Bluemour Melting Pot XXV

[Aphrodite]

Continued here ...

Bluemour Melting Pot XXVI

As per the Bluemour File OP, this is a thread for discussing Carlton related rumours. http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bluemour-file.1085141/ Rumour posters should post their rumours in both threads for those that like just to read rumours and for those that like to have get lost in their...

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[Bluebag13]

Whipping boys
Drugs
Grammar

Off season staples...

When does mcgoverns contract end?

 

[Bostonian]

I would suggest revisiting expecting a player to be "Walsh like" in the first place and you might adjust your expectations going forward.

Some people just embrace low standards.

 

[Blueballs38]

what would stack's trade value be?

Seriously discussing this .,.. absurd

 

[KnaveyBlue]

We're everyone's best game....

Not another team in the league where opposition plodders have a career-best game more than against us...

Some other clubs have had it pretty rough tbh.

Imagine missing the top 4 by 2 pts then getting knocked out of the finals by a guy who was called up as an emergency for a team who shouldn’t have even been playing.

Nick Duigan, 2013 Elimination Final, shortly after smashing a foot long sub.

 

[Macca43]

Some people just embrace low standards.

Others set their expectations too high.

I am a realist.

 

[Bostonian]

Others set their expectations too high.

I am a realist.

A realist would have no issues in trading him out for better talent. I consider myself a realist.

 

[Coops93]

And so we give Weitering a pass for that but don't make allowances for Dow being used forward (after building nicely to that point) then spending his third season injured and hampered by covid restrictions?

And like Walsh Weitering is an outlier not the norm.

Complaints about his disposal were getting louder despite ok possession numbers before being moved forward. There weren't really any complaints around Weitering before his shift and it was fairly obvious that his mismanagement caused his form slump.

The same can't be said for Dow, his kicking was getting worse even when playing his natural position. Moving forward clearly hasn't worked for him, but even though it obviously wasn't a fit for Weiters he still showed flashes of his talent by kicking 3 on Rance. Dow hasn't had any such flashes of his ability. He's been mismanaged as well, but the troubles with him started before that.

 

[DangerousD]

Most of those weren't huge purchases in terms of the news cycle though. Their place in the game not as big as most of the ones I mentioned.

Lake was seemingly busted. Gibson nowhere near as good as he became. Frawley did generate Melbourne top tier compensation which most people didn't think he was worth. Burgoyne was good at Port but again, nowhere near the consistent player he became.

Hawks gave up a top 10 pick and Williams to get the job done, to get Williams the Bombers parted with pick 16, it was a big investment at the time.

 

[NavySteel]

Some other clubs have had it pretty rough tbh.

Imagine missing the top 4 by 2 pts then getting knocked out of the finals by a guy who was called up as an emergency for a team who shouldn’t have even been playing.

Nick Duigan, 2013 Elimination Final, shortly after smashing a foot long sub.

And long shall we celebrate Nick Duigan Day!

 

[Macca43]

Complaints about his disposal were getting louder despite ok possession numbers before being moved forward. There weren't really any complaints around Weitering before his shift and it was fairly obvious that his mismanagement caused his form slump.

The same can't be said for Dow, his kicking was getting worse even when playing his natural position. Moving forward clearly hasn't worked for him, but even though it obviously wasn't a fit for Weiters he still showed flashes of his talent by kicking 3 on Rance. Dow hasn't had any such flashes of his ability. He's been mismanaged as well, but the troubles with him started before that.

"The same can't be said for Dow, his kicking was getting worse even when playing his natural position." Did you catch Setterfield's comments about his disposal last year and the improvement this year? He said how another pre-season allowed him to get fit enough so that when he got the ball he wasn't spent so he was able to kick it better. I would think a second year player who was playing predominantly on ball might have found a similar problem?

"it was fairly obvious that his mismanagement caused his form slump." And what caused Dow's? His last game before being shifted forward he had 21 touches, 5 tackles and 5 clearances.

 

[Sin City]

Name a big fish thats went to another club and won a flag. It doesn't always eventuate

Dion Prestia. Great player that Gold Coast fell apart without and he brought Richmond up to another level. B&F in a premiership year last year.

Still a chance we’ll be adding Dangerfield or Lachie Neale to that list this year anyway.

Besides that, you should never limit yourself with that kind of thinking. If you have a chance at adding a good player to the team who can take the team forward, that you can afford and is the right fit then you do it.

 

[Macca43]

A realist would have no issues in trading him out for better talent. I consider myself a realist.

A realist with unrealistic expectations.

If Dow was part of a Judd like trade I wouldn't be upset, but like Kennedy before him I could see the deal hurting us in the back end.

