Brisbane face another big loss

[Hicham]

From Hun Footy:

Lions face another big loss
12 July 2007 Herald Sun
Damian Barrett

THE Brisbane Lions' on-field problems are being reflected off it, with the club preparing for another operating loss on the 2007 season.

Revenue is down significantly and a sizeable loss is expected, despite major cost reductions that shaved about $500,000 from outgoings at the start of the year.

Lions chief executive Michael Bowers said the books had reverted to 2001 figures, a season in which the club played in the first of four consecutive Grand Finals.

"We're finding that everything seems to be off about 17 to 20 per cent," Bowers said.

"And that is like the cream on the cake for us. We are finding the cream gone and in some places some of the cake is missing as well.

"It is a fickle market up here and that is the thing that has disappointed us more than anything.

"It ebbs and flows a bit and the tide is a bit greater than we thought it would be."

Brisbane's most recent match at the Gabba, in Round 13 against Port Adelaide, attracted 22,000 spectators -- about 10,000 fewer than the ground average in 2004.

While a Bledisloe Cup match and a Brisbane Broncos game were broadcast live into Brisbane that night, the crowd figure concerned Lions officials.

The Lions recorded profits on the 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005 seasons, but lost nearly $1 million last year on about $30 million turnover.

The club is debt-free, having been able to invest several million dollars in long-term accounts during the boom of 2001-04, and the 2007 results will be cushioned by money raised at a Melbourne function on August 11 to celebrate the reunion of all Fitzroy and Brisbane players.

"But we are on track to make a loss, no doubt," Bowers said.

"We budgeted on a sell-out for all our boxes and suites. We budgeted on membership being a certain level, tickets being a certain level.

"From last year to this year, our membership and gate receipts we were forecasting are probably going to be about $1.5 million down from where they were."

Brisbane's predictions of a loss have dashed the AFL's hopes of having all clubs record a profit this year. Each club is to be given an extra $1.2 million this year because of the TV-rights windfall.

Bowers said the Lions would ask the AFL for a greater annual distribution to help cover some costs the club says are unique to it, including the running of a suburban Brisbane oval, which is used for training and by other local clubs.

A significant part of the Lions' cash problems relates to the back-ending of several big-name player contracts, including Michael Voss, Justin Leppitsch and Chris Scott.

"If we had our time again, a couple of years ago when we were raking in profits, we possibly would have liked to have accrued some of this year's player salaries into previous years," Bowers said.

Cap concessions again?

 

[becky]

Cap concessions? No.

So to be profitable they have to be winning. Cap concessions could provide this as they did previously but **** that, how many gifts do they want?

They can leech off the CBF with the other bums

 

[Father Jack]

We had someone from the Lions in a uni lecture last year admit that they did nothing to capitalise on their success during the premiership years. They didn't have to do anything, people kept turning up as long as they kept winning flags. Once that stopped they were caught very flat footed.

 

[Warwick]

Cap concessions?

Some people really have no idea.

 

[jerry springer]

Cap concessions?

Some people really have no idea.

well explain to us then genius?

 

[jerry springer]

A significant part of the Lions' cash problems relates to the back-ending of several big-name player contracts, including Michael Voss, Justin Leppitsch and Chris Scott.

"If we had our time again, a couple of years ago when we were raking in profits, we possibly would have liked to have accrued some of this year's player salaries into previous years," Bowers said.

ther'es your problem right there,giving big contracts to broken players

sounds like bad management.stop bleating

 

[possum8]

Its pretty simple.

In Queensland, people do not turn up if your team is loosing.
When people don't turn up, you don't make money.

When we were winning 2001-2002-2003-2004 you had just about any pleb in Brisbane wanting to go. Now its only the die hard fans that turn up.

Also another factor is that it costs so much to goto a game. Its like $45.00 for an adult seat, in comparison to something like the $20 bucks to goto a broncos or roar game.

 

[BBFFC]

We had someone from the Lions in a uni lecture last year admit that they did nothing to capitalise on their success during the premiership years. They didn't have to do anything, people kept turning up as long as they kept winning flags. Once that stopped they were caught very flat footed.

Thats so not the case just live in Brisbane to see the rise of footy, as a sport that kids want to play, participation rates have sored since the lions success. There was a mass amount of marketing from the club and AFLQ. Yep member numbers have dropped off, that happens to every club when they are struggling, especially clubs that do not have the traditional strong suporter base.

And springer- Big contracts to broken players? They were back ended, to acheive the premierships, and had to be to acheive the success- What Bowers is saying is they should of used some of the record profits to pay off some of these contracts.

 

[Grimreepah]

well explain to us then genius?

Cap concessions relate to clubs being able to retain their players, not to make a profit.

 

[jerry springer]

Cap concessions relate to clubs being able to retain their players, not to make a profit.

it affect your profits if you are paying player who arent playing..

from your boss

A significant part of the Lions' cash problems relates to the back-ending of several big-name player contracts, including Michael Voss, Justin Leppitsch and Chris Scott.

 

[Father Jack]

Thats so not the case just live in Brisbane to see the rise of footy, as a sport that kids want to play, participation rates have sored since the lions success. There was a mass amount of marketing from the club and AFLQ. Yep member numbers have dropped off, that happens to every club when they are struggling, especially clubs that do not have the traditional strong suporter base.

And springer- Big contracts to broken players? They were back ended, to acheive the premierships, and had to be to acheive the success- What Bowers is saying is they should of used some of the record profits to pay off some of these contracts.

It's not the whole reason why they are struggling now, but they missed an opportunity when they were on top. This was someone from their membership department saying this as well.

 

[Hawkk]

We had someone from the Lions in a uni lecture last year admit that they did nothing to capitalise on their success during the premiership years. They didn't have to do anything, people kept turning up as long as they kept winning flags. Once that stopped they were caught very flat footed.

