Strategy Blair Hartley Project 2015 II

[Toadvine]

Gary Lyon having a go on the TV, Hardwick did an interview a few months back and they asked about Rance and he said talking to players when not in trade time should be off limits etc and only happen in trade time, then apparently richmond senior mgmnt and Hardwick met with yarran a few weeks back.

I get that, but how do the media think Selwood and Danger's have decided to leave their clubs and go to Geelong if they haven't met with the Cats officials or coaches?

They talk about Treloar like he's already a Pie, are we supposed to believe he hasn't spoken to any officials or coaches a Collingwood?

I'm happy for us to get flack for Yarran but where is it on the other clubs?

 

[Calcium Man]

Their spend on recruiting has proven to be justified. They won a premiership in 2010 wth about 9 players who were taken out of the rookie draft.
Yep we are above them but for how long??. Will they go past us again without us even making top 4??. Both imo are rrealistic questions.
The year our coach came they won a premiership. It is concievable they will go from premiership to rebuild and past us and we wont have made top 4 or won a final. I know who has done better.

It was justified but they also had the cash to spend. We were paying TW 750k a year, had no coaching staff and Geoff Miller did half the jobs in the footy department and 5 mill in debt. Makes it a hell of a lot easier when you have the money (and a competent board/ceo/FD) to actually spend.

It is also conceivable they won't go past us. Scharenberg looks likely to head home yes they'll bring in Treloar in response but Swan and Cloke will be another year older and they rely heavily on both. Freeman won't make it.

Plus we are not exactly old. Deledio is 28 and the most important player close to retirement, maybe Chappy. Cellis, Lennon, Vlastuin, McBean, Menadue, Martin, Bellis, Miles, Conca, Mcintosh ect... are all 24 and under.

Our kids are of a similar level and our stars are in a better age group.

 

[CHIMP MAGNET]

Who the **** is Gary Lyon?

 

[Calcium Man]

Gary Lyon having a go on the TV, Hardwick did an interview a few months back and they asked about Rance and he said talking to players when not in trade time should be off limits etc and only happen in trade time, then apparently richmond senior mgmnt and Hardwick met with yarran a few weeks back.

I'm pretty sure he said courting players through the media was wrong.

 

[Tiges1229]

I'm pretty sure he said courting players through the media was wrong.

Yer not sure , Lyon was getting on his high horse about it because its Richmond and he hates us. Pretty simple

 

[Tiges1229]

I get that, but how do the media think Selwood and Danger's have decided to leave their clubs and go to Geelong if they haven't met with the Cats officials or coaches?

They talk about Treloar like he's already a Pie, are we supposed to believe he hasn't spoken to any officials or coaches a Collingwood?

I'm happy for us to get flack for Yarran but where is it on the other clubs?

Lyon is a dickhead who cares what he says anyway, most media are.

 

[Calcium Man]

Yer not sure , Lyon was getting on his high horse about it because its Richmond and he hates us. Pretty simple

Just re-read Hardwicks comments and they were completely directed to talking about players from opposition clubs in the media. So he can **** right off, does he have a twitter i can abuse him on?

 

[theflea]

Just a few ideas
Kruezer ca - f/a
Tomlinson gws - trade Vickery or Griffiths and 3rd round pick for Tomlinson and 2nd round pick.bit optimistic probably.
Aaron Hall gcs - Out of contract get in his ear tiges.
Angus Litherland ha - Hawks have a good record of letting players go cheaply who arent getting a good go. late pick
Jarrad Redden p/a - not getting a game at port. In competition with Lobbe and Ryder. late pick

Theres plenty at other clubs. two others at Gws Townsend and plowman.

Tomlinson is no chance with those options, we would be a bandit there. Like Hall, Litherland too but is also not much of a defender, just a runner. Redden is another ruck plodder and doesn't do much around the ground, which is what we have already. Kruezer will stay.

 

[Spluff]

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Interesting-Matthew-Lobbe/1471576923089083

Beat me to it.

 

[Tiges1229]

Just re-read Hardwicks comments and they were completely directed to talking about players from opposition clubs in the media. So he can **** right off, does he have a twitter i can abuse him on?

