after both finished 2nd last.

7 odd premierships later and just maybe, you don't have to "use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure".

Arguably the Western Bulldogs also appointed the inexperienced Beveridge after they bottomed out with two 15 places in 2013 and 2014 and were in the middle of the rebuild and then way overperformed to win the premiership before anyone predicted it happening.

The AFL and WC now have a lot in common with the inner need to circle the wagons and protect the boys, because if one wagon goes then this may expose the others to scrutiny.

Instead of 3 F's we now have the 3 S's, Sycophants, Simmo and Shite.

If Simmo/the club are so great how do you explain this assistant coach assortment?


View attachment 1676068

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Really?

At least 5 of those blokes have only been there what, 18 months? Not sure using them backs up your argument...

Clarkson & Hardwick aren't exactly great examples either. Both got generational talents via the draft, that were able to take them to multiple grand finals/premierships, although in Hawthorn's case it wasn't Franklin but rather Hodge who was the main driver for success. Both clubs also ha many 10 top picks, something WCE have never had the luxury of due to never being shit for a sustained period.

Both clubs also went through a significant period of utter shitness prior to Clarkson & Hardwick being appointed. Both clubs also heavily invested in the draft, then topped up with FA's/trades (Hawks - Lake, Rich - Lynch/Prestia) as the final pieces.

Not saying that Simmo will be the guy long-term but you're comparing apples with oranges here.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

“Here’s a bunch of headshots of the coaching panel. Nothing more needs to be said.

…does it?”

 

[UseR2006]

At least 5 of those blokes have only been there what, 18 months? Not sure using them backs up your argument...

Clarkson & Hardwick aren't exactly great examples either. Both got generational talents via the draft, that were able to take them to multiple grand finals/premierships, although in Hawthorn's case it wasn't Franklin but rather Hodge who was the main driver for success. Both clubs also ha many 10 top picks, something WCE have never had the luxury of due to never being s**t for a sustained period.

Both clubs also went through a significant period of utter shitness prior to Clarkson & Hardwick being appointed. Both clubs also heavily invested in the draft, then topped up with FA's/trades (Hawks - Lake, Rich - Lynch/Prestia) as the final pieces.

Not saying that Simmo will be the guy long-term but you're comparing apples with oranges here.

In Richmonds case they also stuck it out with Hardwick even when things looked bad and gave him time to turn it around.
People look at Richmond like it was some amazing success but it only was successfull because they didn't jump at shadows and sack him.

 

[bzparkes]

In Richmonds case they also stuck it out with Hardwick even when things looked bad and gave him time to turn it around.
People look at Richmond like it was some amazing success but it only was successfull because they didn't jump at shadows and sack him.

Yep and they had a long history of sacking coaches prior to that, as well as making terrible appointments and drafting decisions.

 

[new breed]

Horsley and J Schofield are options in the near future for higher opportunity within the club in my opinion .
However Simmo is pretty good handles situations pretty well and players and prospective players from the ND like him with positive opinions on Simmo .

 

[Chump Change]

Probably just as well the Hawks/Tigers didn't respectively decide against taking the inexperienced Clarkson and Hardwick after both finished 2nd last.

7 odd premierships later and just maybe, you don't have to "use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure".

Arguably the Western Bulldogs also appointed the inexperienced Beveridge after they bottomed out with two 15 places in 2013 and 2014 and were in the middle of the rebuild and then way overperformed to win the premiership before anyone predicted it happening.

The AFL and WC now have a lot in common with the inner need to circle the wagons and protect the boys, because if one wagon goes then this may expose the others to scrutiny.

Instead of 3 F's we now have the 3 S's, Sycophants, Simmo and Shite.

If Simmo/the club are so great how do you explain this assistant coach assortment?


View attachment 1676068

View attachment 1676069

Really?

We're still going to be second last at the end of next year, possibly the year after.

Why do you think we need to hire a new untried coach right now?

Because you're emotional? Because you can't cope being down the bottom? Because you want immediate mediocre results right now at the expense of top draft talent?

Sorry, but the whole way you think is simplistic and emotional.

 

[Dale Doback]

We're still going to be second last at the end of next year, possibly the year after.

Why do you think we need to hire a new untried coach right now?

Because you're emotional? Because you can't cope being down the bottom? Because you want immediate mediocre results right now at the expense of top draft talent?

Sorry, but the whole way you think is simplistic and emotional.

I don't think he's emotional. I took it that he thinks it's a shit coaching staff. And aside from Knights and Schofield I'd agree. The rest should go at years end, especially Bell who's got to be ultimately the most accountable.

 

[DanWCE]

Probably just as well the Hawks/Tigers didn't respectively decide against taking the inexperienced Clarkson and Hardwick after both finished 2nd last.

