Brisbane needs help

[Sydney Bloods]

Its hard to justify giving Lions extra money in the salary cap if they run at a big financial loss every year already. All they will do is spend more and get further into debt which the AFL (wce, frem, ade, geel, coll, haw, rich, ess) will have to pay off for them.

Pitiful logic, without Tv rights not even Collingwood would be making profit. Obviously just throwing money at them isn't the answer, but lose Brisbane and we lose one of the key selling points of the AFL, "it's a national sport."

It needs careful management, right now it's being run by someone who's only in it to Line his pockets. The AFL is protecting him.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

The NRL don't need to market NRL in Brisbane because the Broncos are the iconic brand in Brisbane.

As a club, the are like Collingwood, except they have an entire city virtually to themselves. The support for them will only continue down generation.

The Roar are developing into a big club and soccer has always had a strong presence in Brisbane even before the A League.

SE Queensland in an AFL context will be dominated by Gold Coast. GC has a large number of Victorians who retire there and they will be a very successful team in the next 5 years.

Northern Queensland will always be NRL heartland. Brisbane simply hold no value to the AFL long term.

The Gold coast are a regional town, that has seen every single sports team put in there collapse. If the AFL's Qld strategy is the gold coast they are muppets.

Brisbane is the key, not just for tv rights but long term support in Qld.

 

[skipper kelly]

Brisbane simply hold no value to the AFL long term.

All their value is long term.

 

[fabulousphil]

Look at their crowds. They are unsustainable at that level. It's also indicative of the level of interest in the game.

At their best, they were outdrawing the Broncos. Of course the Broncos had huge community support to back them up. The die hard Lion supporters and a whole lot of fair weather Klingons made the most of that successful era. But right here, right now is where their true support levels are. And it's telling a story.

Do you ever actually do any research, or do you just take wild guesses.

ATM they are pretty low, pretty low on form, pretty low on decent players and it appears a weak admin.

Yet there home averge attendances dont seem to have changed much since 2011.

2011 20,462

2012 20,340

2013 21,083

2014 20,554 ( 6 games )

Was not long ago that Port Adelaide was getting this type of crowd, North Melbourne, WB, Melbourne consistently get crowds like this or lower, with the benefit of playing derbies week in week out.

It is pretty clear they have a huge pool of potential fans looking to see some postives from the club in a myriad of ways.

And in the scheme of many sports here and around the world a crowd of 20,000 per home game is quite acceptable.

 

[FuManchu]

Do you ever actually do any research, or do you just take wild guesses.

ATM they are pretty low, pretty low on form, pretty low on decent players and it appears a weak admin.

Yet there home averge attendances dont seem to have changed much since 2011.

2011 20,462

2012 20,340

2013 21,083

2014 20,554 ( 6 games )

Was not long ago that Port Adelaide was getting this type of crowd, North Melbourne, WB, Melbourne consistently get crowds like this or lower, with the benefit of playing derbies week in week out.

It is pretty clear they have a huge pool of potential fans looking to see some postives from the club in a myriad of ways.

And in the scheme of many sports here and around the world a crowd of 20,000 per home game is quite acceptable.

When I lived up there, they were around the 27k mark. Sometimes outdrawing the Broncos. So yeah, I do my homework. They've dropped 25% in the space of 10 yrs.

 

[fabulousphil]

When I lived up there, they were around the 27k mark. Sometimes outdrawing the Broncos. So yeah, I do my homework. You've dropped 25% in the space of 10 yrs.

Yes because they been dropping down the ladder, dropping money and people are losing their confidence in them.

If fans see positives they will return, it is pretty simple, if Collingwood had a bad 10 years even there fans would start to drop off.

I can distinctly remember the lack of fans at Vic park for their last game there flogged by the Lions.

 

[Happy_Neale]

Its hard to justify giving Lions extra money in the salary cap if they run at a big financial loss every year already. All they will do is spend more and get further into debt which the AFL (wce, frem, ade, geel, coll, haw, rich, ess) will have to pay off for them.

What an ignorant thing to say. A significant part of our losses are due to being charged through the nose to remain based at the GABBA, a situation we have been looking to rectify for a while now.

