Society/Culture Andrew Thorburn - Controversial appointment as Essendon CEO. Broader discussion not for the AFL board..

[Demonic Ascent]

I've replied to / explained this many times, by the definition of the language used inclusion cannot entail exclusion. It's not that hard.

That's your definition of the language used - of course when people say they are "inclusive" they don't mean they will include everyone even people with abhorrent views or acts. They're not going to include child abusers for example are they? It's the conventional use of the word, inclusion of people who do not preach inflicting harm on others or limiting the rights/freedoms of others.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Why does the Anglican Church needs these little side hustle churches? Is it just to tap into the Pentecostal grifting lark? Or is there another reason?

This particular church doesn't even have a "church". It uses community centres.

Many of them do mate, the Assemblies of God in Wodonga (where I was indoctrinated) used a local community hall for a decade whilst they banked the weekend collection plate takings so they could build their version of a mega-church. Their pastor was also paid a full time salary.

It's quite the dodge for a skilled grifter.

 

[mxett]

No they are not. And now I think you are being obtuse.

I have outlined my reasons why in a number of posts above. My extensive experience with this cult, both as a younger person and now as someone a little older who has spent years trying to piece together broken relationships in my family, and the families of others tells me for a stone, cold fact that I know a lot more than you about their belief system.

Now, you are either involved and brainwashed. Or looking in from the outside as an interested but ignorant observer. Either way I am no longer interested in having this discussion with you as you are completely out of your depth.

Happy not to discuss. Maybe don't paint everyone or every church with the same brush

 

[Ghost Patrol]

In the wrong hands it is.

Religion doesn’t seek to take advantage of the corruptible. The f***wit power hungry leader who claims to be of that belief system uses it to manipulate the corruptible. Same as political leaders do. TV evangelists looking for a quick buck do it (not usually in the form of murdering people - but fleecing them).

I don’t meet a Christian person and make an immediate deduction that they are a good human being because of their belief or that they go to church every Sunday.

Would you consider someone who wants to be both a chairman and a CEO at the same time, to be a power hungry leader?

 

[PhatBoy]

So which bits of the bible were written in the context of life at the time and we can now ignore and which bits are 100% true?

Was Mary being a virgin a context of the time?
Were Jesus miracles a context of the time?
Was God committing genocide a context of the time?
Is saying gays will burn in hell a context of the time?

Do we update the ten commandments based on the context of the time?

Can you please send me a link, because it seems like Christians make it up as they go, depending on who they want to hate, which kids they want to rape or whose bank accounts that they want to drain?

I can't believe the mental gymnastics and ignoring all logic and reason religious people go through, and then hand over their money to these conmen.

Yes I know I for one sit around at night with a dice that has a side for each of those things. At all times I HAVE to be raping a child, hating someone, ripping money off someone, etc etc.

 

[GWT6]

Many of them do mate, the Assemblies of God in Wodonga (where I was indoctrinated) used a local community hall for a decade whilst they banked the weekend collection plate takings so they could build their version of a mega-church. Their pastor was also paid a full time salary.

It's quite the dodge for a skilled grifter.

You should see the cars and houses that the Hillsong leader's Children have. All are registered as Pastors so the church pays for all of their expenses 100% tax-free, it's a serious crime what they are doing.

 

[PhatBoy]

Would you consider someone who wants to be both a chairman and a CEO at the same time, to be a power hungry leader?

This question would back me into a far bigger corner if I had any intention of defending the figure involved in this issue. Which I don’t.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Not sure where you got that but everything I'm seeing and reading is that it's Anglican.

The notion of one all-embracing Anglican Church is a bit of a myth. There are at least 38, some studies suggest up to 60 "Anglican" churches and then hundreds of extensions of those. Pentecostalism is aligned with the Anglican Church. It's removed but aligned. Church on the Hill (Thorburn's cult) started as a group of people from many different "churches" and slowly moved towards a more evangelical prosperity style of doctrine. To say it is not a Pentecostal church is true in theory but it is also splitting hairs. It is so close to the Hillsong movement as to be almost indistinguishable from what they believe.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Happy not to discuss. Maybe don't paint everyone or every church with the same brush

I will continue to paint everyone from that cult with the same brush. My extensive experience with thousands of these people tells me that they are all pretty much the same.

But thanks for your advice.

 

[Chief]

I understand fine, thanks for your condescending response

Then why even ask??

 

[Chief]

I mean tbf most people wouldn't know who the * the CEO of Brisbane is, but they would know who Lachy Neale is. I would argue that if they both had homophobic views, in this case the players would be just as detrimental to how the organization is perceived.