7 odd premierships later and just maybe, you don't have to "use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure".

Arguably the Western Bulldogs also appointed the inexperienced Beveridge after they bottomed out with two 15 places in 2013 and 2014 and were in the middle of the rebuild and then way overperformed to win the premiership before anyone predicted it happening.

The AFL and WC now have a lot in common with the inner need to circle the wagons and protect the boys, because if one wagon goes then this may expose the others to scrutiny.

Instead of 3 F's we now have the 3 S's, Sycophants, Simmo and Shite.

If Simmo/the club are so great how do you explain this assistant coach assortment?


View attachment 1676068

View attachment 1676069

Really?

The Bevo example is an interesting one. They had to turn their form into something real, for sure, but the red carpet was rolled out for that flag run.

Let's not forget the rules were changed to introduce a pre-finals bye so they could recall a heap of their most talented players and the AFL came out and admitted the Grand Final umpiring was way off the mark of what was expected.

At least the Dogs were already blessed with a heap of young talent much like the Hawks in 08. We're a little way off having our list dynamic look that way.

 

[Rowan18]

The Bevo example is an interesting one. They had to turn their form into something real, for sure, but the red carpet was rolled out for that flag run.

Let's not forget the rules were changed to introduce a pre-finals bye so they could recall a heap of their most talented players and the AFL came out and admitted the Grand Final umpiring was way off the mark of what was expected.

At least the Dogs were already blessed with a heap of young talent much like the Hawks in 08. We're a little way off having our list dynamic look that way.

I think that's the pattern that Garlic Munchers missed. All of these examples are when a young coach walked into a team that had already hit the draft hard for a few seasons. It's very likely that the same thing will happen to us in 2026.

We probably finish bottom 4-6 next year and will have had three years of bottom 4 drafting (2022-2024) plus 2021. The draftees from 2021-2023 would have their 50 games, the ones from 2024 will have 15-20. That's plenty for them to start performing consistently and the new coach can surge up the ladder in 2026.

I agree with others that the end of 2020 was the time to sack Simmo, but now we're better off keeping him around to take the hits in the down years.

 

[DanWCE]

I think that's the pattern that Garlic Munchers missed. All of these examples are when a young coach walked into a team that had already hit the draft hard for a few seasons. It's very likely that the same thing will happen to us in 2026.

We probably finish bottom 4-6 next year and will have had three years of bottom 4 drafting (2022-2024) plus 2021. The draftees from 2021-2023 would have their 50 games, the ones from 2024 will have 15-20. That's plenty for them to start performing consistently and the new coach can surge up the ladder in 2026.

I agree with others that the end of 2020 was the time to sack Simmo, but now we're better off keeping him around to take the hits in the down years.

Agree with you. I'm not convinced Simmo will be around to steer us through our next finals campaign, but he's the best man for the job to eat this shit sandwich for the next year or two. Once we've got a full cupboard of ripping youth we can reassess and the stars might align for a fresh voice.

As for what Simmo does when he hands back the baton, any chance he would stay on in a director of coaching type role, or do we need more fresh air for a new coach to step into?

He seems very well established in WA, think he still has kids in school. Maybe the Purps lure him over to do a similar role if he wants a break from being head coach.

 

[UseR2006]

The thing for me is what did we want Simmo to do at the end of the year?
-Play the Youth
- start trimming the older players
-start trimming the bottom end that aren't going to make it.

Last year between retirements and delistings we got cut-
Hugh Dixon

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Hugh Dixon

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4.0

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(del)
Tom Joyce (del)
Josh Kennedy (ret)
Zac Langdon

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Zac Langdon

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0.3

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6.3

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3.3

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3.0

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1.3

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0.3

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6.3

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3.3

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3.0

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1.3

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Patrick Naish

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Patrick Naish

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16.0

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2.3

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0.7

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D

9.0

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3.0

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6.0

3star

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0.0

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3.0

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1.0

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16.0

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9.3

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6.7

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3.0

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2.3

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(del)
Jackson Nelson

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Jackson Nelson

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3.2

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184.8

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14.8

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K

10.0

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4.8

3star

M

4.3

4star

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2.3

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171.8

3star

D

8.6

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.8

4star

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127.0

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(del)
Jack Redden

8

Jack Redden

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34

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85kg

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21.6

5star

K

11.0

4star

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10.6

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4.7

4star

T

5.7

5star

CL

3.9

5star

D

15.0

4star

K

7.3

3star

HB

7.8

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.3

3star

CL

1.5

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D

15.4

4star

K

7.8

3star

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7.6

5star

M

4.0

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T

4.8

5star

(ret)
Junior Rioli (trd)
Zane Trew (del)
Isiah Winder (del)

Yes, a bunch of those were SSP and we brought back Winder and Trew via rookie draft (we wouldn't have got much better).
So 5 from the main list and likely to be another 5 again this year gone.
From what i can there is already an easy 5 to go before we touch the experienced players -

Foley, West, Clark, Trew, Winder can go.
Can also then look at Hurn/Shuey/Yeo/Nic Nat and see which are likely to in the short term to keep some experience around our youth.