 

[FuManchu]

Yes because they been dropping down the ladder, dropping money and people are losing their confidence in them.

If fans see positives they will return, it is pretty simple, if Collingwood had a bad 10 years even there fans would start to drop off.

I can distinctly remember the lack of fans at Vic park for their last game there flogged by the Lions.

The major difference is Collingwood don't have a thin veneer of support. I lived in Bris for 5 yrs. beyond that 27k that showed some interest when they were on song, there isn't much more support. The game is not part of the city's psyche.

 

[John]

The game is not part of the city's psyche.

Unfortunately I have to agree.

With that in mind Auskick numbers are very high and both League and Union are bleeding juniors in the Brisbane district due to the influx of Islanders who are built like adults at the age of 13/14 and smashing Anglo kids to bits. Mums are not keen on this hence the movement to our code and Soccer. The AFL needs to take this shift in junior sport on-board. It has to be a long term project to get footy stronger in Brisbane and the SE corner in general.

 

[MacMum]

I can distinctly remember the lack of fans at Vic park for their last game there flogged by the Lions.

Flogged by the Lions then......flogged by the Lions in TWO grand finals...

yep, can see a pattern that has developed there.

..Collingwood (and Eddie) hate Lions with a passion, and will go to any lengths to denigrate and try to weaken the stature of the club.

 

[Port 2004]

Um ..have you quoted the right poster?.....There seem to be an obvious brain fade which needed a gentle reminder there was help...(Thinking I might have stumbled across a common theme with Port folk)
Here's the convo....

And since 1997 only, forgetting the money that they generated as the most followed SANFL Club, Port has generated $65million for the SANFL from catering and car parking alone. (SANFL released figures by the way). So don't try and tell me that they should not have received some of their own money back, due a crapp stadium deal. And perhaps we could start talking about the money that the vast majority of AFL clubs receive on an ongoing basis from the AFL.







My argument is that the AFL's outpost in Rugby league need developing and need the same sort of coin thrown at them, as was thrown at the Melbourne and South Australian clubs, to get it to work..

We have a Media performing President who is complaining that there are too many spuds in the game...yet... he is wanting the end of both Sydney's & Brisbane's academies their crime, they are developing players in Rugby states that could work out to be more than spuds......and the teams could become stronger and makes it harder for his side to compete.

Brisbane, as the Bears then Lions have been in the AFL for quarter of a century...Yet it is only this year that the AFL have changed the 2nd tier (reserves) competition (trying to bring it up to speed of VFL and SA)...We talk about go home and here is something to contemplate, when a young kid is drafted they'll likely spend 1 to 2 years in development in the reserves...Now if the competition is of the standard of 4th tier comp (amateur) leagues in pro football states how is that helping their development? Might as well get the chip manufacturer down there...A player can kick a bagful of goals in a reserves in Qld league...but that still wont be anywhere near the standard it takesto make it at senior level and their stats when they are called up are telling...A player gets to the end of their 2 year contract and possibly be thinking.. I can play reserve football just as well in my home state in a much stronger competition that will benefit my development..than I can here..

 

[Football Pope]

And since 1997 only, forgetting the money that they generated as the most followed SANFL Club, Port has generated $65million for the SANFL from catering and car parking alone. (SANFL released figures by the way). So don't try and tell me that they should not have received some of their own money back, due a crapp stadium deal. And perhaps we could start talking about the money that the vast majority of AFL clubs receive on an ongoing basis from the AFL.

Where have I said anything about Port not being entitled to receiving a hand out from the AFL?... Regardless of how much Port has put in to the SANFL or the cause of financial stadium deal, or who had club level signed off, on that bad deal..When they needed some of the 'generated funds'...the old coffers were bare and so they went cap in hand to the AFL, which is contrary to what your fellow supporter suggested....

.Port were as bad as both of them 2 years ago and no help was given to them.

 

[Power Raid]

Should they consider merging with a victorian club?

Brisbane Demons?

 

[leeloo]

Explain Des Headland, a number 1 draft pick, walking out in the middle of the Premiership era then. They hardly had a poor culture then.