I'm pretty sure Lyon would have one, if he doesn't just blame Robbo and abuse him and send him a tweet. lol

 

[Tiges1229]

I think if Yarran gets his head space right and gets more defensive with his game he would be good for the Tigers, he's a line breaker and quick.

 

[theflea]

I get that, but how do the media think Selwood and Danger's have decided to leave their clubs and go to Geelong if they haven't met with the Cats officials or coaches?

They talk about Treloar like he's already a Pie, are we supposed to believe he hasn't spoken to any officials or coaches a Collingwood?

I'm happy for us to get flack for Yarran but where is it on the other clubs?

His only point was that its a double standard for Dimma, considering his point in the presser. It was way over the top, but the point was there.

 

[theflea]

Just re-read Hardwicks comments and they were completely directed to talking about players from opposition clubs in the media. So he can **** right off, does he have a twitter i can abuse him on?

Dimma did say there is a draft/trade period where these things are done, not during the season. I think that was the quote which his tirade was about. As I said, it was over the top about tho. And I would add, they also said they believe Dimma was there but we only have their word that that was the case.

 

[theflea]

I would call 400K extravagant based on his output (not his fault I know but strictly on what he's been able to produce on the field the last few years) and I believe he was on considerably more than that

Yeah I think that injury should never be considered as you cant predict that. As to his pay, that is what I heard he was on.

 

[theflea]

I have to say Lambert is the exact type a lot of supporters have insisted we go after.As for Miles im pretty ceretain one Mark Williams had a fair bit to do with that.

If you want to see what can be achieved by a club in the rookie draft or even 4th round in the nd onwards, go look at Collingwood over the last 6 or 8 years.
The simple truth is FJ has been very poor in all areas outside of the first round.
He must have had 40 or more rookie picks in his ten years at the club and you would be hard pressed to name 5 decent players to come from it.

While this is fair, you have to add the lack of development during FJ's time esp early, plus the funding in the RD.

 

[mopsy]

It was justified but they also had the cash to spend. We were paying TW 750k a year, had no coaching staff and Geoff Miller did half the jobs in the footy department and 5 mill in debt. Makes it a hell of a lot easier when you have the money (and a competent board/ceo/FD) to actually spend.

It is also conceivable they won't go past us. Scharenberg looks likely to head home yes they'll bring in Treloar in response but Swan and Cloke will be another year older and they rely heavily on both. Freeman won't make it.

Plus we are not exactly old. Deledio is 28 and the most important player close to retirement, maybe Chappy. Cellis, Lennon, Vlastuin, McBean, Menadue, Martin, Bellis, Miles, Conca, Mcintosh ect... are all 24 and under.

Our kids are of a similar level and our stars are in a better age group.

While i expected them to play finals this year, i don't think their yr has been all that bad. I liken the year to our 2012, they have lost about 8 games by three goals or less and never been blown of the park.
They have rebuilt with out ever bottoming out, 11th last yr their worst finish in 9yrs, it will be a similar finish this yr. In effect they have rebuilt while playing finals. They have managed to do it thru good recruiting in both trades and drafts. Their ability to find good players with late nd picks and rookie picks has prevented them from ever bottoming out.

You do realise Cloke and Deledio are the same age, i suppose Brett isnt another yr older unlike Cloke is.. Cloke is just one year older than JR.
Big call on Freeman and Scharenburg. Both will be fine players imo, if the injury gods ever smile upon them. They wont be going anywhere.
Finally their list is actually younger than ours so they arent exactly old either. Imo i think they have more depth within their list than us.
Their oldest player is Swan at 31. Clinton Young and Sam Dwyer both depth players are the next oldest at 29.

Since we have had FJ we have struggled over ten yrs to just make finals twice, never winning one and never finishing top 4. Collingwood on the other hand have gone from 15th or second last to a flag in 2010. They have continued to make finals while doing a rebuild and are now poised to to go past us again over the next few years. What i dont get is how you can be critical of collingwood and their recruiting and not be critical of fj over the same period.
Their is no comparison they have absolutely smashed us when it comes to recruiting.