 

[Shakin77]

I don't think you'll find former Brownlow medalist on any of his lists of achievements.
I used to believe I was God's gift to women, but the women collectively decided I was not a gift they wanted; the same way the AFL community decided that Jobronie is no winner of the Brownlow.

Unlike your good self Jobe did hold the title which he was later stripped of. He is no longer. But once was.

 

[Gethelred]

Some other clubs have had it pretty rough tbh.

Imagine missing the top 4 by 2 pts then getting knocked out of the finals by a guy who was called up as an emergency for a team who shouldn’t have even been playing.

Nick Duigan, 2013 Elimination Final, shortly after smashing a foot long sub.

I am truly surprised he didn't get an advertising gig out of that.

 

[katmanblue]

3:07 in this pre season game of his first year. The talent is there, I just don't think he's there physically yet.

It's the only positive passage of play I can recall from Dow.



On SM-N960F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Blue and Blue]

Cant think of too many Walshes in my time. To come in at that age and be so good. Possibly none that played two first seasons and just kept getting better. Might be the 'freak' of all time.

 

[Macca43]

Cant think of too many Walshes in my time. To come in at that age and be so good. Possibly none that played two first seasons and just kept getting better. Might be the 'freak' of all time.

And if we looked at Walsh's disposal by foot you would find a lot of similar error's to what Dow has made.

 

[mikeythemoocow]

Where will you all be when McGovern kicks 3 and has 15 touches in a final next year?

Bullring

 

[mikeythemoocow]

Apart from that 1 legendary game, you'd have to say he floundered at the Dogs.

He killed it all finals

 

[Stamos]

I guess I look for more consistency than that.

Walsh like consistency for high picks.

There is literally only one player with Walsh-like consistency.
If you're expecting that from others, you'll be disappointed every single time.

 

[F_therest]

There is a difference between thinking Dow has been very disappointing so far and thinking now is the time to trade him.

He's definitely been disappointing - you need your eyes tested if you think he's met expectations so far for a #3 draft pick. HOWEVER, you don't "sell low" in the stock market. He can still make it into an impactful AFL player, he's young enough. Now is the time to hold and hopefully he's a "late bloomer" type who grows into his body and game and that gives him the confidence that he belongs at the level. No point chucking him out now for peanuts.

I'm down on him, I'm annoyed by him, and I'm hugely disappointed in what we got from that draft SO FAR. But I don't think trading him is a good idea.

Gonna bump this post since the Dow arguments are still happening.

There's is no doubt Dow has been disappointing overall, with only a few glimpses of good play at AFL level in his 3 years so far. We'd have hoped for more from a pick 3 midfielder by now.

I'm in the camp that his kicking has been poor, his running power and agility looks a bit weak and he doesn't appear to bring a lot of intensity. The games I've watched his defensive pressure has been really poor around the ball...he's there but he's not making a real impact and causing turnovers (making stats about his defensive pressure misleading as they often are). The contrast is stark when compared to the likes of Walsh/Smith/Butters who have had immediate impacts and play with impressive intensity.

However there are plenty of other recent top picks who haven't done a whole lot yet either and it's way too early to talk about trading him...right now his value would be really low anyway, we're better off holding onto him and hoping he blossoms.

 

[El Topo]

Complaints about his disposal were getting louder despite ok possession numbers before being moved forward. There weren't really any complaints around Weitering before his shift and it was fairly obvious that his mismanagement caused his form slump.

The same can't be said for Dow, his kicking was getting worse even when playing his natural position. Moving forward clearly hasn't worked for him, but even though it obviously wasn't a fit for Weiters he still showed flashes of his talent by kicking 3 on Rance. Dow hasn't had any such flashes of his ability. He's been mismanaged as well, but the troubles with him started before that.

I'd say the mismanagement was squarely in the first half of 2019, when Dow was an undersized unfit teenager being asked to line up in the centre square while senior mids twiddled their thumbs in the forward line. The total loss of confidence is clear from his deterioration in that period - if he makes it as a player, Teague pulling him out of the middle will have been the thing that saved him.

 

[ajb72]

Dow has the ability to win his own ball. He is currently being held from his optimum position by the like of cripps, ed & setters.
He has the pace we lack from those three, but doesn't have the body yet to compete and break tackles with the mature mid bodies.
if the final series shows anything, it is you need a lot of strong bodied mids to keep smashing in.
It wont be long and he will be breaking the first tackle, drawing multiple tacklers, creating space.
Tossing him away would be a stupid move.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

And if we looked at Walsh's disposal by foot you would find a lot of similar error's to what Dow has made.

It's not the same when Walsh is missing 5 out of 25 targets and Dow is missing 5 out of 8.

PS - I'm pro-Dow

 

[Arr0w]

This joint needs another rumour