Are key defenders the least important players on a list?

[Pomsta]

I think that you have your premise from your opening post wrong? It should have said something like "should a KPD ever be picked as a first round pick?". KPDs are extremely important, it's just that you can get them from anywhere.

 

[SSSSSS]

We were a Brian Lake

Brian Lake

Age

42

Ht

195cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.7

4star

K

9.4

4star

HB

5.3

4star

M

6.5

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

163.0

3star

No current season stats available

D

4.6

1star

K

2.6

1star

HB

2.0

2star

M

1.0

1star

T

0.6

3star

away from our three peat side going down in history as the Port of the 2010s.

 

[naysayer]

I’m in agreeable that key defenders are important but don’t be spending a too 20 pick or 800k for them

If you agree then why did you start a thread about how unimportant they are? What a waste of time.

Also you seem to be contending that key defenders picked at the top of the draft don't always come on, and that many of the best are drafted with lower picks. Same is true of all key position players.

 

[qwertyboy]

Yeah, it's an interesting point you've raised

There are some high quality defenders among that lot, but also plenty of average/okay defenders alongside

I suspect everyone massively overrates individual talent and that premiership-winning defences are more about how the defenders help each other; how they work together; getting extra numbers to a contest; or getting across and covering for a teammate if he gets out of position.

Obviously, coaches would love to have 202cm Harris Andrews anchoring their backline. But if he doesn't get a timely chop-out from one of his teammates, then it doesn't really matter how good he looks.

Love this point and agree completely. While having a superstar defender is nice I always feel team defence wins premierships and big finals and a lot of those involve key defenders that have either been failed forewords cheaper congrats defenders or lowly drafted

 

[Magpie Since 1986]

Darcy Moore

30

Darcy Moore

Age

28

Ht

203cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.1

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

169.1

3star

D

13.9

3star

K

7.3

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

0.7

1star

MG

182.0

3star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.2

2star

HB

2.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

87.4

2star

is our most important player. If Moore wasn't injured in 2018 we likely win the flag, we had to play the 18 GF with no true key defenders available and the rest is history.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I say ruckmen personally.

The good ones are great because they’re very good footballers who contribute heaps around the ground.

But you can totally get around having a good one.

 

[Freomaniac]

I’m in agreeable that key defenders are important but don’t be spending a too 20 pick or 800k for them

Funny thing is.... Essendon is an interesting one. One of my favourite essendon defenders came from WA.

Cale hooker. Pick 54 in the 2007 draft

 

[The King!]

Sydney lost 3 of them and have been up shit creek

 

[WesternSydneyHawk]

Just a good one to ponder a lot of talk in the media and wider community is that as long as you have a competent ruck it’s all that matters but are key defenders the same?
Obviously like rucks there are exceptions like max Gawn and Sean Darcy who are match winners on there day. Same can be said for key defenders like Darcy Moore and Steven May, but like rucks do the unbelievable talents of you’re Darcy Moores and Harris Andrews mean that teams are overpaying through the salary and through draft picks for nothing more than mediocre talks that can’t play forward?
I feel a good key defender is important but not essential a rag tag group of keys that are from different backgrounds of failed key forwards and bush leagues are just as good than overpaying for these 200cm “good on the eye” keys

Key defenders don't matter at all...

...as long as you don't mind the other team's key forwards taking uncontested marks right in front of goal.

Oh, what's that? You don't want the other team's full forward to have free reign in the goal square?

You want someone tall who can spoil? Or ideally win a contest and land a tackle?

And after the other team scores a behind, who can kick the ball in to the right target?

You want someone who can take an intercept mark and send it back down the field?

Well then yes, key defenders are kinda important then.

 

[hutchy31]

They might not be the most important (it’s memorable for my team that the 2016 flag came with Fletcher Roberts

Fletcher Roberts

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.2

2star

K

4.8

2star

HB

4.4

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

1.4

3star

MG

102.2

2star

No current season stats available

D

8.6

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.2

3star

and Joel Hamling

29

Joel Hamling

Age

31

Ht

194cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.6

3star

K

6.2

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.0

5star

T

1.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

11.8

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

4.2

4star

M

5.8

5star

T

1.0

3star

as KPDs), but they can be pretty influential.

Without Lever and May, neither of which were drafted to Melbourne, my guess is they don’t win the flag.

