Bendigo FL discussion 2024

[Trent the flight Steward]

Sorry I can't comprehend why we want to make it harder for clubs who have a junior go and play a higher grade, harder for them to come back and play at their home club. Goes completely against Aussie rules footy and traditions of our game, castlemaine have produced many great juniors, probably as many to afl/vfl ranks as your golden squares

 

[Forest St End]

Sorry I can't comprehend why we want to make it harder for clubs who have a junior go and play a higher grade, harder for them to come back and play at their home club.

I’m not sure it does make it harder, genuine juniors are still one point.
Are Sandhurst not going to sign Greene because he costs 4 or 5 points? No way but it will mean they can’t bring someone else in from another club as well.

If you want a competitive competition there has to be measures to balance inherent advantage. Sandhurst will always have many more juniors than Castlemaine or Maryborough because of pure population demographics so the discount is worth more and more advantageous for them.

Maybe discounts should be capped at something like 25% of a teams total points.

 

[Hank Mardukas]

I’m not sure it does make it harder, genuine juniors are still one point.
Are Sandhurst not going to sign Greene because he costs 4 or 5 points? No way but it will mean they can’t bring someone else in from another club as well.

If you want a competitive competition there has to be measures to balance inherent advantage. Sandhurst will always have many more juniors than Castlemaine or Maryborough because of pure population demographics so the discount is worth more and more advantageous for them.

Maybe discounts should be capped at something like 25% of a teams total points.

Good discussions happening here. I do wonder though should equalization tools be used to build and improve the bottom clubs or reduce the talent and/or depth of talent at the top clubs?

 

[Forest St End]

Good discussions happening here. I do wonder though should equalization tools be used to build and improve the bottom clubs or reduce the talent and/or depth of talent at the top clubs?

I’m not sure how you do the first option at this level. The AFL has tools like priority picks but I don’t see the equivalent here. As we’ve discussed lifting the points is redundant so there aren’t many other levers to pull?

Above all I think everyone benefits when the product is good. We need a league with competitive games being the rule and every team having hope. Once that happens everyone benefits, crowds come, sponsors come, clubs make money, better players follow and so on.

 

[jayco13]

Well maiden gully want their thirds in the bfl, so it makes sense for the entire club to shift, as I believe they were losing their best thirds to the bfl as the standard wad to easy in the loddon Valley. They might have teething problems like the storm did initially but they are set up at the high school, they should be with a good board be a power in 5 years in footy and netball

Want to go because of their 3rds...I did read that but surely a decision like that should be based on your senior team. You would think that if that's the case their senior team would be building towards that. But after 2 recent reasonably unsuccessful seasons, from the outside I will admit, it doesn't look that way.

 

[ROOTA#6]

Want to go because of their 3rds...I did read that but surely a decision like that should be based on your senior team. You would think that if that's the case their senior team would be building towards that. But after 2 recent reasonably unsuccessful seasons, from the outside I will admit, it doesn't look that way.

Should be based on the whole club and importantly the potential for junior players to transition to and become good senior players.

You cannot judge a club purely on its senior team in this scenario.

Let’s not forget…Strath did not have a senior club but it has built itself on the back of the junior club

 

[jayco13]

Should be based on the whole club and importantly the potential for junior players to transition to and become good senior players.

You cannot judge a club purely on its senior team in this scenario.

Let’s not forget…Strath did not have a senior club but it has built itself on the back of the junior club

What's the main attraction at a country footy club though Roota??
Kids are heading to the BFL clubs already.. and if MGYCW come in and aren't winning senior games the kids will head off anyway.
Success these days is the only way to keep kids interested.
And as I said I'm looking from the outside... they may be on top of all this anyway. And I hope they are.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

The point is rhe kids start as maiden gully juniors but because the thirds comp is so poor, they lose their best juniors into bendigo. Isn't their ground at the new school too? Maiden gully should be looking at strath as how to run a successful club. Shawn and Angus are already well credentialled senior coaches.

Its a massive growth area of bendigo where they'd be successful in netball too

 

[ROOTA#6]

What's the main attraction at a country footy club though Roota??
Kids are heading to the BFL clubs already.. and if MGYCW come in and aren't winning senior games the kids will head off anyway.
Success these days is the only way to keep kids interested.
And as I said I'm looking from the outside... they may be on top of all this anyway. And I hope they are.

