Autopsy Autopsy v hawks

[Hazey1977]

One of the hardest things to take about yesterday was that even after our bright start - we scored the first two goals of the game - you could clearly see we were screwed. We were dominating around the ball but every kick inside 50 was marked(contested) by Hawthorn and they had free players everywhere. I was already losing my mind and we were still winning. That’s how obvious everything is.

Yep. Zero planned movement to create pockets of space within the F50 or transfer of the ball around the arc until something presents, then we just bomb it long to SicDawg!

Sent from my SM-G781B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Chadwiko]

Our entire gameplan seems to be to kick it long to a Key Forward who cannot take a contested mark, surrounded by medium-forward-flankers who are unable to crumb the packs.

I'm so confused as to why this isn't working

 

[the_cleaner]

the club is broken, all the players and coaches needs to cop the abuse the carlton players and staff copped after their loss to essendon last year x100!

 

[Karanicolas]

It ended in a goal but the mindset of North was summed up early, when Corr ran past and called for the ball on his non preferred side and then was forced to do a right foot banana into forward line.
I mean, that's under 12s stuff right there.
How does an AFL player make a decision like that?

And I think it was Sheezel that had the ball ... it could not have been in better hands.

 

[Black Diamond]

Just backing over a few points raised in this thread.

Larkey - He is doing his best. If we get 50-60 goals a season out of him, we're doing well. He is simply not Hawkins or Cameron, and he needs help.

Duursma - Can we just settle down? What are any of you actually expecting of him? He is 6 games in to his career. There is no evidence that he wants to leave, and not every player is a cannonball. That isn't his job and not what he was recruited for.

Sheezel - I reckon he should stay in the backline. He would go well in the middle but I just don't see why it is a problem to have him play as a distributor. Look at Lachie Whitfield

6

Lachie Whitfield

Age

30

Ht

185cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.7

5star

K

13.4

5star

HB

9.3

5star

M

6.3

5star

T

2.7

4star

MG

411.8

5star

D

21.4

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

8.9

4star

M

5.6

5star

T

1.8

3star

MG

350.6

5star

D

17.6

5star

K

8.2

4star

HB

9.4

5star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

at GWS. It is an important role, Sheezel gets us out of trouble and creates rebounds, and if it is working we shouldn't move him.

LDU - Beginning to remind me of Higgins during his last season with us.

Backline - Would be good to have Ben McKay

32

Ben Mckay

Age

27

Ht

202cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.5

2star

K

3.7

1star

HB

3.8

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

1.7

4star

MG

77.2

1star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.5

3star

T

1.5

2star

MG

88.5

2star

D

7.0

2star

K

3.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.0

4star

MG

67.8

1star

in the side. We're missing him way more than most would admit

Effort - Often what we perceive as a lack of effort is actually a lack of understanding of the task/gameplan/situation. If you don't know what to do, you do nothing. I am not ready to throw around "lack of effort" and "show more heart" just yet. The guys are young and still learning about each other. Same goes for fitness. You look unfit and slow when you don't know where to run next.

Still rebuilding after 5/6/7 years - No. I realise this is not comforting, but we're only 1.5 seasons into the Clarkson era. I realise we suffered through Shaw and Noble, but those were different programs with different strategies. If we are still playing like this mid-2025 then that is a different story. We need to stick with Clarkson. More chopping and changing or another course correction will not help. Corner cutting to jag a finals appearance will also do nothing for us. I'd rather a patient build than copying what Essendon and Carlton tried to do in the last 15 years. What we're doing is far closer to Melbourne in the Roos era.

Resilience - This shits me big time. Heads drop far too quickly when we are challenged and I agree that there is too much self-preservation going on. Needs to be addressed immediately.

