Multiplat AFL 23 - Part 2 with added Pro Team

[Kidneykid95]

Seems like patch notes are out already .. not sure how to feel about it.. thoughts??

ITS GONE LIVE ALSO! Just got it on PS5 = 1.7GB

 

[Quivorir]

Add in that the legends were probably promised a cut of the profits from the in-game micro transactions, then when the game launched they realised that would be bugger all, and wanted to renegotiate.

How on earth did you come to this conclusion?

 

[GetAroundHim99]

How on earth did you come to this conclusion?

I think Ol' Ross at one point said the retired players who signed up to be in Pro Team would get a cut of profits from it or that it would be put into a Past Players Trust. Something along the lines of that. Though knowing him, He could have been taking out of his own arse.

I don't think renegotiation would be out of the question considering how much of a mess AFL 23 has been but yeah, Probably more speculation. Speculation that will likely never be cleared up.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

The only thing that could possibly come out of all this, if Big Ant do drop the license, The AFL may for the first time put money into hiring a premium developer. Pie in the sky dream but you never know.

 

[GetAroundHim99]

The only thing that could possibly come out of all this, if Big Ant do drop the license, The AFL may for the first time put money into hiring a premium developer. Pie in the sky dream but you never know.

I'd love to see it but I can't see the AFL putting in the amount of money they'd have to put it just to get a Premium Developer interested. It would be a hell of a lot of money for not much in return. Just doesn't seem feasible TBH...

 

[kingcobey78]

Is that you Ross?

I have asked this question a while back. He seems to be the only person in the world that the game works flawlessly for. Either his expectations of an AFL game is extremely low or he just trolls on here.

I haven't been on this forum for a while but does not surprise me to see this game is still a steaming pile.

I look at people posting on social media asking "when is ultimate team coming?" I honestly do not believe it will be for AFL 23. I think Bigant bit off more than they can chew and "IF" Bigant do move forward with Pro Team it'll most likely be on their next AFL release (AFL 25). The sheer fact that no updates have been provided through their social media pages regarding what would be the mode most, if not all purchasers of AFL 23 are most interested in does not sit well for it coming anytime soon.

 

[Quivorir]

I called Freo16 out on some stuff a while back but he posted the videos to prove what he was saying was correct. It does seem to be like he's playing a completely different game to everyone else though.

 

[Freo16]

I called Freo16 out on some stuff a while back but he posted the videos to prove what he was saying was correct. It does seem to be like he's playing a completely different game to everyone else though.

I think most people get frustrated with the issues like ‘stuck in the mud’ and they give up before they get to where I am (which is understandable as the ‘mud’ issue is annoying)

But I’ve put up with a lot of crappy AFL games over the years and there’s a lot more good hidden under some of the bad in 23.

I'd love to see it but I can't see the AFL putting in the amount of money they'd have to put it just to get a Premium Developer interested. It would be a hell of a lot of money for not much in return. Just doesn't seem feasible TBH...

Out of curiosity, who would you consider to be a ‘premium developer’ ?

2K and EA would never take on a sport with such a small audience and it doesn’t make a tonne of sense giving an Australian exclusive sport to an American dev team.

In the world of Australian game development, Big Ant probably are a ‘premium developer’.

 

[Treehill23]

Out of curiosity, who would you consider to be a ‘premium developer’ ?

2K and EA would never take on a sport with such a small audience and it doesn’t make a tonne of sense giving an Australian exclusive sport to an American dev team.

In the world of Australian game development, Big Ant probably are a ‘premium developer’.

He pretty much said exactly that. He’d ’love’ to see a premium dev take over but can’t see it happening as it wouldn’t be feasible…

 

[GoldbergsGold]

I think most people get frustrated with the issues like ‘stuck in the mud’ and they give up before they get to where I am (which is understandable as the ‘mud’ issue is annoying)

It's not playable and not at all a deep experience. Players still stop altogether when receiving the ball, and do not respond properly to commands, when you need total control in order to play the sport properly. This isn't in other AFL games or any other sports games. So, you're better off going either back to an older AFL game. Also, the marking mechanics in the game are some of the worst barebones, all you need to do is lob the ball into the forward line and time it right to mark, since all it is 1v1's. The horrendous user commands, broken animations and barebones gameplay make it an experience that puts people off.

