Tasmania Congratulations on Tassie License. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5

[Chief]

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GO TO PART 2 of this thread:

Tasmania - Tasmania Devils, welcome to the AFL. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Labor declares support for Stadium 6/5

Continued from Part 1: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/congratulations-on-tassie-license-mens-team-to-enter-2028-womens-team-tba-other-details-tba-3-5.1226653/ Was going to draft up a Summary but this is pretty good...

www.bigfooty.com

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[Verdun]

I don't think we'll see a public split between a Tasmanian Government & the AFL over this. Discussions will be private & serious.

As said I think North are Gawn, no matter what.

However, the AFL will have to address the bid properly. Fobbing it off, or kicking the can again by saying 10-15yrs, wont cut it.

Can hope so - but I still expect a fair bit of fobbing off from the AFL

 

[The_Reaper]

Yep we don't have team great in sight - either does Fitzroy.


You have just repeated what you said, that is fine and it apparent what your point of view is.

I like a lot of Tasmanians do not want my tax dollars going to another state that is what is occurring - if we had our own team the supporters from other teams would still travel here.

Mine is very different and the big difference now is that most Tasmanians believe the same.

Guessing is fine, just that -The Premier of Tasmania has said any future contract discussions / commitments need to include concrete steps to have a Tasmanian team.

You actually stating that you are ok with the Victorian Government potentially sponsoring Brisbane to play in Melbourne shows your bias - about your team not your state. Couldn't care less??

Ironic considering how much of the money from the "Tassie taxpayer" is actually money redistributed from the mainland.

 

[Verdun]

Ironic considering how much of the money from the "Tassie taxpayer" is actually money redistributed from the mainland.

Oh here we go - the West having a whinge about distribution of tax surprise surpise!!!!

 

[The_Reaper]

Oh here we go - the West having a whinge about distribution of tax surprise surpise!!!!

It's valid pointing out how nonsense your tears about the Tassie taxpayer are.

 

[Verdun]

It's valid pointing out how nonsense your tears about the Tassie taxpayer are.

Settle down mate, it's all a discussion.

My perspective is we either have a team or stop subsidizing a team.

My point on the taxpayer here subsidising AFL playing here stands - it occurs. We have subsidised the existence of two clubs that is fact.

Reckon if you lived here you would believe the same.

 

[Mr Taswegian]

I don't think we'll see a public split between a Tasmanian Government & the AFL over this. Discussions will be private & serious.

As said I think North are Gawn, no matter what.

However, the AFL will have to address the bid properly. Fobbing it off, or kicking the can again by saying 10-15yrs, wont cut it.

Its very unlikely North will be gone before Hawthorn,North have said several times they see a big future in Tassie and couldn't afford to lose a large amount of the 7000 Tas members they have and the millions they receive from Tas gov.The AFL also want North to become the sole team in tasmania in the future,so they wont let North leave Tasmania,a mate of my uncle knows a guy that has involvement in North Melbourne so he knows some things.

 

[Roylion]

Pleased you are a member of both, you obviously have a passion for Fitzroy - do you believe they should still be in the AFL?

As Greg Swann who worked as one on the administrator's team when settling Fitzroy's debt in 1996 stated, Fitzroy could have easily been retained in the AFL by the Commission in 1996 had there been the will to do so. The AFL had $12 million to spend on mergers in 1996 and only $1 million was required to retain them in the competition in their own right. There wasn't the will as the AFL was hell bent on a 16 team competition when Port Adelaide to come in in 1997.

However Fitzroy FC still exist in their own right, as a club are 137 years old this year, but now play in a lower level competition.The only club in Australian football history to play VFA, VFL, AFL and VAFA. However they will never be back in the AFL competition.

Do you understand that as a Tasmanian I believe that money could be better invested elsewhere for a better return?

I understood that from the start. I wasn't arguing differently.

Fitzroy Football Club (est. 1883)

You mean this club?

www.fitzroyfc.com.au

Actually quite interested in the answer, find it quite ironical.

What's ironical?

I'm not even sure what your question is.

Also believe that it may change if your state government continued to do so - while Melbourne clubs possibly decreased.

Continued to do what?

 

[madmug]

Its very unlikely North will be gone before Hawthorn,North have said several times they see a big future in Tassie and couldn't afford to lose a large amount of the 7000 Tas members they have and the millions they receive from Tas gov.The AFL also want North to become the sole team in tasmania in the future,so they wont let North leave Tasmania,a mate of my uncle knows a guy that has involvement in North Melbourne so he knows some things.

What North want doesn't matter.

All they want here is money & not to leave Melbourne. The AFL can't push them anywhere.

The AFL want only 1 team in Tasmania.

The Government want one team, our own. All deals with the AFL will have a pathway to that end.

