List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade and FA

[sideswipe]

Front loading intrigues me. Say it results in Balta only getting paid $300,000 a year in 2028-2030. What happens when a rival club comes in and offers him $1.2 million for those years?

That's the risk you run with front loading - think we received the benefit of that in the Mitchell trade?

 

[sr36]

I think he already belongs to a club of one of players who won a flag in the season they were picked as an SSP? Not to mention he was dumped before Charlie Dean saved his bacon.

Rare footage of Oleg paying homage to Charlie's feet:

 

[Forethought]

Well technically if another club picks them up they also pick up their contract, so it’s a bigger saving again. We don’t have to pay them out in that circumstance. Either way we’ll make a minimum $200k savings in our cap.

Agreed, however who’s picking them up bearing in mind that they have an estimate $300k already on their head and a guarantee rookie spot for 2025. I’d say they’d need a list spot offer from another club with money similar to what they are on.

My original point was we weren’t getting the savings others were suggesting by just delisting and re rooking them

 

[Forethought]

If, for some insane reason, we don’t re-rookie them(and no one else takes them) we have to pay them the whole of their 2025 contracted amounts and those dollars would go to our 2024 TPP.


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I’m not sure on that, having to pay out 2025 contracts in 2024 TPP.
I’m not sure we would have $600-700k left in our 2024 cap

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Who though? You've got to have some keepers on decent length contracts to benefit from that.

Pay Balta his entire salary in the first year of his new contract…

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

Front loading intrigues me. Say it results in Balta only getting paid $300,000 a year in 2028-2030. What happens when a rival club comes in and offers him $1.2 million for those years?

Richmond have him under contract and refuse to deal him, and he's already been paid the agreed money so he has no leg to stand on in trying to force a trade?

I think this idea that players get to force their way to wherever they want to go, and that clubs are completely at the mercy of the players is heavily exaggerated - Mostly they are happy to do business, have agreed that it's okay for a player to explore their options, and figure a lot of the basics out ahead of time.

If Richmond had Balta under contract for three years at 300k per year, they would make it abundantly known to his manager that they are not going to consider trading him, and therefore, he shouldn't come out trying to get traded elsewhere for more money, because he'll just be embarrassing himself.

 

[Apex36]

It depends on the timeline of the changes and what his draft camp height was. For instance like Kevin Durant it’s possible he was underreporting his height early career or have you also considered that some start their career giving a without boots number and then pivot to a with boots number? The moral for me is I’ll back in GC’s consistent messaging on here that it’s rare for guys to grow after entering the system and heights are irrelevant when you have 188cm Sicily capable of monstering 211cm Cox. Being good at football is the real factor when looking at their ability to play a role.

His draft camp measurement was 199 iirc. He went to 201 the next year and 203 the year after. He definitely did grow, and he attributed his early soft tissue issues to the late growth spurt he had after being drafted.

 

[sideswipe]

I’m not sure on that, having to pay out 2025 contracts in 2024 TPP.
I’m not sure we would have $600-700k left in our 2024 cap

Well I am sure, so you can be sure. Any payments made to a player after they have been delisted go towards the salary cap in the last year they were a listed player. if you think about it, it can't be any other way.

If we are already at 100%, we go past it into that buffer zone up to 105%, which effectively reduces our 2025 cap.

 

[Apex36]

No Oleg goodbye thread?

Why would there be?

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Front loading intrigues me. Say it results in Balta only getting paid $300,000 a year in 2028-2030. What happens when a rival club comes in and offers him $1.2 million for those years?

The club doesn’t have to agree to trade him in-contract. And if they do, they can ask to be massively compensated in terms of draft picks because of the cap savings to the club acquiring him.

 

[Apex36]

Front loading intrigues me. Say it results in Balta only getting paid $300,000 a year in 2028-2030. What happens when a rival club comes in and offers him $1.2 million for those years?

If a club is offering $1.2m to a 29-31 year old, contracted Balta Richmond will be laughing all the way to the bank. He’s a middle of the road player and they’ll be able extract maximum value for him under those circumstances.

 

[Apex36]

Agreed, however who’s picking them up bearing in mind that they have an estimate $300k already on their head and a guarantee rookie spot for 2025. I’d say they’d need a list spot offer from another club with money similar to what they are on.

