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AFLW 2024 - Round 10 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Australia will grow to like Tony Abbott as PM
- Thread starter Dan26
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you reckon Therese enjoyed those hugs, iced
#berlusconi
#rubyheartbreaker
Um! It's a bit of a worry you imagined that at all.
- Aug 8, 2010
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Can someone explain to me why Abbott has some moral duty to ride out quietly into the sunset? You could argue that's a more dignified approach. But just like the post above, many are going further and calling him all names under the sun.
I don't think anyone disputes that Abbott was undermined by a number of his colleagues for the better part of a year (or maybe longer). They then succeeded by deposing him as prime minister in his first term, without giving him even the opportunity to go to the polls. Sure his polling was terrible, but frankly so was John Howard's for much of his time as prime minister - who was also similarly viewed by many as a bumbling luddite. Its also now obvious that Turnbull had an agenda for remaining in parliament. Even his most ardent supporters don't buy his "reluctant hero" cover story.
I think Tony Abbott owes his colleagues absolutely nothing. The sole difference between him and Turnbull is that Abbott isn't operating behind closed doors. He's a man scorned and he's dropping some truth bombs. It's true, the government's policies haven't changed. People who idolise Turnbull and hate Abbott need to take a look at themselves, because this is an obvious case of personality winning out over policy.
It will be an awful shame if the left leaning voters and Labor/Greens fail to hold Turnbull to account because they are too busy privately fawning over his new prime ministership (and indulging in schadenfreude over Abbott). It's different lip stick on the same pig.
mebbe not a moral duty. but he did say he would not undermine or hold the grudge
- Aug 8, 2010
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Yes and Turnbull said he wouldn't challenge for the leadership (and countless other broken promises from politicians). It was a rash statement and he should have first considered the implications, but I think we can cut him some slack for statements made within 24 hours of the dismissal.
NSWCROW
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- Aug 8, 2010
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You've outdone Tony on the slogan front. One picture totally pwns three words.
NSWCROW
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i outdo the coward period.
But but Andrew Bolt said he was a great guy and that we made a mistake!! A mistake I tellya!
- Oct 30, 2010
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tony doesn't owe his colleagues anything. just like his colleagues didn't owe him anything when they brought the knives to bear. i guess it comes down to whether you feel an individual should put their own ego aside to support the party/movement that they allegedly support/represent (a movement which is also the supposed best option for the nation). if you're right and nothing has changed as far as policy-making goes, what reason would tony have to be a whiny little bitch?
if you can't hold onto the position then demonstrably you don't deserve to be there. turnbull et al did nothing to tony that tony had not previously done to turnbull. the fact he was PM at the time is irrelevant.
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I didn't like Abbott but he has shown so much class recently. They say you judge a person in adversity, instead of constantly potting and undermining those who replaced him, he has decided to get behind those and put the needs of his party, before his. A lot of respect.
The classless counterparts in Gillard who hid behind her sex to hide her political failings and Rudd, who threw hand grenades everywhere at his own party, could learn a thing or two from Abbott in dealing with adversity.
The classless counterparts in Gillard who hid behind her sex to hide her political failings and Rudd, who threw hand grenades everywhere at his own party, could learn a thing or two from Abbott in dealing with adversity.
Elroo
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- Jul 2, 2014
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What Tony Abbott are you talking about?
Wrong wrong wrong.
If Howard's polling was ever poor, it was because he was pushing controversial reforms through at the time (GST or IR). Howard was lucky to get away in 1998 with the Liberals obtaining a lower 2PP than Labor. However, it didn't work out for him in 2007 after the IR debacle that was WorkChoices.
So the idea that Tony is spreading that poor polls always lead to success = simply bullshit. Fairy tale stuff.
And anyway, Howard was, for the most part, hugely preferred as Prime Minister. Tony, in contrast, consistently had super poor personal ratings.
I lived right through the Howard years - the last thing you could ever say about him was that he was bumbling, to quote you. To compare Tony's pathetic slogan repeating with Howard's knack for public speaking shows you know very little about politics.
But of course the comparison is so apt. It is because Abbott always saw himself as Howard that he ultimately failed. He didn't move with the times. Howard himself wouldn't operate as Howard did when he was in power.
- Aug 8, 2010
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The GST reforms were, of course, during Howard's first term (as you indicated with the 1998 comment). I remember vividly everyone thinking that he was going to get dumped right up until election day. Tony would probably argue that his first budget was well and truly the electoral equivalent of the GST.
Many people thought "Little Johnny" was a complete bellend for a long time. It's only in retrospect that we see him fondly because of what he achieved.
There was always the argument that Howard survived through political manuevers such as the children overboard saga, riding the "Coalition of the Willing" war against terror...or just Latham being a complete imbecile.
Read my post again - I said he was "viewed by many" as a bumbling Luddite, not that he was. I was a loyal voter of Howard. He also learnt on the job. Remember the whole "non-core promises" line on the ABC?