You can only sack as many as you are going to bring in so im not sure what more you lot would have wanted simmo to have done last year and what more he could be doing now? Kids are getting games, older players are getting cut/retiring and our trash is slowly getting filtered out without doing a north/hawks where we just gut everything.

 

[bzparkes]

Agree with you. I'm not convinced Simmo will be around to steer us through our next finals campaign, but he's the best man for the job to eat this s**t sandwich for the next year or two. Once we've got a full cupboard of ripping youth we can reassess and the stars might align for a fresh voice.

As for what Simmo does when he hands back the baton, any chance he would stay on in a director of coaching type role, or do we need more fresh air for a new coach to step into?

He seems very well established in WA, think he still has kids in school. Maybe the Purps lure him over to do a similar role if he wants a break from being head coach.

Seems pretty invested in the club. I'd be happy for him to replace Bell as football manager. Popular among the players, handles the media very well and has the club's best interests in heart, although he's admitted to dialing that back publicly this year as nobody listens to what a coach says anyway.

 

[Chump Change]

I don't think he's emotional. I took it that he thinks it's a s**t coaching staff. And aside from Knights and Schofield I'd agree. The rest should go at years end, especially Bell who's got to be ultimately the most accountable.

He's definitely emotional.

So he thinks the coaching staff are bad. I can only assume this means he thinks a different coaching team can get better result. And have us higher up the ladder.

How is that a better scenario? How does that get us closer to a flag?

 

[Chris_6678]

Seems pretty invested in the club. I'd be happy for him to replace Bell as football manager. Popular among the players, handles the media very well and has the club's best interests in heart, although he's admitted to dialing that back publicly this year as nobody listens to what a coach says anyway.

You cant have the old coach in a role with a new one coming in.. It wouldnt look good.

 

[bzparkes]

You cant have the old coach in a role with a new one coming in.. It wouldnt look good.

I agree that the optics aren't necessarily great however Simmo strikes me as the kind of person who'd happily let another head coach take full control if he was in a different capacity.

I'd be 99.99% sure he wouldn't be at the club any longer when he eventually gets the flick though.

 

[The Dodger]

Please...Nisbett isn't contracted. He is stepping down when we settle in to the new stadium/training facility ... we see through the difficult time that COVID bought ... the Ukraine confilct en... well lets just say as soon as we have peace on Earth and there are no disturbing socio-economic situations. So...pretty much TBC.

 

[Rowan18]

I agree that the optics aren't necessarily great however Simmo strikes me as the kind of person who'd happily let another head coach take full control if he was in a different capacity.

I'd be 99.99% sure he wouldn't be at the club any longer when he eventually gets the flick though.

Nah, Woosha had the same attitude and even met with Simmo to take him through everything they had been doing. Simmo took it in and then swept it into the bin and started his own process. Also brought his own assistants in.

I remember him making public comments that he was amazed at how low the footy IQ of the team was and the lack of flexibility for players to perform different roles. I doubt that would go down well if Woosh was still in the club.

The new guy needs to be given space to go in his own direction.

 

[Godfather32]

I agree that the optics aren't necessarily great however Simmo strikes me as the kind of person who'd happily let another head coach take full control if he was in a different capacity.

I'd be 99.99% sure he wouldn't be at the club any longer when he eventually gets the flick though.

Nah, Simmo might take on a role like that but when he does it'll be at North Melbourne.
Middle-end of next year he'll leave here and then end up back at North in some non-coaching capacity

 

[new breed]

Simmo could replace Nisbett ....
Yes he could , just don't think he should , seems like a real tough gig right now .

 

[eagles rule]

Probably just as well the Hawks/Tigers didn't respectively decide against taking the inexperienced Clarkson and Hardwick after both finished 2nd last.

7 odd premierships later and just maybe, you don't have to "use an experienced coach who won't buckle to pressure".

Arguably the Western Bulldogs also appointed the inexperienced Beveridge after they bottomed out with two 15 places in 2013 and 2014 and were in the middle of the rebuild and then way overperformed to win the premiership before anyone predicted it happening.

The AFL and WC now have a lot in common with the inner need to circle the wagons and protect the boys, because if one wagon goes then this may expose the others to scrutiny.

Instead of 3 F's we now have the 3 S's, Sycophants, Simmo and Shite.

If Simmo/the club are so great how do you explain this assistant coach assortment?


View attachment 1676068

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Really?

So nobody wants to be the Defensive Coach ??


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