My original point was we weren’t getting the savings others were suggesting by just delisting and re rooking them

I don’t know what others were suggesting, but we’ll get $200k out of our cap.
If a club picks them up in the rookie draft ahead of us then they’ll have a $300k player taking up $200k of their cap space. A contract that small shouldn’t be off putting for most clubs if they feel the player can add to their list.

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

McInnes, l'm happy for the club to continue to chip away, for another year at least, and see what's there. Forward of the footy, he's going to find it hard finding a spot, particularly with Membrey coming in, and barring a spate of injuries to our settled forward 6, the club need to develop a role for him more than likely down back, or try to enhance his midfield game. Big season for Reef next year to find his place in the side, and prove himself.....

 

[sr36]

The club doesn’t have to agree to trade him in-contract. And if they do, they can ask to be massively compensated in terms of draft picks because of the cap savings to the club acquiring him.

Tigers may have stumbled on a cunning plan to keep winning thetrade and draft premierships.

 

[Apex36]

Tigers may have stumbled on a cunning plan to keep winning thetrade and draft premierships.

Hopefully they’re as successful as Essendon has become by winning trade and draft period for the last 20 years.

 

[sr36]

McInnes, l'm happy for the club to continue to chip away, for another year at least, and see what's there. Forward of the footy, he's going to find it hard finding a spot, particularly with Membrey coming in, and barring a spate of injuries to our settled forward 6, the club need to develop a role for him more than likely down back, or try to enhance his midfield game. Big season for Reef next year to find his place in the side, and prove himself.....

It's now or never for Reef - at least with us.

 

[sideswipe]

His draft camp measurement was 199 iirc. He went to 201 the next year and 203 the year after. He definitely did grow, and he attributed his early soft tissue issues to the late growth spurt he had after being drafted.

Are you trying to trigger Gone Critical ?

Careful. You don't want to awaken the Growth Plate Police.

 

[sr36]

Are you trying to trigger Gone Critical ?

Careful. You don't want to awaken the Growth Plate Police.

This year looks like a good draft for growth spurts to me.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Tigers may have stumbled on a cunning plan to keep winning thetrade and draft premierships.

Jeff Gieschen is laughing at us all from on high right now.

 

[Bianconeri]

No Oleg goodbye thread?

He’s being rookie listed

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

No Oleg goodbye thread?

He’ll stay unless another club drafts him.

I guess we could have a goodbye to the senior list thread and concurrently a welcome to the rookie list thread…

 

[Scodog10]

You're splitting hairs, I'm sure the club and both players would have agreed to it because we just don't do players dirty like that.

How exactly is the player being done dirty by going from the senior to rookie list? There’s no tangible difference for a player in 2024 unless you’re talking some hurt pride

Kirby isn’t splitting hairs because the club can do whatever they like in terms of delisting as long as they commit to re-drafting the contracted player subject to availability.

 

[Pie_high]

I may be in the absolute minority here, but I am happy to back AJ in for one more season.

He was borderline uncompetitive this year, and that arrogant incident in the VFL where he showed the ball to the opponent only to fumble the bounce and get chased down, pretty much summed up his season.

But the glimpses he showed in 2022 tell me there is some serious talent there. And he reportedly had an excellent preseason this year and got really fit.

I'm not sure why he fell off so far or if he has a future in the AFL. But, I am not writing him off just yet.

 

[No SPIN]

I may be in the absolute minority here, but I am happy to back AJ in for one more season.

He was borderline uncompetitive this year, and that arrogant incident in the VFL where he showed the ball to the opponent only to fumble the bounce and get chased down, pretty much summed up his season.

But the glimpses he showed in 2022 tell me there is some serious talent there. And he reportedly had an excellent preseason this year and got really fit.

I'm not sure why he fell off so far or if he has a future in the AFL. But, I am not writing him off just yet.

massive and vile vitriol against him on social media ultimately needing him to delete his account, had a huge impact on his confidence.

 

[barrackers]

massive and vile vitriol against him on social media ultimately needing him to delete his account, had a huge impact on his confidence.

Selecting Johnson when he was down on form/confidence in the first few rounds wasn’t smart, but that wasn’t Johnson’s fault. Hopefully the club has talked through the delisting, because there’s a risk it could also impact his confidence.