What do you think would happen if he came out and announced his views or became a leader at a hateful evangelical church?

Guess.

FFS.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Can you point to one Christian organisaion where the senior members are actually kind and unselfish, and not just in it for the money? I was raised Catholic and they are one of the worst.

The Quakers aren't too bad, at least historically. Back when slavery was still a thing, they were some of the most ardent abolitionists.

 

[madmug]

So don't use a country with ridiculous laws as an example of religion world wide

I didn't. I replied to your post!!!

 

[00Stinger]

Then why even ask??

technically I never asked you..............

 

[Dave]

No. Does the church mentioned?

Yes.

So now we are condeming those who oppose abortion?

If they equate it to Nazi death camps and the holocaust, yes.

 

[gouki88]

I’ve already given what to google. Do it yourself

Ah, so look for things within the parameters you define. Wonder what conclusion that will point to.

 

[Gethelred]

Okay, that's enough.

This thread is not for discussing paedophilia in the church. While we are accomodating of some pretty adult themes at times, this is a forum for adults. There is a time and a place for discussing such things, but it isn't a subject for tit tat.

Andrew Thornburn is the subject for this thread. Let's adhere to it at least a little closer than last time, please.

 

[Cooldude]

At least our society is sane and sensible enough to realise these kinda beliefs should not fly, if it's the US then yeehaaawww the guy will be out loud and proud with his bullshit and "ma freeedom of speeech" shit

 

[Theseventhhamster]

Yep, I grew up in the Pentecostal cult (until I rebelled against it and my brainwashed mother when I was 17). People who have not experienced it truly have no idea how evil and manipulative it is. They literally separated me from anybody who I knew from outside the organisation, with the exception of sport which I was only allowed to play on Saturday (too bad that I was a useful soccer player because that was on Sunday so I was not allowed to play), they dumped my collection of "Satanic" music in the bin (Freddie Mercury and Elton John drew specific "gay therefore evil" commentary from the church pastor)...only Christian music was to be played, and so much more puritanical bullshit that is now burned into my memory.

Anybody from higher up in these religious organisations should be viewed with the utmost suspicion. They certainly should not be employed in senior roles in the real world.

This guy gets it. Pentecostalism is a vehicle for grifters to steal money and hold power over parishes. Is also a nice haven for controlling misogynistic men and spiteful women to find like minded friends. It's a cult that perfectly fits the needs of sociopaths. Scott Morrison, Brian Houston and this Thorburn guy. Same, same, same.

All the greed, selfishness and judging of the other while getting to act like you're the enlightened and pious one.

It's a campaigner factory.

 

[Hird Is Scum]

Andrew Thorburn himself has come out and said “My personal Christian faith is not tolerated or permitted in the public square.” so you can't really discuss Andrew Thorburn in this context, without bringing in his religious views into the discussion. His religious views are toxic, and his religion is widely known to have an underlying paedophilia problem, that the church has spent a lot of time and money trying to cover up. So it's not exactly off topic.

 

[mxett]

Andrew Thorburn himself has come out and said “My personal Christian faith is not tolerated or permitted in the public square.” so you can't really discuss Andrew Thorburn in this context, without bringing in his religious views into the discussion. His religious views are toxic, and his religion is widely known to have an underlying paedophilia problem, that the church has spent a lot of time and money trying to cover up. So it's not exactly off topic.

are you claiming the church has a bigger issue with pedophilia than the general community?

 

[mxett]

This guy gets it. Pentecostalism is a vehicle for grifters to steal money and hold power over parishes. Is also a nice haven for controlling misogynistic men and spiteful women to find like minded friends. It's a cult that perfectly fits the needs of sociopaths. Scott Morrison, Brian Houston and this Thorburn guy. Same, same, same.

All the greed, selfishness and judging of the other while getting to act like you're the enlightened and pious one.

It's a campaigner factory.

not exactly. There is a difference between Pentecostalism and the prosperity gospel as seen with churches like hillsong

 

[mxett]

I didn't. I replied to your post!!!

using the US as an example

 

[Ghost Patrol]

not exactly. There is a difference between Pentecostalism and the prosperity gospel as seen with churches like hillsong

From the outside, they all look very similar.

 

[mxett]

I will continue to paint everyone from that cult with the same brush. My extensive experience with thousands of these people tells me that they are all pretty much the same.

But thanks for your advice.

how many of these "types" of churches have you been a part of?