Preview Changes vs Dees (Rd 19)

[dogwatch]

How significant that 1 point loss to Adelaide was. Win that and 12 wins for the season would be a breeze, with 13 a real chance. Even a draw would have been ok, effectively taking percentage out of the equation.

Regardless, my earlier point remains. If we can’t beat one of Melbourne, Geelong or Fremantle (preferably two of them) then we have no right to be in the finals. Or at least no right to be taken seriously in them. Even with Bevo’s finals magic.

 

[Optimistic Dog]

We’re at that point in the season where I almost hope they flog us so we can finally be put out of our misery and stop teetering on the edge of the 8 with false promises.

It’s such a gross spot to be. Not a realistic chance at a premiership but still in a position where we can’t just concede and put all our promising kids in the lineup for the last few games for invaluable experience.

I just want it one way or the other and I know that’s not how it works.

I think going on where we are at right now, I’d prefer to get flogged so we have the opportunity to get Cleary, Bedendo, Buku and maybe even Darcy in for games in place of guys like O’Brien, Hunter & Hannan who occupy those rotating 18-22 man spots.

It is not over until it is over unlikely I agree it looks like we are not up to it. However we looked long odds to make the GF last season after losing the last 3 games. Lets dream a little


Bont's form continues like last week
Tim has had 2 games back and he gets back to his form prior to concussion
Brucey and Bailey have had a game to get rid of the cobwebs and Naughts got the week off he needed
Jamarra is getting better
Caleb should be back next week
With Bruce, Naughton and Jamarra in we start to get value for a forward entries

If the above happens and all of the above is possible then we are back in the hunt for another tilt and as silly as it sounds if we finish 8th and play a Melbourne based team we are no worst off than going into the finals last season. I am starting to sound like an Optimistic Dog. LOL

 

[Foxman98]

Bruce is an excellent forward and a terrible ruck so I guess added up that makes a decent ruck/forward.

English is the best ruck/forward on our list. He's also the best ruck on our list (at least around the ground).

Sweet is a terrible forward/ruck and a decent to adequate ruck.

This situation leaves our team better placed to have Sweet as a primary ruck with English playing ruck/forward.
This unfortunately will never happen.

How so? Marra Naughton Bruce and English is better then Naughton Bruce English Sweet. Sweets ruck craft is below Jamarras forward craft Bruce's ruck craft is better then Sweets forward craft.

 

[Dale4captain]

It is not over until it is over unlikely I agree it looks like we are not up to it. However we looked long odds to make the GF last season after losing the last 3 games. Lets dream a little


Bont's form continues like last week
Tim has had 2 games back and he gets back to his form prior to concussion
Brucey and Bailey have had a game to get rid of the cobwebs and Naughts got the week off he needed
Jamarra is getting better
Caleb should be back next week
With Bruce, Naughton and Jamarra in we start to get value for a forward entries

If the above happens and all of the above is possible then we are back in the hunt for another tilt and as silly as it sounds if we finish 8th and play a Melbourne based team we are no worst off than going into the finals last season. I am starting to sound like an Optimistic Dog. LOL

Haha fair call mate. I agree and would encourage a winning culture at all times so if that’s the clubs MO then go nuts.

I’m just sick of the false hope this year.

 

[3rdgenbulldog]

Ngl with Juice, Naughton and Marra in with Tim occasionally floating forward like he usually does, along with West, Weightman and McNiel down there too, I fully expect us to kick a winning score. If we don't there is something seriously wrong.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

We’re at that point in the season where I almost hope they flog us so we can finally be put out of our misery and stop teetering on the edge of the 8 with false promises.

It’s such a gross spot to be. Not a realistic chance at a premiership but still in a position where we can’t just concede and put all our promising kids in the lineup for the last few games for invaluable experience.

I just want it one way or the other and I know that’s not how it works.

I think going on where we are at right now, I’d prefer to get flogged so we have the opportunity to get Cleary, Bedendo, Buku and maybe even Darcy in for games in place of guys like O’Brien, Hunter & Hannan who occupy those rotating 18-22 man spots.

The players don't like getting flogged though. They don't care if they fall over the line by a point but if they fall short they're the ones that are just as down as we are, more so for many of them who might lie awake going over the mistakes they made.

You're bracing yourself for the worst, I know, disappointment is our middle name. But stay positive for the team that's out there, doing their best.

(not personally having a go at you, just my thoughts in general)

 

[doggies ftw]

The problem is whilst yes we can still make finals and do some damage and our best is good enough. We’ve failed at every challenge this year. We’ve beat up on terrible teams and we all think it’s rosy here and we’re getting back to our best. But as soon as we’ve had a challenge against a half decent side we’ve failed badly.