Right now, if my team didn’t have Liam Jones

19

Liam Jones

Age

33

Ht

199cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.4

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

2.9

3star

M

4.3

4star

T

2.0

4star

MG

134.5

2star

D

7.6

2star

K

6.1

3star

HB

1.4

1star

M

4.1

4star

T

1.4

2star

MG

116.3

2star

D

9.4

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

2.0

2star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.2

4star

we might have one or two fewer wins. Having two genuine, effective KPDs might be one of the more critical parts of a flag team now.

 

[HolyRioli]

Best to not confuse "unimportant" with "you can often acquire them with less valuable draft picks"

 

[BM123]

Since 2010 this is some of the key defender drafted in the first round
Seb Tape
Matthew Watson
Lachie plowman
Kristin Jacksch
Aidan Corr
Matthew Scharenberg
Caleb marchbank
Sam Durdin
Aaron Francis
Griffin logue
Aidan bonar
Fisher Mcasey
Brodie Kemp
Denver Granger Barass
Nik Cox
Zach Reid

The proof is in the pudding injuries have hurt a lot of these guys but it’s the exact point I’m making why spend a top 15 pick on a key defender when more than 50 percent of the time it ends in heartache

Exclude anyone who played for Carlton and the % looks a lot better.

 

[Daka]

i'd argue the most important line is defense in terms of winning premierships
key defense is very important position imo.

 

[Osho]

Everything is built on defence. Whether that's a KPD or a unified group of defenders.

For the former, 2 examples: Rance 2017 GF, he really got into oppo minds and kept his fellow defenders on point after a shaky start. Sicily yesterday.

Those blokes are gold, build a team around them.

 

[VinnieB]

If you are building a list all I’m saying is that I wouldn’t be putting draft capital or big money into a key defender

The top key defenders are worth every cent. Problem is that they're rare. However, tthe best still don't get paid (apart from MCGovern), the same money as top key forwards and midfielders.
In terms of drafts, I'n not so certain key frowards drafted in the top 10 have been all that successful.

 

[Bungeye]

It helps having a superstar defender but team defence wins premierships. Plenty of failed forwards have made great intercept defenders. I mean Ratugolea looks like world beater all of a sudden....

 

[Gavin Excell]

I say ruckmen personally.

The good ones are great because they’re very good footballers who contribute heaps around the ground.

But you can totally get around having a good one.

Tall second and third forwards are the most overpaid group v actual output

 

[Piggy Smalls]

I think the title of the thread doesn’t really match the premise of the argument.
Are KPDs the least important players on the list? Hell no!
Are KPDs worth high draft picks? Probably not.
Freo were the second best defensive team last year with Pearce (pick 37), Cox (pick 41) and Ryan (pick 66) as the key tall defenders. Ryan is an AA and Cox made the 40 man squad last year.

 

[RUNVS]

Losing our KPD's doomed the Swans season, though our midfield has not been great either but I think we would have at least 2 more wins if not for losing both McCartin's.

 

[deck]

If you agree then why did you start a thread about how unimportant they are? What a waste of time.

Also you seem to be contending that key defenders picked at the top of the draft don't always come on, and that many of the best are drafted with lower picks. Same is true of all key position players.

The best key forwards are almost all exclusively drafted at the pointy end of the draft.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

I'd say they're least important to draft.
It's a position where almost anyone with size can play adequately

 

[deck]

Tall second and third forwards are the most overpaid group v actual output

Half the number 1 key forwards are overpaid. They are the quarterback equivalent of the AFL. Every club is desperate for a great one but there are very few of them.

 

[franjon]

Only if you're a good key forward.

 

[Tulip]

Since 2010 this is some of the key defender drafted in the first round
Seb Tape
Matthew Watson
Lachie plowman
Kristin Jacksch
Aidan Corr
Matthew Scharenberg
Caleb marchbank
Sam Durdin
Aaron Francis
Griffin logue
Aidan bonar
Fisher Mcasey
Brodie Kemp
Denver Granger Barass
Nik Cox
Zach Reid

The proof is in the pudding injuries have hurt a lot of these guys but it’s the exact point I’m making why spend a top 15 pick on a key defender when more than 50 percent of the time it ends in heartache

You could find 15 spuds from the past 15 first rounds in literally any position

 

[Deccas]

I hope I’m clear when I say that key defenders can be found from anywhere mostly from outside the first round and on little money. These players are system based and look a lot better in better teams obviously.

That's true of any position though because of the vagaries of talent development etc. Name a position and you can name a bunch of high draft picks that didn't work out and low draft picks that turned into excellent players.