But I’ve put up with a lot of crappy AFL games over the years and there’s a lot more good hidden under some of the bad in 23.

And yet, there's a back catalogue of AFL games where you can actually control the players properly. It's a stark contrast going from Evolution 2 where you can actually control the players effortlessly, there's no stalling or players disobeying commands compared to AFL 23 where it's like trying to move a grand piano when controlling players.

2K and EA would never take on a sport with such a small audience and it doesn’t make a tonne of sense giving an Australian exclusive sport to an American dev team.

If Big Ant quit, and there's no more low budget developers left in Australia, that's when The AFL may consider putting money into paying someone like 2K or Konami. They may take video games more seriously as a way to market the sport overseas.

 

[Freo16]

It's not playable and not at all a deep experience. Players still stop altogether when receiving the ball, and do not respond properly to commands, when you need total control in order to play the sport properly. This isn't in other AFL games or any other sports games. So, you're better off going either back to an older AFL game. Also, the marking mechanics in the game are some of the worst barebones, all you need to do is lob the ball into the forward line and time it right to mark, since all it is 1v1's. The horrendous user commands, broken animations and barebones gameplay make it an experience that puts people off.

And yet, there's a back catalogue of AFL games where you can actually control the players properly. It's a stark contrast going from Evolution 2 where you can actually control the players effortlessly, there's no stalling or players disobeying commands compared to AFL 23 where it's like trying to move a grand piano when controlling players.

If Big Ant quit, and there's no more low budget developers left in Australia, that's when The AFL may consider putting money into paying someone like 2K or Konami. They may take video games more seriously as a way to market the sport overseas.

2K or Konami or any of these big studios will never take on AFL, it’s way too small an audience for them to make any money. You can’t seriously think this is in anyway a realistic possibility ?

 

[FearTheBeard13]

If Big Ant quit, and there's no more low budget developers left in Australia, that's when The AFL may consider putting money into paying someone like 2K or Konami. They may take video games more seriously as a way to market the sport overseas.

The AFL would never go for this sadly. There’s no large-scale developer that would even take the job on knowing the game wouldn't come close to breaking even, much less generate a profit. If anything, the AFL should’ve gone this route at the turn of the past 2 console generation changeovers but its far too complex a sport to accurately capture, big or small budget company.

 

[Quivorir]

Big ant is unfortunately our best shot. Hopefully someone has been humbled and we get a better go next time.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

2K or Konami or any of these big studios will never take on AFL, it’s way too small an audience for them to make any money. You can’t seriously think this is in anyway a realistic possibility ?

I already said it was a pie in the sky thought, The AFL would have to see it as a "marketing exercise" to invest real money into gaming.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

If anything, the AFL should’ve gone this route at the turn of the past 2 console generation changeovers but its far too complex a sport to accurately capture, big or small budget company.

I disagree, developers just focus on the wrong thing and waste money, labour and time on things ike "photogrammetry" instead of gameplay.

 

[LennyHayes77]

If the AFL wasn't run by dinsoaurs they could have developed a half decent game 15 years ago, when costs for video games weren't so oppressive. It could have been added to and improved over the years to a point that it was pretty much a simulation.

Then things like online play, ultimate team modes would have increased the popularity of the game and given it a leg up against other markets like rugby and soccer (at least be able to compete with Fifa in Australia)

 

[FearTheBeard13]

I disagree, developers just focus on the wrong thing and waste money, labour and time on things ike "photogrammetry" instead of gameplay.

I understand your point, but they also needed features to actually sell the game. Granted, gameplay should be the #1 option for every game being made, this game desperately needed to not look like a last gen game and offer something more than single games. They missed the mark in a lot of areas either way, so it was a destined L from the beginning.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

I understand your point, but they also needed features to actually sell the game. Granted, gameplay should be the #1 option for every game being made, this game desperately needed to not look like a last gen game and offer something more than single games. They missed the mark in a lot of areas either way, so it was a destined L from the beginning.

The game doesn't even have features, it doesn't even have a training mode. Graphically and presentation wise, it's never going to compete with big triple A titles, so there's no real point even wasting resources on that, should have just picked an art style and only done motion capture, no photogrammetry. Presumably the budget was in the millions, they could have easily simulated the sport.