 

[Calcium Man]

While i expected them to play finals this year, i don't think their yr has been all that bad. I liken the year to our 2012, they have lost about 8 games by three goals or less and never been blown of the park.
They have rebuilt with out ever bottoming out, 11th last yr their worst finish in 9yrs, it will be a similar finish this yr. In effect they have rebuilt while playing finals. They have managed to do it thru good recruiting in both trades and drafts. Their ability to find good players with late nd picks and rookie picks has prevented them from ever bottoming out.

You do realise Cloke and Deledio are the same age, i suppose Brett isnt another yr older unlike Cloke is.. Cloke is just one year older than JR.
Big call on Freeman and Scharenburg. Both will be fine players imo, if the injury gods ever smile upon them. They wont be going anywhere.
Finally their list is actually younger than ours so they arent exactly old either. Imo i think they have more depth within their list than us.
Their oldest player is Swan at 31. Clinton Young and Sam Dwyer both depth players are the next oldest at 29.

Since we have had FJ we have struggled over ten yrs to just make finals twice, never winning one and never finishing top 4. Collingwood on the other hand have gone from 15th or second last to a flag in 2010. They have continued to make finals while doing a rebuild and are now poised to to go past us again over the next few years. What i dont get is how you can be critical of collingwood and their recruiting and not be critical of fj over the same period.
Their is no comparison they have absolutely smashed us when it comes to recruiting.

I thought Cloke was an 86er but he was as bottom age as lids. Still Key Forwards have a hell of lot more stresses on their body and very rarely play well past 30.

Not a big call on Freeman, he has off field issues.

Scharenberg is not a big call either, he apparently will not discuss contracts with Collingwood. Their board seem to think he has one foot out the exit.

List age is such a crap stat, its too easily distorted by outliers. They do have more players younger then 24. 26 to 22 but like i said our best players are just coming into their prime, they don't have anyone in that top end talent level between Pendlebury and Grundy except Sidebottom. That's a 6 year age gap, Treloar will help that and its why they are desperate for him as they know it with Beams gone.

You ignore a lot of facts in that 2nd last to premiership. They had a far superior base to us with Swan, Cloke, Shaw, Didak, Maxwell, Johnson, Harry O ect... as a base we had Newman and Deledio (I'm ignoring older guys likes Bucks and Richo). They had cash and development personal we could only dream of in an era before every club did it, no club ignores it like us, Essendon, Carlton, Adelaide, WCE, Freo, Dees ect did in that 03-09 era as we thought getting the best would be enough. They also got out in front with their game plan that took teams a few years to figure out.

I'm not critical of Collingwood's recruiting and I don't think i ever said that. But i do think its overrated because its Collingwood. Seedsman is a handy type but he has been found out a bit. Freeman I never rated, all that talk of Dangerfield like was bull. He is super quick but can't use it like Danger can. Scharenberg I rate very highly but where there is smoke there is fire and he is a loss. Degoey is a very good player and Moore is potential star. Grundy will be the best ruck in the league. But after that their young KPP is fairly thin and their older ones are so so outside Cloke. Elliot is a talent but has clear behavioural issues, Adam's is similar though seems to have settled, another good player like miles.

Guys like Langdon, Oxley, Crisp, Broomhead. Maynard are decent players but none will be more then solid contributors. Its a good list with potential but it still has a hell of a lot holes too.

 

[Tig22]

What do you guys think of Melksham? Dons will be rid of him cheap as chips really, and he has shown his talent prior to the asada scandal.

As long as he's cheap and free of the scandal (big if) then I'm keen. He's fiercely competitive and fills a role as a small forward /onballer

 

[Stevi_Tigers]

What do you guys think of Melksham? Dons will be rid of him cheap as chips really, and he has shown his talent prior to the asada scandal.

As long as he's cheap and free of the scandal (big if) then I'm keen. He's fiercely competitive and fills a role as a small forward /onballer

please tell me you are joking? most punchable head in the afl bloke is an a grade spud

 

[tencentpiece]

And according to Caro Carlton want him gone.

There's no way we're getting bent over if that's the case

We don't even have a coach yet, classic Caro talking out of her ass.

I don't watch nearly as much footy as I used to, but I've really only seen him played of a HBF or maybe a wing. Has he ever spent any significant time forward and if so, what was the consensus from Carlton perspective?