At the end of the day, the Lions biggest down fall was their arrogance. Most of their hardcore 20,000 odd support that remains was built on the back of the Bears/Lions 1990's grassroots work.

The 3 flags did nothing to build on the Lions long term support.

 

[BigCat2]

it affect your profits if you are paying player who arent playing..

That's not the point. I mean theoretically Brisbane could be given a $100million salary cap, but you still need to pay the money yourself.

As for back ended contracts, they were done so we could retain our star players when we were going for the flags, a price I'm happy to pay any day to win 3 straight premierships.

 

[BBFFC]

It's not the whole reason why they are struggling now, but they missed an opportunity when they were on top. This was someone from their membership department saying this as well.

I definately disagree- even with the merbership department folk-They have done all that is expected of them to retain members- take it from one. You need to have lived here to understand how far the sport has come here.

You cant make people spend there money if they dont want to, its going to take a long time to develop the level of passionate supporters that the big clubs have.

Just think were the sport in brisbane would be if we did not win 3 premierships?

 

[BigCat2]

At the end of the day, the Lions biggest down fall was their arrogance. Most of their hardcore 20,000 odd support that remains was built on the back of the Bears/Lions 1990's grassroots work.

The 3 flags did nothing to build on the Lions long term support.

Though I don't wholly agree, I think there's some truth in this. I think the club could have done more to build on the success, to at least maintain a viable supporter and membership size. I mean, it's easier to cover say a loss of 5000 members during your down time if your usual membership is around 40000 (to 35000) than 30000 (to 25000) - whether this was possible is not known. But usually you're going to lose members anyway when you're not performing.

I suppose it can also be argued that North Melbourne didn't build on their success in the 90s properly either, and are now struggling.

 

[jerry springer]

That's not the point. I mean theoretically Brisbane could be given a $100million salary cap, but you still need to pay the money yourself.

As for back ended contracts, they were done so we could retain our star players when we were going for the flags, a price I'm happy to pay any day to win 3 straight premierships.

it is the point,for a few years north and the dogs only payed 92% of the cap


you guys are paying footballers who arent on the field playing football.one is coaching the other is commentaing.you made a poor investment,how hard is it?

 

[jerry springer]

I
You cant make people spend there money if they dont want to, its going to take a long time to develop the level of passionate supporters that the big clubs have.

Just think were the sport in brisbane would be if we did not win 3 premierships?

I always said the worst thing the storm did was win the flag in their 2nd year.

 

[BigCat2]

it is the point,for a few years north and the dogs only payed 92% of the cap


you guys are paying footballers who arent on the field playing football.one is coaching the other is commentaing.you made a poor investment,how hard is it?

Err, poor investment?

Ok say Michael Voss is worth $500k a year, say he signs a 5 year contract (totalling $2.5million).

Instead of paying him $500k every year for the 5 years, we decided to pay him less in the earlier years (to stay in the cap) and pay him more in the later years, still totalling $2.5million over the 5 years. That's what a back ended contract is.

How is that poor investment?

 

[jerry springer]

Err, poor investment?

Ok say Michael Voss is worth $500k a year, say he signs a 5 year contract (totalling $2.5million).

Instead of paying him $500k every year for the 5 years, we decided to pay him less in the earlier years (to stay in the cap) and pay him more in the later years, still totalling $2.5million over the 5 years. That's what a back ended contract is.

How is that poor investment?

because he didnt play out his contract.he is not playing now and taking a spot on the roster that a young kid could have

 

[Warwick]

As for back ended contracts, they were done so we could retain our star players when we were going for the flags, a price I'm happy to pay any day to win 3 straight premierships.

Exactly. And we will do it all again in an instant for the same results. Voss and Scotts contracts will come off the books at the end of the season. That will open up $1.5 million of cap space. I don't think that has anything to do with the losses.

The three premierships did a hell of a lot for introducing new fans to the game and increasing participation rates. It's naive to think that success did nothing.

People have to remember that most Gabba crowds are 85% Lions' supporters. Struggling Melbourne clubs play home games against other Melbourne clubs. We don't get that luxury.

We also have a lot of competition up here with the Broncos, Titans, Bullets, Roar, Reds etc. We always sell out rugby and league internations as well. Our population is much smaller compared to Melbourne and Sydney, who have even more sporting teams.

We are not a footy state either. The losses aren't great, and tend to indicate incompetence by those in charge, but we are still trying to grab a foothold in a league and rugby dominated fortress.

 

[Grimreepah]

you guys are paying footballers who arent on the field playing football.one is coaching the other is commentaing.you made a poor investment,how hard is it?

Not a poor investment. A back-ending contract just means the value of that player doesn't necessarily present in the same year as you pay him. We have already benefited and now we are paying.

 

[Warwick]

because he didnt play out his contract.he is not playing now and taking a spot on the roster that a young kid could have

We were not allowed to simply pay Voss out last year. He had to spend a year on the list.

His injuries were such that he couldn't continue this year - he can barely walk.

No sensible Brisbane fan regrets the Voss situation now. Why should you care?

 

[jerry springer]

Exactly. And we will do it all again in an instant for the same results. Voss and Scotts contracts will come off the books at the end of the season. That will open up $1.5 million of cap space. I don't think that has anything to do with the losses.

.

good then dont bleat to the media when the hard times arrive

 

[Grimreepah]

good then dont bleat to the media when the hard times arrive

Why should CEOs be forbidden from explaining their financial situation to the public?

 

[Warwick]

good then dont bleat to the media when the hard times arrive

Why do you have such a chip on your shoulder?

Bowers' isn't asking for your sympathy.