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Markfs said:
It seems all israelis and their apologists have this need to call people to heel to what's important to them. I notice that even with Piers Morgan continually requiring all palestinian supporters to condemn what happened on oct 7th before he allows them to speak their mind.

You can condemn the deaths of hostages yourself adequately. You dont need me. We havent heard the full story about what happened to the man. The Israelis admitted that hostages were killed by Israelis during the bombing, although they say that he showed signs of torture. Excuse me if I dont believe what they say. Actually, I dont believe a lot of what hamas says. So I'm not going to condemn something that hasnt been proved.

I condemned the israelis for the death of hind rajab because there was no possible valid excuse for her death. So I didnt believe the lies that the israelis provided. The israelis have killed people simply for being palestinian. Define that in any way you wish. Whether the reason to kill is religious-based or a desire to rid them of their presence, I dont know enough. Maybe you can say.

Finally, I've watched Mark Regev lie over and over again for a long time. In this last episode, we have discovered that Netinyahoo has fostered Hamas as means of marginalising the PA and to encourage an atmosphere which would allow more land grabs. It is now clear.....even to the pro israeli gov'ts around the world... that netinyahoo and his gov't has no intention of trying for peace with the palestinians. I'm on a computer and it has been obvious to me for 20 or 30 years that that was the case. But the realisation may just have arrived for Penny, but I still doubt it. Too many bribes and threat money has been dealt out over decades for israel to crumble so easily. If I were you, I'd still be confident of getting my promised land.

THis isnt the first time that I've felt the need to express myself and I've been abused a number of times over the years for some reason. I am so insignificant in this matter. But if you like, call me ignorant or you can go back to calling me anti-semitic, if it makes you feel better.
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This is pretty much what the Hamas apologists do in here but in reverse.
 
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JB1975 said:
Your comments are purely emotive, completely detached from fact.

There is no indication in anything you write that you're aware of broader perspectives, or should I say that there is no nuance in what you write.

I've been a supporter of Israel my entire life, and yet apparently my position on Palestinians suggests that I have a contrary agenda.

I ask you to consider the perception of the US from a non-Australian perspective, and your kneejerk reaction is to accuse me of 'shaping a narrative' to blame America for everything.

In other words, your responses are childish.

You say it's 'blatantly clear' that I have 'agendas', and I say (a) who the f*** doesn't? and (b) could you really delineate what my agendas (ie perspectives) are?
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To be blunt I've had an agenda exposing the ratbaggery of the far left, contributing with links I've produced in this thread,

Clementine Ford doxxing a Jewish community and they subsequently received death threats.
Fayeh Tash burning down his burger joint and blaming it on the Jewish community in Caufield.
I could go on and on and on.
My agenda was at odds with people in here and I received vitriol because there are people in here who are the very people who are attending the 'where's the Jews' protests or likeminded protests on October 8th.
I know you're from a different cloth to some of the Wesley college toff types, and that you have acknowledged the wrongs of Fayeh Tash. But if you grew up with a silver spoon in your mouth from Prarhan or had the privilege to go to Wesley College, just give the social justice privilege cards a bit of a rest for a change because others come from the real world and not what's written in a politics tutorial. FFS. For what it's worth, I've got the experience of both.

What is really annoying about me for the people offended by my posting is that I don't care for the right. They are not my people. I don't care for America, or its demise. I've been critical of Israel, I've acknowledged the points you've made. I've praised you a number of times, and yet this has not been reciprocated and any struggles that I've personally had are simply laughed at by the moral police in this thread who more often than not are born with a silver spoon in their mouth, and that's unappealing to say the least. You lot think it's OK to laugh at mental health jibes, it's OK for you to be combative or just simply call someone you don't like a fw is completely fine and reasonable - which is what's been happening. And the Wesley type from Parhran are supposed to be the moral police.

These people are lost to me, they can NEVER win me over.
 
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vindaloo said:
To be blunt I've had an agenda exposing the ratbaggery of the far left, contributing with links I've produced in this thread,

Clementine Ford doxxing a Jewish community and they subsequently received death threats.
Fayeh Tash burning down his burger joint and blaming it on the Jewish community in Caufield.
I could go on and on and on.
My agenda was at odds with people in here and I received vitriol because there are people in here who are the very people who are attending the 'where's the Jews' protests or likeminded protests on October 8th.
I know you're from a different cloth to some of the Wesley college toff types, and that you have acknowledged the wrongs of Fayeh Tash. But if you grew up with a silver spoon in your mouth from Prarhan or had the privilege to go to Wesley College, just give the social justice privilege cards a bit of a rest for a change because others come from the real world and not what's written in a politics tutorial. FFS. For what it's worth, I've got the experience of both.