Chances are we will fail again tomorrow unfortunately, this team/system/set up, just isn’t it right now

 

[Dale4captain]

The players don't like getting flogged though. They don't care if they fall over the line by a point but if they fall short they're the ones that are just as down as we are, more so for many of them who might lie awake going over the mistakes they made.

You're bracing yourself for the worst, I know, disappointment is our middle name. But stay positive for the team that's out there, doing their best.

(not personally having a go at you, just my thoughts in general)

Nah I agree mate. Just sick of lurking in that sub-par category this year when we have a list capable of so much more.

 

[adogsfan5]

Biggest game of the year for Tim. Has to have a big one.

 

[ScragCity]

Shalom aleichem

 

[Bulldoge]

Biggest game of the year for Tim. Has to have a big one.

Lets hope he is able to regain some of his form from earlier in the year, he's looked off the last couple of games

 

[bobs head soup]

[/QUOTE]

Lets hope he is able to regain some of his form from earlier in the year, he's looked off the last couple of games

The worry is that his form has been down since returning from his concussion, similar to last year. Hopefully, it's a temporary thing but he never really got back to his preconcussion form last year.

 

[Libbaaaa]

How significant that 1 point loss to Adelaide was. Win that and 12 wins for the season would be a breeze, with 13 a real chance. Even a draw would have been ok, effectively taking percentage out of the equation.

Regardless, my earlier point remains. If we can’t beat one of Melbourne, Geelong or Fremantle (preferably two of them) then we have no right to be in the finals. Or at least no right to be taken seriously in them. Even with Bevo’s finals magic.

Exactly my thoughts, we'll at least know after the next 3 weeks whether we have a legit chance to make some noise come finals or if we won't make it at all. Better than the fools gold finishes to 2019 and 2020.

 

[immortalmike]

How so? Marra Naughton Bruce and English is better then Naughton Bruce English Sweet. Sweets ruck craft is below Jamarras forward craft Bruce's ruck craft is better then Sweets forward craft.

I'd have Marra and Sweet both playing against Melbourne.

 

[Foxman98]

I'd have Marra and Sweet both playing against Melbourne.

So you want Sweet to have even less influence then his 6 disposal 9 hitout game last week?

 

[immortalmike]

So you want Sweet to have even less influence then his 6 disposal 9 hitout game last week?

No I want him rucking. Did you not read my earlier post.

 

[Foxman98]

No I want him rucking. Did you not read my earlier post.

I did, BTC had a snag 24 disposals against him in the 2s you really think that’s what we need against Gawn and Jackson?

 

[_Mike_]

How significant that 1 point loss to Adelaide was. Win that and 12 wins for the season would be a breeze, with 13 a real chance. Even a draw would have been ok, effectively taking percentage out of the equation.

Regardless, my earlier point remains. If we can’t beat one of Melbourne, Geelong or Fremantle (preferably two of them) then we have no right to be in the finals. Or at least no right to be taken seriously in them. Even with Bevo’s finals magic.

That and the Carlton game, which was very winnable

 

[Foxman98]

That and the Carlton game, which was very winnable

The Geelong game not giving them a 6 goal head start, Richmond/Brisbane games converting our 1st quarter dominance into scoreboard pressure and who knows where we’d be

 

[GoalSneak38]

How significant that 1 point loss to Adelaide was. Win that and 12 wins for the season would be a breeze, with 13 a real chance. Even a draw would have been ok, effectively taking percentage out of the equation.

Regardless, my earlier point remains. If we can’t beat one of Melbourne, Geelong or Fremantle (preferably two of them) then we have no right to be in the finals. Or at least no right to be taken seriously in them. Even with Bevo’s finals magic.

Carlton loss was no good either

 

[Mahama]

The problem with playing English as second ruck is that, he hasn't only been a good ruckman this season - by a lot of measures he's been the best ruckman in the league. His average AFL player rating is number 1 among rucks and number 8 overall - and I think he was 3rd overall before his poor last game. It's a shame he's been injured so much, because he was headed for a genuinely historic year for a ruckman.

You can see then why Bevo would be loathe to play him as a second ruck. He's definitely shown good glimpses as a key forward, but nowhere near what he's been showing in the ruck this year. Assuming (hoping!) English can regain some form, it makes sense to maximise the time he spends in the position he's been dominating in, and fill in the gap with someone who can positively contribute during the 80% of game time they spend not rucking.