The short to medium term politics for Hawthorn to stay in Launceston is much much stronger than North to stay in Hobart.

North are Gawn.

 

[Verdun]

As Greg Swann who worked as one on the administrator's team when settling Fitzroy's debt in 1996 stated, Fitzroy could have easily been retained in the AFL by the Commission in 1996 had there been the will to do so. The AFL had $12 million to spend on mergers in 1996 and only $1 million was required to retain them in the competition in their own right. There wasn't the will as the AFL was hell bent on a 16 team competition when Port Adelaide to come in in 1997.

However Fitzroy FC still exist in their own right, as a club are 137 years old this year, but now play in a lower level competition.The only club in Australian football history to play VFA, VFL, AFL and VAFA. However they will never be back in the AFL competition.



I understood that from the start. I wasn't arguing differently.



You mean this club?

www.fitzroyfc.com.au



What's ironical?

I'm not even sure what your question is.



Continued to do what?

I respect your love of Fitzroy - it is a heartland place.

You have answered your own questions, the irony is evident not a question. Only outstanding is continued to what? Sponsor a club from another state to play in Melbourne .

 

[Roylion]

Sponsor a club from another state to play in Melbourne .

If the Victorian government wants to sponsor a club from another state to play in Melbourne, (say the Sydney Swans) why would I have a problem with that? Extra game...extra injection of money into the Victorian economy.

 

[Verdun]

If the Victorian government wants to sponsor a club from another state to play in Melbourne, (say the Sydney Swans) why would I have a problem with that? Extra game...extra injection of money into the Victorian economy.

It is a false equivalence as there are clubs already in Melbourne. If there were no clubs in Melbourne and you were sponsoring teams to play there is a tad different.

Besides that - do you actually believe the Victorian public would be happy to sponsor the Sydney Swans to play extra games in Melbourne, seriously??

 

[Capriati]

It's valid pointing out how nonsense your tears about the Tassie taxpayer are.

Settle down mate, it's all a discussion.

My perspective is we either have a team or stop subsidizing a team.

My point on the taxpayer here subsidising AFL playing here stands - it occurs. We have subsidised the existence of two clubs that is fact.

Reckon if you lived here you would believe the same.

It's actually quite a sad situation.

AFLHQ know that Tassie is desperate for a team. So desperate that they will pay good $ for teams to play a handful of games, with the cash going in to cash strapped clubs, who are cash strapped because the Melbourne market has too many teams.

 

[Verdun]

It's actually quite a sad situation.

AFLHQ know that Tassie is desperate for a team. So desperate that they will pay good $ for teams to play a handful of games, with the cash going in to cash strapped clubs, who are cash strapped because the Melbourne market has too many teams.

Yep .......agreed

 

[Roylion]

It is a false equivalence as there are clubs already in Melbourne. If there were no clubs in Melbourne and you were sponsoring teams to play there is a tad different.

In that case why did you ask me "...how would you feel if the Victorian Government sponsored ie paid a inter state team to play in Victoria" ?

If I lived in Darwin for example and followed AFL football I'd be very happy if the NT government paid an interstate team to play in Darwin. So would most Northern Territorians given the economic benefits that Tasmania experiences with 8 AFL games per year.

Besides that - do you actually believe the Victorian public would be happy to sponsor the Sydney Swans to play extra games in Melbourne, seriously??

Why not. If it was made clear what economic benefits would ensue as a result of those extra games, of course they would.

 

[Mr Taswegian]

What North want doesn't matter.

All they want here is money & not to leave Melbourne. The AFL can't push them anywhere.

The AFL want only 1 team in Tasmania.

The Government want one team, our own. All deals with the AFL will have a pathway to that end.

The short to medium term politics for Hawthorn to stay in Launceston is much much stronger than North to stay in Hobart.

North are Gawn.

The AFL want North to be the 1 team in Tasmania,I believe North will stay over Hawthorn.

 

[Capriati]

In that case why did you ask me "...how would you feel if the Victorian Government sponsored ie paid a inter state team to play in Victoria" ?

If I lived in Darwin for example and followed AFL football I'd be very happy if the NT government paid an interstate team to play in Darwin. So would most Northern Territorians given the economic benefits that Tasmania experiences with 8 AFL games per year.
Why not. If it was made clear what economic benefits would ensue as a result of those extra games, of course they would.

This might be completely off topic, but can I ask you a question?

I've noticed that you're pretty confident in your view that clubs won't fold/merge from CV.

With everything that has happened in the last month and the clubs being their least secure since the mid 90's, how does it sit with you? Does it bring back old memories. Does the climate feel the same, and how do you feel watching reports about other clubs who may or may not be in strife, knowing what you went through as a Lions supporter?

I was only 10 in 96 so hardly remember...