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Ratts of Tobruk
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- May 1, 2013
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I agree that people use rose-coloured glasses with Howard, but the line I've repeatedly used is that where Howard dog-whistled, Abbott wolf-whistled. Tony had no political ability beyond saying everything was crap. Labor were voted out, the Libs weren't voted in. A lot of votes went to PUP in 2013. Clive Palmer's PUP. And what serious policies did PUP have? Sure he has every right to speak out (he's been proved a hypocrite on every other thing he complained about), but he is doing so from a place of weakness so there's little to gain for the LNP and a lot to lose.
If Howard didn't have such a sweet economic run (started by Hawke/Keating, which allowed for income tax cuts) he may have had to make more unpopular policy decisions, but I still think he would've been smarter. He bought a lot of votes through giving people welfare handouts and 'middle class welfare' (which also applied to the upper classes before Labor brought in asset tests) is his greatest legacy beyond the GST and gun control. With Howard's unpopular decisions he chose subtler battles. Wedge politics was all about making a big deal about a relatively small decision. Abbott made a bunch of those, but also some major decisions - like 6mths before you get the dole. He also openly encouraged a culture of dumbess (e.g. look at the user accusing Gillard of hiding behind her gender, even though her misogyny speech was a direct response to Abbott calling her sexist). Taken all together it was seen as ideological rubbish which didn't have a place in Australia. No-one was going to warm to it eventually. Business saw it as unrealistic. Confidence dropped.
Abbott's polling was always poor and any attempt to regain ground was cut off moreso by his errors than by leaks. Of course given Turnbull's actions since, it is clear he and his supporters were destabilising foremost, rather than preparing good policy (either for Abbott, or for their take-over), so I get where you're coming from. But Abbott's great white hope (and potential white elephant) was the TURC and the Libs & Heydon screwed that up too.
NSWCROW
Make me an Admin!
Hahahahahahahaha. he's been on his favorite children's radio shows, Hitlerjugend I think its called, crying like a stuck pig. He clearly lives in his own little world. He is his own hero.
Its always sad when even your 'best friends' dont tell you that you stink!
Showbags
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- Jul 21, 2013
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Obviously your just trolling (noone in their right mind would actually believe such nonsense) but ill take the bait.
Abbott has blamed everyone but himself. The media being the main ones in the firing line.
When Gillard was knifed you hardly heard hide nor hair from her. She sat quietly on the back bench until the election.
Abbott has been running around screaming and sooking about the media, Morrison etc etc since he was deposed. He doesnt even have the class to not recontest the seat in 2016 and give clear air to the new government as he knows he is a career politician that has no prospects outside of parliament.
Ill agree on one thing though. Rudd was a slimy piece of work.
Nothing will ever top Dippers Donuts.
What Abbott simply doesn't understand: Australia will not be governmed by the extremes of the left, nor of the right. He was too much towards the right in the policies his government adopted. That is why his polling was bad. Being a poor public speaker and presenter didn't help, but was not the core porblem. It was not presentation, it was the message itself. As much as he hates the ideology of the left, what he doesn't get is that normal real people won't buy the policies of the right either, they want something more pragmatic. Most people don't believe passionately in political ideology, yet Canberra attract those that do and they operate in a sort of cocoon outside the mainstream.
The polls have turned around for Turnbull in the short term in the hope that he reverses or quietly abandons some of the policies of the Abbott government, and return a bit more to the centre. It is too early to say that Turnbull is the same as Abbott but just presented more eleoquently. If he does end up being like that his polling will dive soon enough.
But already Turnbull is starting to quietly drop a few things without making too much of a noise about it or apportioning blame. Some areas of tax reform Joe Hockey declared were off the table are now back on the table, at least for discussion; and higher education deregulation plan seems to have been quietly dropped.
The polls have turned around for Turnbull in the short term in the hope that he reverses or quietly abandons some of the policies of the Abbott government, and return a bit more to the centre. It is too early to say that Turnbull is the same as Abbott but just presented more eleoquently. If he does end up being like that his polling will dive soon enough.
But already Turnbull is starting to quietly drop a few things without making too much of a noise about it or apportioning blame. Some areas of tax reform Joe Hockey declared were off the table are now back on the table, at least for discussion; and higher education deregulation plan seems to have been quietly dropped.
- Oct 30, 2010
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not that it matters to your point, but the GST was actually howard's second term. when he beat keating for his first term it (the tax) wasn't part of the Liberal platform (hewson having ballsed it up so badly etc). the GST formed part of his campaign for re-election.
Theseventhhamster
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Howard was failing pretty badly IIRC in his first term. None of the Libs seemed to have any idea of what to do in government having been in opposition so long. He pulled the GST out (in desperation imo) for the election campaign and got the win on the back of it. That's my recollection anyway, was a while ago and my first fed vote. Little Johnny was a shocking speaker back then, every third word was umm or ahhh. The Rodent came a long way over the years.
You're saying he won because of the GST, not inspite of it?
I was too young, but surely Keating lost, more than Howard won.
I was too young, but surely Keating lost, more than Howard won.
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