 

[Mootsy]

A List and numbers update won't improve the gameplay though, if that's all that's coming.

I think we're all a bit perplexed as to why AFL23 seems in limbo right now. Is there even people working in the background on updating gameplay, just simple things, like, making tackling more dynamic, and handballs more 360 degrees and free flowing etc..fine tuning gameplay. Seems like they just gave up on it after the launch debacles. I mean, i want Big Ant to succeed with this and i paid 100 dollars to buy a game, that really just needs some basic testing and updating by humans with some rational analysis to improve tackling, hand-balling and movement, just to make it fun. Nothing drastic at all, just basic implementations to make going back and playing more of a want-able exercise.

I don't understand why the pause, when so many people in the AFL fraternity were likely involved in assisting the game's realism and many players would have bought the game to own, ex-players, coaches, fans, and so wouldn't you want to have a game that is at least, at a more free-flowing and playable standard, just to keep the fraternity/AFL happy, if nothing else. That literally, 3 people could be working on in the background to at least implement simple improvements rather than an actual long pause.

Looks as if Cricket24 has actually gone pretty well, there were some bugs initially, but from what i'm reading people are enjoying the game, as for the tennis game, it's reportedly getting there now, the team have been updating it based on feedback and it's getting there. Then they move onto the Rugby game.

The reasons i don't play AFL23 as much as i should: (I feel a better play and testing analysis would have sorted these things out last year). These are the aspects that stop me from wanting to play over and over again, which AFL Live (2011) had, and i think that's why it was so successful.

• Tackling is way too fast and reactive by the AI. You barely get a second with the ball to run before you get tackled to the ground, and even a quick-fire handball release is no guarantee you won't be just locked in for a ball-up. Even on easy-mode.
• Hand-balling is a bit hit and miss. You can string some good plays, but often the direction and measure of the pass doesn't go to plan, even intuitively.
• The player animation dynamics are quite rigid, in terms of play-on and movement in the F50. So just say you get the ball, sell the dummy and kick a snap, it doesn't feel quite natural and exciting enough, but it's ok. Even AFL Live did this better i feel.
• More marking variations would open the game a bit. So marking, dive and stretched out, a lead and chest mark, more variations of a jump and mark, contested marks, would give some more realism.
• I think there should be a better defensive bump(hip and shoulder) option to stop a player from marking. Just to make it easier to bump. Or a better version of the 'Bump' mode when running to gather the ball.
• There seems to be an invisible bubble around contests, sometimes, where you have no control to move towards the ball, like being locked out of the contest for no reason because the AI has taken control using some voodoo magic.

 

[GetAroundHim99]

Out of curiosity, who would you consider to be a ‘premium developer’ ?

2K and EA would never take on a sport with such a small audience and it doesn’t make a tonne of sense giving an Australian exclusive sport to an American dev team.

In the world of Australian game development, Big Ant probably are a ‘premium developer’.

He pretty much said exactly that. He’d ’love’ to see a premium dev take over but can’t see it happening as it wouldn’t be feasible…

Exactly that Treehill, Exactly that.

To be honest, If the only shot the AFL have of getting a game out is with Big Ant. They should probably just end the contract at this point. Big Ant have shown no reason to believe that next time will be any different and have proven time and time again in recent years that they are not up to the task of doing these games.

If the AFL were smart, They would take the money that they've been investing into Big Ant to make these game and invest it in growing the game outside of this country. If you grow the fanbase, You will grow the potential market for a game and then maybe sometime down the line, Someone who is a foreign dev team with some prestige might be interested in taking on the license.

But for now, It might just be best if everyone just stopped thinking about an AFL Video Game and what it needs to be and just leave it be for a good while and come back in 8-10 years when this entire ordeal is just a bad memory in the past and something can start to be built without pot shots to previous devs, people have lower expectations and more people are willing to give someone a chance to build something up over time.

We've been burned too much recently, We got let those wounds heel before we try again otherwise we're just gonna keep getting burned as consumers and the people making these find it overwhelming just to come up with a game because they're going to be requested everything under the sun and have their game hyped up to an absurd degree and not have the resources to do it.