 

[chubbspeterson]

That was flattening. A mixture of poor efforts from some, skill errors, decision making and confusion over the gameplan/structures defensively was evident whilst the Hawks played to their system with appetite for the contest and were all on the same page.
Their mids and half forwards worked back harder defensively to clog up the space in our F50, ours either don't have the fitness or don't have the same desired work rate to support our defenders. The Hawks also utilised their extra number around the ball whilst our spare in defense wasn't having an impact. Xerri's endeavour is great but his taps and follow up tackle sucks all our players into the same spot. The Hawks just got the ball to his oppo and he gave it to the extra at the back and F50 entry occurs.

The connection, trust and support for each other isn't there in the playing group just yet. I knew this would take time to build because you find out about players composure under the heat of actual AFL footy. We seem to panic a bit too much at perceived or even internal pressure amongst the group and our mistakes are morale/momentum killers and the groups heads all drop because the pressure builds throughout the group that they aren't getting the reward.

It's not the time for board challenges or AFL intervention, its not on Sonja and Jen imo, it's on the footy department.
We've had very little stability in the football program and even this year we changed the assistant coaches and established a new development program which won't bear fruit for a few years. It needs a bit more time to take shape.
We all want to see some improvement in the players giving better effort and fight, less confusion over the gameplan/structures and forming that connection/trust and accountability amongst them in a hurry before we're more competitive.
The players also have to drive the expectation and response amongst themselves as well.

I'd give Colby and Zane a spell or back to the VFL. Not blasting their performances as they're kids but there's just a bit too much pressure on their shoulders right now. Go back and enjoy your footy and come back in when they're a bit more confident.
He's not everyone's favourite but a Curtis Taylor

5

Curtis Taylor

Age

24

Ht

188cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

No current season stats available

D

6.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

0.0

1star

might be able to give a bit more experience and workrate in that role.
Lazzaro and Tucker gave a stuff so I'd keep them in.

 

[The Talent Scout]

It was a brutal watch yesterday. There were many things I didnt like, i will list 2:
- In the 2nd quarter Colby basically decided he was going to try and change the fortunes of the team single handily and went on a brilliant run before chipping to Curtis. It was awesome play, seriously good. I reckon i only saw 1 NM player get to him to celebrate it.

- Durs had to stand under a hospital handpass (3rd quarter i think) and took the footy in the air, got absolutely hamemred in the tackle, took his punishment and didnt cough the ball up. Again, the NM players should have been coming from everywhere to get around him and remonstrate a little with the Hawks guy.

We had the example when CCJ did his Achilles and we are clearly not thinking team first at the moment.

THIS!!! TEN TIMES OVER!!! Confidence as well as playing and thinking as a team are sadly lacking at the moment, the good news is that most of the things we saw or to the point didn't see CAN BE FIXED that is so easy to see and I'm sure its being addressed but to our supporters who don't want to hear this, it takes time.

 

[Uncle_Leo]

It ended in a goal but the mindset of North was summed up early, when Corr ran past and called for the ball on his non preferred side and then was forced to do a right foot banana into forward line.
I mean, that's under 12s stuff right there.
How does an AFL player make a decision like that?

Corr shouldn't be an AFL player, thats probably why

 

[Piesnchess]

-----------

Our child supporters after giving the club once last chance to show something:

I come in peace. As I said to an angry Nth mate of mine, how would you like to barrack for the Saints, imagine that ??. Saints have won ONE premiership since 1874, one, includes VFA, VFL, AFL, just one, by lowest possible margin, plus 28 wooden spoons. Least Nth has won VFA flags, and 4 AFL flags. ON that basis,my hat is off to Saints fans,think about it.!

 

[Caracas]

And I think it was Sheezel that had the ball ... it could not have been in better hands.

My son called that out to me the moment it happened. Absolutely ludicrous. It is all on Corr. Harry 100% did the correct team thing. If a player calls for the ball, the onus is on him - unless, the pass is badly executed. How could Corr have possibly thought that he was a better option than Harry in that situation?