 

[Verdun]

In that case why did you ask me "...how would you feel if the Victorian Government sponsored ie paid a inter state team to play in Victoria" ?

If I lived in Darwin for example and followed AFL football I'd be very happy if the NT government paid an interstate team to play in Darwin. So would most Northern Territorians given the economic benefits that Tasmania experiences with 8 AFL games per year.



Why not. If it was made clear what economic benefits would ensue as a result of those extra games, of course they would.

We are not the Northern Territory and I think you do not live there so you do not know. I get your argument re the economic benefit but it does not make sense we deserve a team here without having to pay another team to play here.


Seriously? You actually believe your fellow Victorians would be ok with sponsoring ie from the Victorian Government for the Sydney Swans to play in Melbourne?

Do you not think that your fellow Victorians miiiiiight say ......hang on that is an club for another state - if they need sponsorship maybe it should come from somewhere else ie there own supporters / businesses and own state.?

 

[Roylion]

I've noticed that you're pretty confident in your view that clubs won't fold/merge from CV.

With everything that has happened in the last month and the clubs being their least secure since the mid 90's, how does it sit with you? Does it bring back old memories. Does the climate feel the same, and how do you feel watching reports about other clubs who may or may not be in strife, knowing what you went through as a Lions supporter?

I was only 10 in 96 so hardly remember...

Feels very different.

The AFL had a policy to reduce the number of Melbourne based clubs in the 1990's with Fitzroy the prime target. Two AFL commissioners have since admitted (Graeme Samuel and Terry O'Connor) that in the early 1990's the Commission wanted the reduction of the number of Melbourne clubs and at least one Melbourne club out of the competition so that Port Adelaide could come in and leave the competition at 16 teams. Fitzroy as the smallest of the Victorian clubs was seen as expendable as was privately, and later publicly, admitted. Terry O'Connor also stated later that one of the main reason why Fitzroy's 1995 application to play home games in Canberra was knocked back by the Commission so that that pressure could be kept on Fitzroy to merge or exit the competition.

There was a public merger package on the table by the AFL that was very public including:
- $6 million incentive
- expanded list of 44 players
- $300,000 extra to the salary cap in 1997 reduced to $200,000 in 1998 and $100,000 in 1999
- Full selection of players from both lists subject to the salary cap
- Participation the draft and pre-season draft

In contrast in 2020 the AFL wants to preserve all 18 clubs in their present form, there is no merger package on the table and no AFL policy exists to reduce clubs in Melbourne.

 

[Roylion]

We are not the Northern Territory and I think you do not live there so you do not know. I get your argument re the economic benefit but it does not make sense we deserve a team here without having to pay another team to play here.

Have I ever said that Tasmania does not deserve its own team?

Seriously? You actually believe your fellow Victorians would be ok with sponsoring ie from the Victorian Government for the Sydney Swans to play in Melbourne?

Do you not think that your fellow Victorians miiiiiight say ......hang on that is an club for another state - if they need sponsorship maybe it should come from somewhere else ie there own supporters / businesses and own state.?

Not if there is an economic benefit for Victoria in extra games in Melbourne.

 

[Verdun]

Have I ever said that Tasmania does not deserve its own team?



Not if there is an economic benefit for Victoria in extra games in Melbourne.

No but you can not perceive it from Tasmania's perspective, which I can understand. We will not have our own team while we are paying for other teams to play here



'Fitzroy's application to play home games in Canberra was knocked back by the Commission so that that pressure could be kept on Fitzroy to merge or exit the competition. '

Should Canberra sponsor GWS , North and Hawthorn to play there to alleviate the pressure on those clubs.?

 

[Roylion]

No but you can not perceive it from Tasmania's perspective, which I can understand. We will not have our own team while we are paying for other teams to play here

I can perceive it very well.

Should Canberra sponsor GWS , North and Hawthorn to play there to alleviate the pressure on those clubs.?

If Canberra wants AFL games in their city and playing such games can generate an economic benefit for Canberra why not. The Giants already play four games a year at Manuka Oval (three regular season, one preseason) in a deal with the ACT Government worth $23 million from 2012-2021.

 

[The_Wookie]

Seriously? You actually believe your fellow Victorians would be ok with sponsoring ie from the Victorian Government for the Sydney Swans to play in Melbourne?

Probably. Most Victorians didnt care that the Vic Goverment was paying for St Kilda to play in Victoria this year.

 

[Verdun]

Probably. Most Victorians didnt care that the Vic Goverment was paying for St Kilda to play in Victoria this year.

Oh wookie - don't change

 

[The_Wookie]

Oh wookie - don't change

I wasnt planning to. And im not sure what it has to do with my remark

 

[Verdun]

I wasnt planning to. And im not sure what it has to do with my remark

Good work grumpy wook