Atmosphere at the soccer better?

[Souup]

As a player, you get more money being a soccer star, so why try and be a fish in a small pond like the AFL. Get tough and compete with the big boys on the global game.

Possibly one of the dumbest things i've seen on this forum

Why try be a fish in a small pond like AFL.. uhh maybe because they love footy and regardless of pay or anything else they just want to do the thing they love and do best??

I also follow soccer but its safe to say AFL will always be the #1 sport in Australia

AFL >> Soccer

 

[retroparty]

Do ya reckon NRL fans have a go at soccer as well? cos that is cleary NO.2
maybe NO.3 behind union. then youve got V8s, lots of people like their basketball and netball. I dont think soccer is just competing with footy.

 

[vinnie]

AFL negatives - round 2.


1 - AFL has constant rule changes. the game is now punishing physical contact and making it more like netball. In soccer, you can go up for a header and rest your hand on the opposition player, providing you don't obstruct.

2 - AFL draft system rewards weak performers, and encourages ordinary play especially towards the end of the season. The clubs won't admit it, but they are better rewarded being last rather than 3rd last. In most soccer comps - you play ordinary and you get punished - relegated to a lower league. (SHould AFL teams get relegated to VFL, SAFL etc).

3 - Games can be won or lost on silly umpire decisions - just look at the result from Kangaroos vs Pies. Shocking umpire decision that affected the game.

4 - AFL ain't really a national comp. Com'on, seriously. Aust rules has decent competitons in only some selected population centres outside VIC, SA and WA. What about places like Newcastle, Woolongong? If Aust rules is there, name one players? Soccer is everywhere all over this country like a cancer that can't be removed - and its growing. There's a comp on in every city in Australia, even in AFL heartlands.

5 - Soccer you have to work harder for a goal, througn consistent strategy. In AFL there is such a high degree of fumbling and turnover, every goal is the partial result of a fumble, mishandling or just pure luck in the bounce. Soccer there's no unpredictability - so you need pure skill - lucky bounces don't exist and good teams don't fumble.

6 - Soccer is easier to set up and play in a yard or any 2 dimensional space. In footy you need plenty of arial space which is often not available.

7 - AFL doesn't unite Aussies like soccer does. It never will. That's the true definiation of a national sport - a franchise that unites all Australians.

8 - The AFL is so intent on growth, it has robbed from Vic teams, tearing out their suburban heartlands. There are no longer a spiritual home for many Vic AFL teams, some of them even share home grounds. In soccer, each team has its own supporter home ground.

PS: I like AFL as well - I just don't put up with soccer bashing like they did in the 60/70's.

 

[cos789]

1 - AFL has constant rule changes.

Australian Football has adapted to become the attractive game that we now know . Soccer has not adapted and maybe they should experiment a little .

.
2 - AFL draft system

Ensure an even competition which is more interesting than
a lopsided competition more in keeping with the past .

3 - Games can be won or lost on silly umpire decisions -

As distinct from a ref's silly decision .
Great loss of credability there mate .

-
4 - AFL ain't really a national comp. Com'on, seriously. Aust rules has decent competitons in only some selected population centres outside VIC, SA and WA. What about places like Newcastle, Woolongong?

Name a place that doesn't have an Australian Football competition .
Under the AFL , we have the WAFL , SANFL , VFL , ACTAFL , NSWAFL , QAFL , NTAFL and AFLT .
Under that we have the county leagues and some other semi-pro leagues and under that we have the amateurs and then the juniors .

Newcastle has the Black Diamond League . The Black Diamond Cup is the oldest continuously run competition in Australia .
Wollongong has it's own league and also has a team in the S(A)FL .
Australian Football is not just the AFL it spread to virtually every part of Australia well over 100 years ago .

.
5 - Soccer you...
6 - Soccer is ...

soccer is different with a different skill set .

7 - AFL doesn't unite Aussies like soccer does. .

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
Forgotten about all those ethnic soccer riots already have we ?
The fact is that Australian Football is being promoted overseas and in some instances Australia as the code that brings people together UNLIKE the highly divisive soccer .

8 - The AFL is so intent on growth,

You're criticising a sports business because it wants to grow ?

.

 

[retroparty]

Well said

 

[Souup]

3 - Games can be won or lost on silly umpire decisions - just look at the result from Kangaroos vs Pies. Shocking umpire decision that affected the game.

Happens so often in soccer they dont even bother talking about it.. For example all the diving inside the box

 

[TheSaviour]

AFL is hardly growing and in the future the afl will need to be international surivive.

People can crap on all they wnat about the GAA surviving the GAA is amatuer FFS.