What is really annoying about me for the people offended by my posting is that I don't care for the right. They are not my people. I don't care for America, or its demise. I've been critical of Israel, I've acknowledged the points you've made. I've praised you a number of times, and yet this has not been reciprocated and any struggles that I've personally had are simply laughed at by the moral police in this thread who more often than not are born with a silver spoon in their mouth, and that's unappealing to say the least. You lot think it's OK to laugh at mental health jibes, for you to be combative or just simply call someone you don't like a fw is completely fine and reasonable - which is what's been happening. And the Wesley type from Parhran are supposed to be the moral police.

These people are lost to me, they can NEVER win me over.
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Why would anyone want to win you over? You just bleat out your imagined, left vs right tropes for anyone who expresses an opinion. And then sook and play a victim card when someone points out that what you are saying is rubbish.
 
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vindaloo said:
This is pretty much what the Hamas apologists do in here but in reverse.
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well I dont expect you to condemn what israel has done over the last 6 months windy. I usually just put forward my view of things. Zevie seems to think that it's important to get me to "concede" things that are important to israeli supporters. As I said before, I've seen examples of this strategy a lot of times across the media. I would guess that its a strategy to move the debate to areas where the israeli supporter feels more comfortable and the palestinian supporter feels less comfortable. Right from the start, israeli supporters can seem to find it easy to distance themselves from the more extreme israeli positions but palestinian supporters like myself are expected to support the more extreme elements of hamas. It's very peculiar to me to have this kind of contradictory attitude.

I think any objective person would agree that israelis have controlled the narrative about this issue for a long time. They have stifled any criticism by using allegations of anti-semitism. They have controlled the narrative in the american media. They have basically made the rules. Well I'm not interested in following them.
 
vindaloo said:
To be blunt I've had an agenda exposing the ratbaggery of the far left, contributing with links I've produced in this thread,

Clementine Ford doxxing a Jewish community and they subsequently received death threats.
Click to expand...

Now this is doxxing.... one thing about the jewish american lobby, they know their stuff.. they make clem look like a babe in the woods

www.nytimes.com

After Writing an Anti-Israel Letter, Harvard Students Are Doxxed (Published 2023)

A truck with a billboard displayed their names and photos, and critics put out do-not-hire lists. The students say it’s a campaign to shut them up.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
 
whats the angle with the jewish council of australia? Evidently, jewish groups in australia are left, right whatever. I tend to concentrate on what the israeli gov't is doing, but what is this mob doing?

It called for australia to place sanctions on israel and cut off ties. Whats the angle? I'd like to know. Calling on experts....

Australia must cut all military ties and place sanctions on Israel

www.jewishcouncil.com.au www.jewishcouncil.com.au
 
Markfs said:
whats the angle with the jewish council of australia? Evidently, jewish groups in australia are left, right whatever. I tend to concentrate on what the israeli gov't is doing, but what is this mob doing?

It called for australia to place sanctions on israel and cut off ties. Whats the angle? I'd like to know. Calling on experts....

Australia must cut all military ties and place sanctions on Israel

www.jewishcouncil.com.au www.jewishcouncil.com.au
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Never heard of them personally but seem like a great group of academics.

I applaud them for having a go.
 
vindaloo said:
To be blunt I've had an agenda exposing the ratbaggery of the far left, contributing with links I've produced in this thread,

Clementine Ford doxxing a Jewish community and they subsequently received death threats.
Fayeh Tash burning down his burger joint and blaming it on the Jewish community in Caufield.
I could go on and on and on.
My agenda was at odds with people in here and I received vitriol because there are people in here who are the very people who are attending the 'where's the Jews' protests or likeminded protests on October 8th.
I know you're from a different cloth to some of the Wesley college toff types, and that you have acknowledged the wrongs of Fayeh Tash. But if you grew up with a silver spoon in your mouth from Prarhan or had the privilege to go to Wesley College, just give the social justice privilege cards a bit of a rest for a change because others come from the real world and not what's written in a politics tutorial. FFS. For what it's worth, I've got the experience of both.

What is really annoying about me for the people offended by my posting is that I don't care for the right. They are not my people. I don't care for America, or its demise. I've been critical of Israel, I've acknowledged the points you've made. I've praised you a number of times, and yet this has not been reciprocated and any struggles that I've personally had are simply laughed at by the moral police in this thread who more often than not are born with a silver spoon in their mouth, and that's unappealing to say the least. You lot think it's OK to laugh at mental health jibes, it's OK for you to be combative or just simply call someone you don't like a fw is completely fine and reasonable - which is what's been happening. And the Wesley type from Parhran are supposed to be the moral police.