2013-14 he played forward, about half the year each year and kicked 26/21 with both Betts and Garlett in the side (granted some of those goals came from pushing through the backline). I think in a competitive team he is better across half back personally because of his damaging run, but would make more sense in your side as a wing/crumber.

If you get him right I can't see him kicking less than 25 goals a year with the higher end cap at around 45.

And according to Caro Carlton want him gone.

There's no way we're getting bent over if that's the case

We don't even have a coach yet, classic Caro talking out of her ass.

I don't watch nearly as much footy as I used to, but I've really only seen him played of a HBF or maybe a wing. Has he ever spent any significant time forward and if so, what was the consensus from Carlton perspective?

2013-14 he played forward, about half the year each year and kicked 26/21 with both Betts and Garlett in the side (granted some of those goals came from pushing through the backline). I think in a competitive team he is better across half back personally because of his damaging run, but would make more sense in your side as a wing/crumber.

If you get him right I can't see him kicking less than 25 goals a year with the higher end cap at around 45.

Why is Richmond/Dimma copping it for talking to Yarran yet Geelong go unscathed even though they've got Danger and Selwood all sewn up
according to the media?

You're allowed to talk to a player's manager during the season, but not to a player directly. Richmond have reportedly meet with Yarran directly which is outside the rules (personally I don't see the difference so I don't understand the outrage). It's also different because Yarran has a contract through next yer and Danger doesn't (not sure on Selwood's status). Either way bullshit rule.


P.S I don't think Kreuzer will go, even if we have pick one there is no guarantee we will get band one compo. He also wants to stay at the club after they have supported him through injury and has told his manager as such (even publicly). Once Bolton is announced, expect Kreuzer to sign ASAP.

Don't think your second will get the deal done either, shallow draft works both ways (e.g you don't want to trade your first because talent is still available). But who knows we've been ****ed in the past for an unhappy player. If his dad is the reason, it's kind of disappointing that Carlton hasn't provided more support - but who knows.

If he was uncontracted I think a second round pick would get it done, but I think Carlton would prefer to roll the dice in a shallow draft and either turn him into a club committed player or get better compo through FA (yes yes I know they might remove FA compo, but I don't think a pick in a 30's is that much to worry about loosing).

 

[_RT_]

Gotta say, Lambert looks a keeper.

For all the criticism that Blair and Dan get for failing to actually get a name the club, Frank is making them look good by getting Lambert, and Miles as rookie picks in successive years.

LIFT BLAIR !

Got hammered early in the year when I suggested that we upgrade him at seasons end to the main list because he's a plodder. If you can find the footy at VFL level you can find it at senior level. Just need consistent game time to show it.

 

[TigerTime88]

What do you guys think of Melksham? Dons will be rid of him cheap as chips really, and he has shown his talent prior to the asada scandal.

As long as he's cheap and free of the scandal (big if) then I'm keen. He's fiercely competitive and fills a role as a small forward /onballer

No way he is horrible.

 

[Frustrated Tiger]

What do you guys think of Melksham? Dons will be rid of him cheap as chips really, and he has shown his talent prior to the asada scandal.

As long as he's cheap and free of the scandal (big if) then I'm keen. He's fiercely competitive and fills a role as a small forward /onballer

 

[TigerTime88]

With Chaplin getting on and also being pretty average, I wouldn't mind getting Caralile for our first pick.

Could be a steal of a trade...

 

[THE THIN MAN]

With Chaplin getting on and also being pretty average, I wouldn't mind getting Caralile for our first pick.

Could be a steal of a trade...

Jake Carlisle from Essendon; I would not touch any players from Essendon due to WADA and they are extremely difficult to deal with.

Besides why should we help them;

Matthew Lloyd being made a life member at the Essendon and there was a little quote in his acceptence speech
" You speak to people like Ty Zantuck who have come from Richmond and it just makes you appreciate playing for such a proud club " @ Herald Sun 17 December 2004

Matthew Lloyd hits back over attack from former Essendon coach Matthew Knights
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/i-was-a-team-player-lloyd/story-fn5937w8-1226085457619