 

[cos789]

AFL is hardly growing and in the future the afl will need to be international surivive.

and this earlier from you " Rugby and League are popular and grassroots while AFL is numbers are and have been dropping at a huge rate for sometime."

Exact opposite you misinformed person .
Whatever indicator you like to put forward Australian Football is growing .
2005 and 2006 saw record and near record attendances respectfully .
Participation rate increases are double digit average .
Marketing sales , sponsorship and ratings are all up .

So what's with this big vendetta against AFL that you have to lie all the time ?

.

 

[Blue and Gold Blood]

ffs mods can we lock this thread? These soccer trolls have gotten enough of a run as it is.

 

[mattwinter]

Australian Football has adapted to become the attractive game that we now know . Soccer has not adapted and maybe they should experiment a little .

Sure... I guess that's why we are constantly hearing about how much better AFL was in the 80s and 90s - The rule changes are trying to stop the game becoming a mess of flooding and short kicks - but the rule changes haven't been able to keep the game as good as it was back then. Football meanwhile has evolved into a more free flowing game than it used to be, but in the main it is just as exciting and tense as it used to be - with no major rule changes.

Ensure an even competition which is more interesting than
a lopsided competition more in keeping with the past .

Each to their own, but I'd rather something meaningful than 'interesting' - if they just pulled a team out of the hat each year It would be unpredictable too.

Name a place that doesn't have an Australian Football competition .
Under the AFL , we have the WAFL , SANFL , VFL , ACTAFL , NSWAFL , QAFL , NTAFL and AFLT .
Under that we have the county leagues and some other semi-pro leagues and under that we have the amateurs and then the juniors .

Newcastle has the Black Diamond League . The Black Diamond Cup is the oldest continuously run competition in Australia .
Wollongong has it's own league and also has a team in the S(A)FL .
Australian Football is not just the AFL it spread to virtually every part of Australia well over 100 years ago .

I'm sure if I looked I would find different lacrosse associations all over Australia too - the fact is AFL is not truly national (although it is a hell of a lot closer to being national than the rugby codes) - It will never be truly national while more than half the teams are from Victoria.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
Forgotten about all those ethnic soccer riots already have we ?
The fact is that Australian Football is being promoted overseas and in some instances Australia as the code that brings people together UNLIKE the highly divisive soccer .

Yes I have forgotten about those riots that happened several years ago now - the fact is that this situation has been dealt with and it is really no longer a major problem, I don't pretend that football hasn't had problems in the past, but there is no doubt that football (and specifically the socceroos)brought the nation together like no other sport (and probably no other thing) has ever done before.

The only reason AFL doesn't have ethnic rivalries is because the people that would cause these rivalries don't care at all about AFL (in general). AFL can't really unite people because it excludes them (or at least they choose not to be interested) - although AFL has done a great job with the aboriginal society, but there is more to Australia than them and the 'traditional' aussie.

You're criticising a sports business because it wants to grow ?

There is a point there though - the AFL puts so much emphasis on growing the game into NSW and QLD that they disregard fairness and forget about their fans in the AFL 'heartland' of Victoria/SA/WA. They gave Sydney and Brisbane Salary Cap benefits (you could certainly argue that both Sydney's and Brisbane's premierships were tainted because of this) and more recently they've given benifits to Northern fans in the new TV deal while disregarding fans in the 'heartland'.

 

[mattwinter]

AFL is hardly growing and in the future the afl will need to be international surivive.

People can crap on all they wnat about the GAA surviving the GAA is amatuer FFS.

I don't agree - The AFL is not growing signifcantly internationally, but it does not need to be international to survive. If the AFL were smart they would forget about promoting the game outside of Australia, focus on maintaining their dominance in the Southern States and try to continue to grow the game in NSW/QLD.

AFL will never become a true international sport, anyone who thinks it might is deluded.

 

[Crosby87]

The NFL is the biggest thing in America, and it's hardly a global game.

What a moronic argument.

 

[Ronin]

The NFL is the biggest thing in America, and it's hardly a global game.

What a moronic argument.

They also have a few hundred million people and are the biggest economy in the world. Your point is?

 

[maroon and blue]

I think his point is preety self evident.

 

[Grunty]

Australian Football has adapted to become the attractive game that we now know

Are you taking the *****?

I think quite a few members of this board would disagree with your description of today's game as "attractive".

 

[maroon and blue]

Members of this board pale into insignificance to the 40,000 supporters per game who find it attractive. It is easy to push letters on a keyboard, if you don't like Aussie Rules play a computer game.

 

[RichardL]

There are about only 16 premier football clubs in the world. There are dozens of premier soccer clubs. It's harder to get to the top of football because there are less teams at the top.

there may be more top clubs in soccer, but there are also probably 100 times as many people playing the game.