These people are lost to me, they can NEVER win me over.
Click to expand...

I'm a product of working class Frankston and left school at 15yo. Still, I don't feel the need to see every issue through the prism of 'left' and 'right', and I'm not going to question the social politics of people just because they grew up in leafier suburbs than me.

If you're the sort of person who thinks that Clem Ford or the owner of a burger shop are the most decisive factors in the consideration of Gaza, then let me assure you that NO ONE IS TRYING TO WIN YOU OVER.
 
JB1975 said:
I'm a product of working class Frankston and left school at 15yo. Still, I don't feel the need to see every issue through the prism of 'left' and 'right', and I'm not going to question the social politics of people just because they grew up in leafier suburbs than me.

If you're the sort of person who thinks that Clem Ford or the owner of a burger shop are the most decisive factors in the consideration of Gaza, then let me assure you that NO ONE IS TRYING TO WIN YOU OVER.
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Like a proper Frankston man, you left school at the age of 15... but only to return. You did Prahran proud.

#fakefrankstonian #silverspoonmofo
 

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sr36 said:
If you're a very small Jewish group, it's you're time to shine - just make a statement.

The Jewish Zev Council believes ...
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This is why people aspire to be a world leader.....

Australia's policy towards palestine and israel is to blindly follow israel's goals....it matters little what you or I do. We can post in forums stating our desire for a two state solution and world peace, but its what penny and albo do that's important and will be noted in history books in the future...

so all australians are consigned to being limp wristed israeli apologists...

But the same is true for the Zevies of this world, and the brave academics of an altruistic jewish group somewhere in the grounds of an australian university. Their visions of the world matter little. It's for Netinyahoo to determine what the future sees when it looks back on the goals of israelis and australian jews.

We are all captives of our masters...
 
A recent news story from aljazeera isnt that unusual but it is so indicative of the status quo in gaza....

The UN said a truck loaded with aid was turned back on Monday because it had scissors used in children’s medical kits. In response, Israel’s Coordination of Government Activities in the Territories (COGAT) accused the UN of lying, saying “this did not happen”.

So who is lying here? Is the UN lying? We know UNRWA is an arm of hamas, but is the whole UN infiltrated with hamas, or are they just your usual anti-semites?
 
The killing of Haniyeh's children and grandchildren has probably been greeted with claps and cheers from Israeli interests. You would assume that the political leader of Hamas would have control over the continued existence of the israeli hostages. I'm not saying that deaths are inevitable or justifiable, but what would an irate netinyahoo do in a similar situation? I also think about the assassination of iranians in recent days and the movement of troops away from gaza, presumbably to the north of israel. We also should remmber that this country also has the bomb. If Joe doesnt really care about the palestinians, he should start thinking about being dragged into a war with nuclear implications.

Apologists will point to israeli calls to get rid of netinyahoo as an indication that he is isolated, but the reality is israelis are generally very much in agreement with what he is doing. The polls show that. Sure there are some israelis and american jews who condemn the current israeli methodology, but these people are definitely in the minority. Ironically, we should remember that the majority of palestinians were waning in support for hamas before this "war", but everyone has wanted to concentrate on the few in hamas who wanted to push the israelis into the sea. Just another contradiction in this conflict, i know.

Antony blinken has promised a sea corridor for food. This is a new initiative and follows on from several previous promises for sea corridors for food. It is expected that further promises will be given in the coming weeks and, as more palestinians starve, these promises might come more often. These promises are welcome and should feed many palestinians.

Blinken is also justifiably upset that momentum has turned against the israelis, and at a time when his boss is vulnerable to the peculiarities of democracy. He says that Hamas should also feel the pressure of these outside forces, but of course, we all know that Hamas are murderous animals who ignore the deaths of their children and grandchildren and mindlessly concentrate on the obliteration of israel. Sometimes Antony, you just cant take a trick....
 
I'm not surprised that a few cronulla supporters have surfaced to bash Scomo. It seems that people are finally discovering what was apparent from the start. I'm not a great lover of either political party but liberal leaders have been terrible and I'm thinking about Tony Abbott and the current copper on that list. Some will point to John Howard and I would argue that he was the benefactor of some good economic conditions but I'd be grateful to have a re-run of honest john ahead of what we have been offered subsquently.

Currently, the copper has been out-netinyahooing netinyahoo....he is an ugly man who is desperate for his time at the top. In the next election, 40% of people will vote for him but in 10 years he will be out on his ear from the party and looking for a payout job like his mate, Scomo. Does the Aussie voter ever learn? A true piece of crap. I should admit now that I will be voting liberal in the lower house at the next federal and state elections.....but that's just a coincidence.
 