Also, just a reminder again that Luke Jackson

9

Luke Jackson

Age

23

Ht

199cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.3

2star

K

3.3

1star

HB

5.0

4star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.0

3star

G

0.3

3star

D

8.3

2star

K

3.3

1star

HB

5.0

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.0

2star

G

0.3

3star

D

8.3

3star

K

3.3

2star

HB

5.0

4star

M

1.5

2star

T

1.0

3star

G

0.3

3star

really isn't a threat with his tap work. He won barely any hitouts in the third quarter of the Grand Final, and he's close to worst in the league for winning hitouts and hitouts to advantage this season. His damage is done with mobility and contested ability once the ball hit the ground. Personally, I'm hoping Bruce is our second ruck for this game - he should be both strong and mobile enough to nullify the advantages Jackson has against most ruckmen.

 

[Northernsoul74]

The problem with playing English as second ruck is that, he hasn't only been a good ruckman this season - by a lot of measures he's been the best ruckman in the league. His average AFL player rating is number 1 among rucks and number 8 overall - and I think he was 3rd overall before his poor last game. It's a shame he's been injured so much, because he was headed for a genuinely historic year for a ruckman.

You can see then why Bevo would be loathe to play him as a second ruck. He's definitely shown good glimpses as a key forward, but nowhere near what he's been showing in the ruck this year. Assuming (hoping!) English can regain some form, it makes sense to maximise the time he spends in the position he's been dominating in, and fill in the gap with someone who can positively contribute during the 80% of game time they spend not rucking.

Also, just a reminder again that Luke Jackson really isn't a threat with his tap work. He won barely any hitouts in the third quarter of the Grand Final, and he's close to worst in the league for winning hitouts and hitouts to advantage this season. His damage is done with mobility and contested ability once the ball hit the ground. Personally, I'm hoping Bruce is our second ruck for this game - he should be both strong and mobile enough to nullify the advantages Jackson has against most ruckmen.

Yeah I’m not convinced English is that good forward.

 

[doggies ftw]

The Geelong game not giving them a 6 goal head start, Richmond/Brisbane games converting our 1st quarter dominance into scoreboard pressure and who knows where we’d be

I get what you’re saying but this has been an issue for us for years, it’s not like it’s an easy fix.

At the end of the day the ladders probably correct in that we’re way better than the bottom half but we’re not competitive against the best - so 9th is about where we should be

 

[ScragCity]

I get what you’re saying but this has been an issue for us for years, it’s not like it’s an easy fix.

At the end of the day the ladders probably correct in that we’re way better than the bottom half but we’re not competitive against the best - so 9th is about where we should be

How could the ladder ever not be "correct"? Of course every team are exactly where they "should" be. How could it ever be otherwise?

 

[doggies ftw]

The problem with playing English as second ruck is that, he hasn't only been a good ruckman this season - by a lot of measures he's been the best ruckman in the league. His average AFL player rating is number 1 among rucks and number 8 overall - and I think he was 3rd overall before his poor last game. It's a shame he's been injured so much, because he was headed for a genuinely historic year for a ruckman.

You can see then why Bevo would be loathe to play him as a second ruck. He's definitely shown good glimpses as a key forward, but nowhere near what he's been showing in the ruck this year. Assuming (hoping!) English can regain some form, it makes sense to maximise the time he spends in the position he's been dominating in, and fill in the gap with someone who can positively contribute during the 80% of game time they spend not rucking.

Also, just a reminder again that Luke Jackson really isn't a threat with his tap work. He won barely any hitouts in the third quarter of the Grand Final, and he's close to worst in the league for winning hitouts and hitouts to advantage this season. His damage is done with mobility and contested ability once the ball hit the ground. Personally, I'm hoping Bruce is our second ruck for this game - he should be both strong and mobile enough to nullify the advantages Jackson has against most ruckmen.

It’s about net gain to the side though - if we had a good 2nd/ruck it’s a different story and we wouldn’t even be having this conversation.

Our midfield dominating is the only way we win games so we need to give them best chance of dominating for a full game, when our backup ruck options are so uncompetitive in the ruck and not even great forwards (ie Hannan, Schache Buku etc) there’s a real argument to say we’d be better with Sweet/English.

If we had a Lobb then sure its a no brainer. All the evidence over the past few years suggests we’ve struggled with our part time ruck setup, I think we’d all just like to see something different than the same old shit. 50/50 Sweet/English gets us a competive ruck for the whole game whilst allowing Timmy to be at his absolute best for his whole ruck time and not tire (which he has against genuine ruck duos like the Carlton game early)

Gives us another look forward with Timmy for 30-40% of the game which we have struggled with this year being only Naughty the mainstay. Whilst you only need to hide Sweet for 15-20% of the game absolute max.