Brisbane recruited a player that quite openly stated that he didn't want to leave Perth. He was always going to go home.

All clubs have to deal with it.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...521393216?nk=323553d964f0b921ae96d85fb287930c

2. The player/players who don't want to go

ALL players who enter the draft say the same thing - they don't care where they get picked, they just want to play AFL football. That sounds great on paper, but it is much scarier when it hits you square in the face. Take 1998 No.1 draft pick Des Headland, for example. Headland was desperately hoping to go pick No.2 - as Fremantle had the selection and he wanted to stay in his native Western Australia. But the Lions wanted him. Headland put on a brave face as his name was read out, but it was written all over his face. Headland is not alone - every year there is at the very least one youngster shattered that he is about to pack up and move to Adelaide/Perth/Brisbane etc. Sometimes the parents take it harder than the player himself.

 

[Ceebee]

I had a similar experience. I got a text telling me about his retirement while I was in an office less than 1km from the Gabba with 15 people who all know I'm a big Lions fan. Someone asked about my "naaaaw" reaction. When I told them that Jonathan Brown had retired I got one "Is that the big guy from the Lions?" but only blank looks or shrugs from the rest.

Sadly that is how it is up here.
Apart from diehard fans no one in Queensland cares about aerial ping pong..This is is usually said with a dismissive smirk by rugby league stalwarts who dispise our game.
If you live in any other state but NSW you have honestly no idea what it is like up here.
That includes you fat Eddie.you who took any support we had away.
Hope Pies never win another flag in your lifetime you self centred %&-+

 

[John]

Brisbane recruited a player that quite openly stated that he didn't want to leave Perth. He was always going to go home.

May as well let every player who nominates for the draft name the club of their choice.

 

[MacMum]

Should they consider merging with a victorian club?

Brisbane Demons?

er, we already did that.

 

[whatboutbob]

May as well let every player who nominates for the draft name the club of their choice.

Yep. With 97/3, what could possibly go wrong?

 

[leeloo]

May as well let every player who nominates for the draft name the club of their choice.

He used Des Headland as an example of a player who left even when Brisbane had a good culture, it was a bad example. Headland didn't hide the fact that he didn't want to be drafted out of WA, he was always going to go back home. He even wore a Fremantle polo on draft day.

Funny though, Freo currently has a Qld player on our list, Lee Spurr. Playing his 50th game this weekend. Drafted as a 24 year old, had to move to SA to get his chance.

 

[John]

He used Des Headland as an example of a player who left even when Brisbane had a good culture, it was a bad example. Headland didn't hide the fact that he didn't want to be drafted out of WA, he was always going to go back home. He even wore a Fremantle polo on draft day.

Funny though, Freo currently has a Qld player on our list, Lee Spurr. Playing his 50th game this weekend. Drafted as a 24 year old, had to move to SA to get his chance.

No it was not a bad example. I was there when Des said to his fellow players he was staying but he later changed his mind. FWIW the Lions had his family over including
his mum, dad and his netball playing sister and still he still moved on from a team at the height of it's powers.

 

[whatboutbob]

He used Des Headland as an example of a player who left even when Brisbane had a good culture, it was a bad example. Headland didn't hide the fact that he didn't want to be drafted out of WA, he was always going to go back home. He even wore a Fremantle polo on draft day.

Yep, let's ignore the elite midfield talent and draft a mature-aged fringe small defender. That'll move the club forward.

Funny though, Freo currently has a Qld player on our list, Lee Spurr. Playing his 50th game this weekend. Drafted as a 24 year old, had to move to SA to get his chance.

So he moved to SA, played there for 5 years before any one of the 18 teams in the competition took notice, and that's the Lions letting opportunity slip?

 

[TedDougChris]

Where do you get this idea we have exclusive access to everyone? We can take one player from the zone we develop likewise now GWS have 3/4 of the state they can have exactly one pick from their academy.

It's done as exactly the same as a father son, we can nominate a player if someone else wants them we have to take them with a our next available pick.

If there is a colossal amount of talent coming through it would overflow into other states anyway.