Build it and they will stay. Make it their club and ensure they know it is for them and you will be amazed.

Lachlan Sharp is the greatest example for them to look to.



Yes you will need to recruit some good players but it can be done. There is an example on the other side of town for a MGYCW or Marong or whoever for a club and the league to follow.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

I’m not sure it does make it harder, genuine juniors are still one point.
Are Sandhurst not going to sign Greene because he costs 4 or 5 points? No way but it will mean they can’t bring someone else in from another club as well.

If you want a competitive competition there has to be measures to balance inherent advantage. Sandhurst will always have many more juniors than Castlemaine or Maryborough because of pure population demographics so the discount is worth more and more advantageous for them.

Maybe discounts should be capped at something like 25% of a teams total points.

So we handicap the better clubs and further drop the standard of the league? Not sure we were telling maine in the 90s it's unfair to have Oliver running around

 

[Truck]

I’m not sure it does make it harder, genuine juniors are still one point.
Are Sandhurst not going to sign Greene because he costs 4 or 5 points? No way but it will mean they can’t bring someone else in from another club as well.

If you want a competitive competition there has to be measures to balance inherent advantage. Sandhurst will always have many more juniors than Castlemaine or Maryborough because of pure population demographics so the discount is worth more and more advantageous for them.

Maybe discounts should be capped at something like 25% of a teams total points.

I still can’t wrap my head around your thinking here.
How do you work out if someone is a “genuine junior”??

 

[jayco13]

Build it and they will stay. Make it their club and ensure they know it is for them and you will be amazed.

Lachlan Sharp is the greatest example for them to look to.



Yes you will need to recruit some good players but it can be done. There is an example on the other side of town for a MGYCW or Marong or whoever for a club and the league to follow.

Maybe....

Either way it's a bigger step up, for one more than the other (although maybe not as big as it once was)

 

[GrassKat]

I still can’t wrap my head around your thinking here.
How do you work out if someone is a “genuine junior”??

A thought that I had was that when a player does their annual rego, right from Auskick that in addition to selecting their AFL club, they also select a local major and minor league club that they have an association with.

This data is linked to the player and can be used to back a case for being a local player.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

I thought Andy feeemantle was bog for golden square in a grand final

 

[GrassKat]

I thought Andy feeemantle was bog for golden square in a grand final

Correct. Poor memory.

 

[Forest St End]

So we handicap the better clubs and further drop the standard of the league? Not sure we were telling maine in the 90s it's unfair to have Oliver running around

Do you like the AFL ‘handicapping’ the strong clubs with salary caps and drafts or would you rather West Coast win the flag every year?

If we want a competitive competition there has to be some equalisation to even up the inherent advantages and disadvantages clubs have.

I still can’t wrap my head around your thinking here.
How do you work out if someone is a “genuine junior”??

I mean your rank and file junior to senior ranks player would remain a one pointer.

My position is if a player leaves and plays VFL/AFL etc they should return with a balance between carrying some more points to reflect their ability as a player and a discount for being at their home club.

I don’t think a four or five point discount as is the case currently is the right balance, and that’s why the points system has made zero difference to competition evenness since it came in.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

There has to be incentives for players like Greene in place to come back and henderson and greater points added if they go to a higher ranked side in the same league, I'd rather see that, then handicap a club for getting a past junior back that's played afl or state footy.

Maybe if the hub want bendigo footy to get back where it is we scrap the under 18 comp, have the best 30, 18 year olds in the land play at Canberra in the vfl, and for the best 20 players in the 18-20 bracket in the pios region that have draft aspirations go into a mini draft into the bfl and play once a month as under 21 curtain raisers for afl against the gv, Ballarat under 21s, but they either play senior bfl footy, or if their form drops go back to their home club. Maryborough castlemaine and flat get the first picks. You've gotta think outside the square, the under 18 comp is not working and is outdated. Gone are the days where a future number 1 like josh Fraser

Josh Fraser

Age

42

Ht

202cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

8.7

3star

HB

5.4

4star

CL

2.5

4star

HO

11.8

5star

No current season stats available

D

9.4

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

2.8

3star

HO

8.6

5star

or deliodo play a whole season in the tac cup, they play bugger all between school and ais commitments.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

Correct. Poor memory.