Melbourne is about the same size as Frankfurt. Now I don't have the figures in from of me, but I'd be quite happy to bet a large about of money that there are more people from Melbourne playing in the AFL than the are people from Frankfurt playing in any of the top soccer leagues combined.

 

[RichardL]

Members of this board pale into insignificance to the 40,000 supporters per game who find it attractive. .

that's probably where any such argument about sports being boring falls down completely. The fact that loads of people like certain sports with a passion has rather more weight than somebody saying a sport is boring just because they don't like it.

 

[realfootball]

So lets talk about soccer taking over football in the future, WHEN it happens. What I'm hearing at the moment is a lot of speculation; that somehow one Melbourne team drawing 40,000 crowds corresponds with 16 AFL clubs drawing 35,000 week in week out, and usually more.

No, specualtion is fine. There is a solid argument for the future of football (aka soccer), as spelt out by many people on numerous threads.

You have quoted current crowd figures. No one would deny the popularity of AFL currently. Current crowd figures alone however is not the only factor to take into account for the future viability of a sport. There are many, many factors, eg junior participation, marketing capabilities, sponsorship arrangements, global expansion possibilities, and probabaly most important of all, adminstrators who can run a sports business.

 

[realfootball]

Football IS growing overseas. There was an international cup last year..

Yes but it's laughable, and nobody cares and most have probably never heard of afl. AFL is a great game, but belongs domestically. Trying to globablise AFL would be vitually impossible. Not only do you have to compete with football (soccer), there are plenty of other sports trying to do the same thing (ie compete with soccer)

 

[SWANNIES RULE]

But it's a start.

Regardless of the standard, if there is enough interest overseas for an international cup to be put together then it obviously IS growing overseas.

 

[Sir_Adrian84]

The passion comes from the years of frustration of many soccer fans not having a team of their own to support and only monoethnic teams such as South Melbourne and Melbourne Knights.

Soccer/football has always had a big following here, not quite mainstream but more than a niche, you only have to look at the amount of EPL, Serie A and La Liga jerseys you see on the street. People have always followed the big leagues and the world cup. The problem here in Australia was the poor admin of the league and sport in general. They didnt know how to appeal and market the game to Australians. The A League has changed all of that, its much more mainstream and professional and it shows.

The Victory represents ALL fans of the world game in Melbourne and has given them a chance to come out and support what they have been craving. Some say the team might be "plastic"(ususally disgruntled South Melbourne propaganda) but the support and passion is real for the reasons mentioned above.

South Melbourne, Knights etc did more for the game in this country in establishing it than any of the current A-League teams have.

Victorian soccer in the late 50s/early 60s had crowds to some matches that rivalled VFL/VFA crowds at the time (close to 30,000) to watch "ethnics" like JUST, Juventus, Hellas etc. These people set up the game in this country and suddenly they are treated like stupid wogs or ethnics.
Suddenly none of that matters to people of your ilk.

As I have said before, the irony is that you accuse people who hate soccer as being rednecks and bogans but downgrade teams like Hellas saying that they do not belong in this country when they have added more to soccer in this country than a bandwagoners who only became involved in the game in 2004 and now think they are an expert at everything and feel it right to downgrade the acheivements of those before them.

 

[Sir_Adrian84]

any talk about the new stadium lately?

 

[cos789]

The AFL is not growing signifcantly internationally.

Yes the AFL has not grown significantly internationally ,
but Australian Football Internationally is growing all the time
and most of it is NOT due to the AFL .
However there are two watershed developments that could profoundly boost the recognition of the AFL brand overseas .
After many years of inconsistant coverage the AFL has signed a 5 year contract with Setana to deliver a number of AFL matches (both delayed and live) to the North American continent and countries in Europe .
We all know of the boost that seeing AFL on ESPN in the 90s gave to Australian Football in North America .
Secondly , this year sees the introduction of Australia playing the RSA in Australian Football .

 

[Ronin]

Yes the AFL has not grown significantly internationally ,
but Australian Football Internationally is growing all the time
and most of it is NOT due to the AFL .
However there are two watershed developments that could profoundly boost the recognition of the AFL brand overseas .
After many years of inconsistant coverage the AFL has signed a 5 year contract with Setana to deliver a number of AFL matches (both delayed and live) to the North American continent and countries in Europe .
We all know of the boost that seeing AFL on ESPN in the 90s gave to Australian Football in North America .
Secondly , this year sees the introduction of Australia playing the RSA in Australian Football .

The NFL is shown virtually everywhere on ESPN. Where are all the Gridiron teams around the world?

Give it up cos, it will never be played professionally overseas in our children's lifetimes.