 

[Caracas]

That was flattening. A mixture of poor efforts from some, skill errors, decision making and confusion over the gameplan/structures defensively was evident whilst the Hawks played to their system with appetite for the contest and were all on the same page.
Their mids and half forwards worked back harder defensively to clog up the space in our F50, ours either don't have the fitness or don't have the same desired work rate to support our defenders. The Hawks also utilised their extra number around the ball whilst our spare in defense wasn't having an impact. Xerri's endeavour is great but his taps and follow up tackle sucks all our players into the same spot. The Hawks just got the ball to his oppo and he gave it to the extra at the back and F50 entry occurs.

The connection, trust and support for each other isn't there in the playing group just yet. I knew this would take time to build because you find out about players composure under the heat of actual AFL footy. We seem to panic a bit too much at perceived or even internal pressure amongst the group and our mistakes are morale/momentum killers and the groups heads all drop because the pressure builds throughout the group that they aren't getting the reward.

It's not the time for board challenges or AFL intervention, its not on Sonja and Jen imo, it's on the footy department.
We've had very little stability in the football program and even this year we changed the assistant coaches and established a new development program which won't bear fruit for a few years. It needs a bit more time to take shape.
We all want to see some improvement in the players giving better effort and fight, less confusion over the gameplan/structures and forming that connection/trust and accountability amongst them in a hurry before we're more competitive.
The players also have to drive the expectation and response amongst themselves as well.

I'd give Colby and Zane a spell or back to the VFL. Not blasting their performances as they're kids but there's just a bit too much pressure on their shoulders right now. Go back and enjoy your footy and come back in when they're a bit more confident.
He's not everyone's favourite but a Curtis Taylor might be able to give a bit more experience and workrate in that role.
Lazzaro and Tucker gave a stuff so I'd keep them in.

I disagree on the subject of resting Colby and Zane. I think they should be 100% backed in. The torch should be squarely on the Stephens, Fisher and Zurhaars of the world.

 

[King Corey]

Dunno if it's been mentioned but saw Scott Thompson pregame with his daughter kitted out in North gear.

Reckon we could get him and Boomer to take the field unprepared and they wouldn't be our worst.

 

[Horizons_00]

Hawks don’t have a better list than us
Had most of there team out injured

And we let them kick 9 unanswered goals in a row and embarrass us

We could have all the skills and talent in the league but if we are not switched on and playing for the jumper it becomes a pointless argument

All we ask is for effort and here we are again asking for the same thing years later

 

[Only Forwards]

Dunno if it's been mentioned but saw Scott Thompson pregame with his daughter kitted out in North gear.

Reckon we could get him and Boomer to take the field unprepared and they wouldn't be our worst.

He would probably make a some difference.

He's currently 37 would be 38 by the end of the year.

I have no doubt if we took him in the mid season draft he'd pull the jumper on and probably show a bunch of our kids what leadership actually was. HE would also likely expose some of our leaders a lot.

 

[chubbspeterson]

I disagree on the subject of resting Colby and Zane. I think they should be 100% backed in. The torch should be squarely on the Stephens, Fisher and Zurhaars of the world.

I'm just suggesting one or both of them might need a circuit breaker at some point to release the pressure valve.
Colby looked to be feeling his sore ribs on the wing after a contest so perhaps he needs a rest.

And no doubt the senior players need to be better. I'd drop Stephens and move Fisher to the wing and bring in a defender.
Tucker stay in imo, he gave a stuff yesterday when some others dropped their heads.

 

[chubbspeterson]

Always been patient with Clarko, but scratching my head at Choms move forward/ruck. Like, was his strategy of moving him back good or bad? Do we plan to just move him forward and into the ruck any time we’re getting whacked? He’s had two AFL games as our key back and all that’s thrown out already?

Or are we devoid of options and ideas? Are we trying to wallpaper over larkey, dursma, zurhar and sellers efforts, or our shithouse F50 entries that give them no chance?

Are we going to * up Choms development like all these other blokes were playing out of position???

We only took one contested mark in the forward 50 I think in the first half or might have been the 2nd quarter. I heard it on ABC radio so I think that's why he sent Chom forward because we had similar inside 50s to the Hawks, we just needed a contest.
I thought it definitely gave Drury and Curtis more of a chance with another reference point but it left a hole down back.
I'd keep him in defense but given we were down 7 goals at half time I'd rather Clarko try it to generate some score.