Easy mistake mate, a lot of the calivil gun players when they were winning flags played at south, hetherington, blake, maxted, Dean and many more. They were a serious side to play against

 

[Forest St End]

There has to be incentives for players like Greene in place to come back and henderson and greater points added if they go to a higher ranked side in the same league, I'd rather see that, then handicap a club for getting a past junior back that's played afl or state footy.

How does being a one point player incentivise them to play?

It is the club that has to deal with points, it’s irrelevant to players.

Surely you must agree that for the point system to have any impact it has to challenge the best sides to stay under it?

Sandhurst used 27 points on the weekend. Strath used 26. Square 27. Three out of four games were won by the team that had the least points on the field.

What exactly is the points system supposed to be achieving?

 

[ROOTA#6]

Is there any actual footy being played?

 

[GrassKat]

Easy mistake mate, a lot of the calivil gun players when they were winning flags played at south, hetherington, blake, maxted, Dean and many more. They were a serious side to play against

That’s the crew.

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

How's strath and square look with pretty young new teams and new coaches

 

[nesko_25]

Points are determined by the AFL VIC rules based on where they have previously played.

Off the top of my head it’s 6 points if you’ve played AFL in past three years, 5 if you’ve played state league eg VFL, 4 for TAC Cup and VFL reserves, 3 for a senior player, 2 for reserves and players who play juniors with you are 1 regardless of where they have played since. Each year a player is at a club they drop one point.

Just to clarify by using an example. Grant Weeks would have played over 100 games for Colbo (including a senior flag at 15) then aligns with Rochy(?) when at pio's and Bombers. Then goes on to play at Square and Rochy before heading back to Colbo. Is he a 5 point player at Colbo because he's played VFL and major league or a 1 pointer because he played juniors and senior there previously?

If his development and previous relationship with Colbo isn't acknowledged it doesn't make sense. Lower league teams should encourage their players to head to the best standard of footy. I also think that the points should have an age deduction, say 32, that allows people in the twilight of their careers head to a lower league i.e. John Hardinge to Elmore.

 

[Forest St End]

Just to clarify by using an example. Grant Weeks would have played over 100 games for Colbo (including a senior flag at 15) then aligns with Rochy(?) when at pio's and Bombers. Then goes on to play at Square and Rochy before heading back to Colbo. Is he a 5 point player at Colbo because he's played VFL and major league or a 1 pointer because he played juniors and senior there previously?

If his development and previous relationship with Colbo isn't acknowledged it doesn't make sense. Lower league teams should encourage their players to head to the best standard of footy. I also think that the points should have an age deduction, say 32, that allows people in the twilight of their careers head to a lower league i.e. John Hardinge to Elmore.

The way I would like to see it he would be a 1 point player at Colbo up until the point he moves to the VFL.

At that point he is a 5 point player for Square and Rochester but Colbo get a point discount as his home club so he only costs them 4.

After three seasons at a club he drops another point.

I don’t think anyone could argue that if you want a fair dinkum points system a player like Weekes shouldn’t be 4 or 5 points.

 

[GrassKat]

The way I would like to see it he would be a 1 point player at Colbo up until the point he moves to the VFL.

At that point he is a 5 point player for Square and Rochester but Colbo get a point discount as his home club so he only costs them 4.

After three seasons at a club he drops another point.

I don’t think anyone could argue that if you want a fair dinkum points system a player like Weekes shouldn’t be 4 or 5 points.

I disagree. A player that has come through a local junior system must remain a one pointer for life at that club. We want to encourage local clubs to put the work into their catchment zones to keep the game alive.

In my proposal a player like Weeks in his youth would have selected Colbo as his Community Club and Rochester as his Premier Club. Allowing him a one point status at both clubs. The move to Golden Square would then attract the applicable points.

We are community football and I am sure each of us could name a Community and Premier club within our vicinity that we align with.

The added value of such data, would be that we could look at the junior regos and get a clear idea ahead of time of what numbers we might expect to fill junior teams.

Sure, families move to different areas and may have inconsistent scrub selections across the years. But it would be another way to interpret club alignment.