This crying over our academies just shows what a sad bunch people are, you still buy the lies force fed to you about how the cola works, now this shit that nobody has access to the swans academy.

We get one pick a year from a state that produces 2% of draftees, now we get 1/4 of that 2%.

You do realise there's an entire state zone which everyone has access to yes? If the players are not developed by these clubs and just come through the system as normal then there's no special access. It's only academy players we get access to and why shouldn't we?

It's now up to GWS to develop its academy players and they already have a leg up seeing they have taken over academies we have already put the hard yards into.

Giving first pick from both academies because of finishing position defeats the purpose of the academies. Imagine ten 5-6 years by now, some gun kid comes out of the Riverina a GWS academy player they have put the hardyards into developing him.... And we get him because we finish one spot lower on the ladder?

You would all be up in arms again. As long as its the clubs putting the work in, it's the clubs that should get the reward.

Sorry for the delayed reply.

Understand why you are angry about it, but if you read through what else I've posted I'm not actually against the academy idea. What I am against is things which systematically favour some clubs over other clubs. And the problem that you (as Sydney) have, is that people down here are so sick of the rorting and favouritism that has gone on up north, that legitimate things are being targeted. People have suggested a retention allowance and other money in the cap which will disadvantage every other club, so I'm trying to tinker around the edges with suggestions that don't ruin what has been in place, but makes it more palatable for other clubs.

I actually agree, that these academies are a good thing to develop the kids in the northern states (as I've stated elsewhere). But in the olden days, the Victorian clubs had access to zones and these were removed, giving all clubs access to these kids. Now what the other clubs see are certain clubs with zone access, extra money in the cap, priority access to certain players, the first 200 picks in the draft and so on and so on. There are artificial constraints in the system you have used to stay at or towards the top for far longer than the system is designed to allow. And these artificial constraints are coming under scrutiny.

Given that some clubs are putting cash into an equalisation fund, these clubs are now looking around and saying - if we are doing this, we want ALL things to be equal (well the things that suit them) - and they are not. They are looking at a club (Swans) getting access to a player (Heeney ?) that some experts state could be the most complete player, let alone midfielder in the draft this year. And they are saying, if he lived anywhere else, it would be a random selection, not just a gimme for Sydney. And that's not fair.

The academy systems have been set up largely with AFL money, as all the activities into NSW and QLD have been. And the clubs are stating - we own an 18th of that development, not nothing - which is what most of them get.

From my perspective, I don't see the value in having two separate academy systems in each state. One system, in multiple locations and a pooling of the resources. Because sharing the resources between yourselves and GWS will be infinitely better than what WILL happen to the system, if you continue to resist. People like Eddie get what they want, eventually. So over to you, do you want to lose 100% of the benefit you have tried to create, or just some of it...

 

[SizeMatters]

I think the answer is to bring Fitzroy back and merge Brisbane with Gold Coast. Create a strong presence across the majority of the SEQ. Brisbane SunBears sounds like a good name imo.

 

[leeloo]

No it was not a bad example. I was there when Des said to his fellow players he was staying but he later changed his mind. FWIW the Lions had his family over including
his mum, dad and his netball playing sister and still he still moved on from a team at the height of it's powers.

One player, one player who was always a risk of going. It was a bad example.

Yep, let's ignore the elite midfield talent and draft a mature-aged fringe small defender. That'll move the club forward.

It's a risk, same as Fremantle with Jeff White, shit happens, Brisbane needs to stop being martyrs, all teams go through rough patches.

So he moved to SA, played there for 5 years before any one of the 18 teams in the competition took notice, and that's the Lions letting opportunity slip?

My point wasn't that Brisbane let an opportunity slip, more that Brisbane need to start thinking outside the box. Fremantle rookied Spurr, he wasn't on any radar.

 

[SizeMatters]

AFL support in QLD is strange. Most people over the age of 35-40 know nothing of AFL and don't acknowledge it at all. The younger generation has grown up with the two codes thanks to the Lions dominance 10 years ago and do know a bit about AFL. We need to tap into this market and screw the oldies as the majority are die hard Broncos supporters.