Is there a trend here?...

1. Dutton doesnt attend the liberal party conference in tasmania halfway thru last year
2. Dutton isnt going to go to Tas to campaign for the Libs
3. Dutton makes a ridiculous comparison between a palestinian protest and the port arthur massacre....

For a guy who professes all this pro-Aussie stuff, he's probably made the most un-australian comment by a political leader that I've ever heard.

My conclusion is that he is already entertaining job offers .....and not from Tassie....probably Israel....watch this space...
 
JB1975 said:
I'm a product of working class Frankston and left school at 15yo. Still, I don't feel the need to see every issue through the prism of 'left' and 'right', and I'm not going to question the social politics of people just because they grew up in leafier suburbs than me.

If you're the sort of person who thinks that Clem Ford or the owner of a burger shop are the most decisive factors in the consideration of Gaza, then let me assure you that NO ONE IS TRYING TO WIN YOU OVER.
Click to expand...

The other way around. If you don't like someone's social policy and you come from a very privileged position in life, you really have no right to make derogatory comments that are indeed stupid, such as class put downs, mental health jibes which happens all the time in here.

I've never stated that clem is the centre of division in Gaza. I've concentrated on loaval politics from the start. You are extremely pigheaded on political matters and are always desperate to shape the narrative. On many occassion you and others misrepresent your perceived 'enemies' and are also intellectually dishonest. And you have to be if your going to get worked up by someone quoting articles where clem is potrated as the fool she is.

I've got one poster on ignore who has kept belittling me, putting me down, making derogatory comments, stalking me, and making misrepresentations of what I'm about. He kept on going on and on about 'woke', 'left' 'right' american politics even though I'm not interested in American politics even though he's obsessed by it.

Class divide is a lot more the 'leafy' suburbs. On another issue you will agree with me there but it didn't suit the narrative on this occasion. I don't time to posy here cause my job is more hands on and honestly I'm well aware that your are a bunch of teachers on this board who are political activists and who've been mightily offended and triggered with the links I've posted. I'll leave it at that. This post is rushed im sure it will get ridiculed by the toffs from.parhran.
 
vindaloo said:
The other way around. If you don't like someone's social policy and you come from a very privileged position in life, you really have no right to make derogatory comments that are indeed stupid, such as class put downs, mental health jibes which happens all the time in here.

I've never stated that clem is the centre of division in Gaza. I've concentrated on loaval politics from the start. You are extremely pigheaded on political matters and are always desperate to shape the narrative. On many occassion you and others misrepresent your perceived 'enemies' and are also intellectually dishonest. And you have to be if your going to get worked up by someone quoting articles where clem is potrated as the fool she is.

I've got one poster on ignore who has kept belittling me, putting me down, making derogatory comments, stalking me, and making misrepresentations of what I'm about. He kept on going on and on about 'woke', 'left' 'right' american politics even though I'm not interested in American politics even though he's obsessed by it.

Class divide is a lot more the 'leafy' suburbs. On another issue you will agree with me there but it didn't suit the narrative on this occasion. I don't time to posy here cause my job is more hands on and honestly I'm well aware that your are a bunch of teachers on this board who are political activists and who've been mightily offended and triggered with the links I've posted. I'll leave it at that. This post is rushed im sure it will get ridiculed by the toffs from.parhran.
Click to expand...

The toffs of Prahran don't care too much.

However, I think that your efforts to imitate Jesus will offend quite a few Christians.
 
JB1975 said:
The toffs of Prahran don't care too much.

However, I think that your efforts to imitate Jesus will offend quite a few Christians.
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What is all this about Prahran? Has our resident Windy Poo got a bee in his bonnet about Prahran? What on earth has Prahran done to gain such a status?
 
Mauvais Cheval said:
What is all this about Prahran? Has our resident Windy Poo got a bee in his bonnet about Prahran? What on earth has Prahran done to gain such a status?
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Best not to look under his bonnet too much. There might be a bee under there, or nothing at all.

Brunswick seems to get off lightly, though, and that bothers me.
 
JB1975 said:
Best not to look under his bonnet too much. There might be a bee under there, or nothing at all.

Brunswick seems to get off lightly, though, and that bothers me.
Click to expand...
JB1975 said:
Best not to look under his bonnet too much. There might be a bee under there, or nothing at all.

Brunswick seems to get off lightly, though, and that bothers me.
Click to expand...

Brunswick will fall when the anti hipster pogrom starts. Their mason jars and fixie bikes will not save them.

I'm just sad Brighton hasn't got a look in. I was looking forward to something I could agree with Windy Poo about.
 
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