 

[Cyber_punk]

I come in peace. As I said to an angry Nth mate of mine, how would you like to barrack for the Saints, imagine that ??. Saints have won ONE premiership since 1874, one, includes VFA, VFL, AFL, just one, by lowest possible margin, plus 28 wooden spoons. Least Nth has won VFA flags, and 4 AFL flags. ON that basis,my hat is off to Saints fans,think about it.!

Not really relevant to our current situation.

 

[speedy]

The Hawks missing a few and played ****ing ordinary. And we were down 37 points at half time. Had to get a rev up to keep it to 45 points full time. Says it all really.

We are the worst team in the history of the AFL. Even the expansion teams weren't this bad for this long.

 

[chubbspeterson]

A teenagers sock drawer is harder than Dyl Stephens

I swear to god on the ABC radio coverage I heard someone yell "You're a cat" when Stephens took possession.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

My son called that out to me the moment it happened. Absolutely ludicrous. It is all on Corr. Harry 100% did the correct team thing. If a player calls for the ball, the onus is on him - unless, the pass is badly executed. How could Corr have possibly thought that he was a better option than Harry in that situation?

Because Corr doesn't have a brain and is probably trying to save his behind right now.

 

[koshari]

At least hawks had some consequences after performing awful last week. Sam Mitchell was furious after HIS team performed like that and our all our team got was ******* soft excuses.

Where was our leadership telling us to put the mouth guards in at training hey? Clarko are you going to put up with that? Emma? Michael? Any standards?

“It’s ok guys, good effort, maybe in 3 years time you will get a win”

We are a joke of a club atm and im sick of it.

fwiw i would rather clarko own the poor performance rather than piling on the players ( even if they were crap) , at least he acknowledges the buck stops with him,

 

[King Corey]

If he wasn't worried about the results he shouldn't have won the GC game and we'd have someone in the midfield above 5'10 and can compete.

That's a really good point.

Somehow a round 23 dead rubber win that pissed up an elite talent was worth it coz "winning matters".

Ok good I get it.

But now we're getting violated by all in Sunbury and winning doesn't matter coz "future development".

You know what would be good for "future development"?

Harley ****ing Reid.

 

[DuckYeah]

I swear to god on the ABC radio coverage I heard someone yell "You're a cat" when Stephens took possession.

I have no words. I cant defend these campaigners any longer.

 

[R00StaR]

How has this changed so drastically since pre-season and the first few rounds? The players themselves commented on how the plan is simple and understandable. 'North-ball' seemed to be working with quick movement all over the ground, players seemed fit and firing.

Cut to round 5 and 6 and we're chipping slowly around the wings every chance we get.

Northball did look good but we were running out of steam late in quarters and getting burnt on rebounds. It needs to mixed with some tempo footy, perhaps thats been the focus for a few weeks and of course young teams and teams without confidence can take it to extremes.
The other factor can be teams clearly being well aware and covering the middle better, forcing us down the line more which then exposes our lack of height/ marking power. X cant pack mark and Larkey will take so few up the ground they dont have to worry.

 

[R00StaR]

Got into work today and almost immediately got the "Heh heh...what happened to Norf?" I told them that I just don't care anymore which they took as a joke. I snapped and told them I wasn't joking. A Carlton fan said he knows how I feel. I snapped. Carlton won 1 game in 27, the win being a game we'd have been better off losing, won 12 games in 5 years and finished in the bottom 2 each year and thrashed by the next worst side before half time - 6 games, 6 times beaten well before the end???? No one except old Fitzroy supporters knows how this feels. How watching your club slide away feels.

I walked away disappointed that I snapped, but almost feeling like crying at what our club has become and will continue to become.

Went out with my North cap on today and couldn't give a stuff what other people think. Ill never hide who i am and some ribbing is always friendly banter.