A clear mind is what everyone needs and that's gonna take time to happen.

 

[Mootsy]

Exactly that Treehill, Exactly that.

To be honest, If the only shot the AFL have of getting a game out is with Big Ant. They should probably just end the contract at this point. Big Ant have shown no reason to believe that next time will be any different and have proven time and time again in recent years that they are not up to the task of doing these games.

If the AFL were smart, They would take the money that they've been investing into Big Ant to make these game and invest it in growing the game outside of this country. If you grow the fanbase, You will grow the potential market for a game and then maybe sometime down the line, Someone who is a foreign dev team with some prestige might be interested in taking on the license.

But for now, It might just be best if everyone just stopped thinking about an AFL Video Game and what it needs to be and just leave it be for a good while and come back in 8-10 years when this entire ordeal is just a bad memory in the past and something can start to be built without pot shots to previous devs, people have lower expectations and more people are willing to give someone a chance to build something up over time.

We've been burned too much recently, We got let those wounds heel before we try again otherwise we're just gonna keep getting burned as consumers and the people making these find it overwhelming just to come up with a game because they're going to be requested everything under the sun and have their game hyped up to an absurd degree and not have the resources to do it.

A clear mind is what everyone needs and that's gonna take time to happen.

I agree to an extent, but as i said above, i believe that just some simple play/testing/analysis could really go a long way. I feel like they just paused the potential improvements and left the game in limbo for no good reason. Some basic tweaking and the game could be free-flowing, arcady and fun at least. To just leave it where you get tackled way too easily, handballs don't feel intuitive enough, the bump is almost non-existent, marking feels too rigid etc. Say you have 3 people working in the background, maybe they release an update as the other new games are still being made and it gets people back playing again.

but they didn't do that, in the end.

 

[FearTheBeard13]

Do we believe the narrative still that the wrong version was uploaded to release or was the game at its best state on the day of? I’d like to know the truth despite the fact we’ll never hear it probably.

 

[Freo16]

I agree to an extent, but as i said above, i believe that just some simple play/testing/analysis could really go a long way. I feel like they just paused the potential improvements and left the game in limbo for no good reason. Some basic tweaking and the game could be free-flowing, arcady and fun at least. To just leave it where you get tackled way too easily, handballs don't feel intuitive enough, the bump is almost non-existent, marking feels too rigid etc. Say you have 3 people working in the background, maybe they release an update as the other new games are still being made and it gets people back playing again.

but they didn't do that, in the end.

I’m pretty sure JNT has said that the game has been worked on in the background over the off-season.

If limited testing resources has been the problem at big ant then I have no problem with them working on the game and testing over the off-season so hopefully when the 24 update comes out, they’ve got thoroughly tested improvements rather than releasing patches during the off-season.

Wouldn’t be surprised if we hear something this week (but also wouldn’t be surprised if we don’t )

 

[GetAroundHim99]

Do we believe the narrative still that the wrong version was uploaded to release or was the game at its best state on the day of? I’d like to know the truth despite the fact we’ll never hear it probably.

Same here but the likely answer is that it was at it's best state on the day of but they botched the day one patch and it broke everything else that wasn't already broken. It wasn't meant to be broken to the point that it wouldn't start and the ball couldn't be picked up but it was still nowhere close to being ready.

 

[FearTheBeard13]

Same here but the likely answer is that it was at it's best state on the day of but they botched the day one patch and it broke everything else that wasn't already broken. It wasn't meant to be broken to the point that it wouldn't start and the ball couldn't be picked up but it was still nowhere close to being ready.

Agreed! I 110% believe it wasnt ready for its May 4th release and it makes me wonder why they even had the Launch Night when that was barely a month ahead of time.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

Same here but the likely answer is that it was at it's best state on the day of but they botched the day one patch and it broke everything else that wasn't already broken. It wasn't meant to be broken to the point that it wouldn't start and the ball couldn't be picked up but it was still nowhere close to being ready.

The demos looked to have the same user command issues, noticeably the players have strange stutter movements. The game looks far more improved from those demos via the patching in the released version, but the game remains broken with the user commands being the worst that I've ever experienced in any video game.