List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion, 2023: Picks 1,20,34,39,53 ,58

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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Link to Lore ’s excellent draft order thread that is updated to reflect current ladder positions

Resource - 2023 AFL Draft Order

Every trade as it happens!

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[Jumpoff Joey]

Anyone hear a cheeky rumour Yeo is flirting with saints…? I mean if he can stay on the park he would fast track the Ginbey’s and Reid’s development.

If he can’t then it’s probably worth moving him on.

 

[Chris_6678]

Anyone hear a cheeky rumour Yeo is flirting with saints…? I mean if he can stay on the park he would fast track the Ginbey’s and Reid’s development.

If he can’t then it’s probably worth moving him on.

The fact the the club is sending him overseas to fix his injuries i dont think he is going anywhere.

 

[Wooshaaaa]

Surely we could get Lorenz in the rookie draft seeing how he has just been delisted by Norf.

Will Lorenz hasn't been drafted yet.

Will Lorenz Draft Profile

Oakleigh Chargers midfielder Will Lorenz made a steep ascent into prospect status last year, boasting poise and class aplenty.

central.rookieme.com

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[Eastcoasteagle]

Watching Coates league prelim and grand final - I really really like Cooper Lord, Sandy Dragons. Late pick steal...

185cm contested midfielder with good skills, particularly by foot, great spread from the contest and loves to tackle. Exact type of midfielder the swans love, and exact reason I'd like to nab him with a late pick.

Good write up from his coach below.

DRAGONS BOLTER

Harding says Cooper Lord is a name to keep a close eye on this season.

“He’s a great story - he’s been a bit of a bolter for us. He came into the program in January this year and impressed everyone straight away with his elite running power and contest work. He stands up in tackles and fights tackles like an AFL footballer.”

After recording a game-high nine tackles in round one, Lord has continued to enhance the offensive side of his game over the past two weeks, racking up 21 possessions on Good Friday.

“He’s found himself in some really good spots to get used by teammates. We’ve been delighted with his progress, he’s attracting a lot of attention now and rightly so, he deserves it. He is a great character, and his football is just getting better and better.”

The Scotch College boy is one of the best two-way runners at the club and Harding hailed the balance that Lord gives to the midfield group.

“It’s incredibly important to be a two-way runner. Lord provides a lot of balance to our midfield. He’s the one that often does a lot of the dirty work, he supports his teammates incredibly well. Every week he comes up on our trademark videos, the run-down tackles, all his hard work he does around the contest. His teammates voted him their best player in round one, which I thought was a fantastic reward. It showed his teammates acknowledge and love the contributions he brings to our footy team.”

 

[KERRPOW]

Anyone hear a cheeky rumour Yeo is flirting with saints…? I mean if he can stay on the park he would fast track the Ginbey’s and Reid’s development.

If he can’t then it’s probably worth moving him on.

Another 700k pick up like Hannebery and zak jones who will sit on the pine for most of the contract.

 

[bh90210fan]

Will Lorenz hasn't been drafted yet.

Will Lorenz Draft Profile

Oakleigh Chargers midfielder Will Lorenz made a steep ascent into prospect status last year, boasting poise and class aplenty.

central.rookieme.com

On Pixel 6 Pro using BigFooty.com mobile app

looks like I had Perez mixed up with Lorenz.

 

[daddy_4_eyes]

It's not like there is a great deal of FS prospects floating around and some people feel left out. Geelong and Western Bulldogs have benefited the most. Western Bulldogs list strategy has been compromised by NGA/ FS prospects tipping their young talent on the tall side.

The real problem is the northern academies. They're a great equalisation measure for clubs short on FS prospects like GWS and GC, but the northern academies need to be brought into line between non-expansion clubs and the rest of the AFL.

The whole points system should be abolished in favour of a system that allows a club to match with a pick of the same approximate position in the draft. This would prevent points manipulation and the generation of additional 1st round selections, it would open compromised draft pools up and assist the equalisation principle that the draft.

For example, if GC want Walter, then they should be forced to use a proximate pick (say within 3) on him and if they want access to Read or Rogers they'd be forced to trade for a pick from a different club. Gold Coast would lose access to one of these three and they wouldn't be loading up on redundant picks whos' value is always diminishing the longer the draft goes on.

Non expansion academies should simply have the same access to players from the second round onwards.

Something like this. It's totally possible with live trading on draft night(s).

Top 10.
Expansion academies & FS. Match bid with a pick within 3 positions of the original bid.

10-19.
Expansion & FS. Match bid within 5 positions of the original bid.

20-35.
All NGA & FS. Match bid within 10 positions of the original bid.

36 onwards.
All NGA and FS. Match bid with any pick in the same round.

Not sure how bidding within x-positions would work. There's have to be some accurate crystal balls for clubs to have the draft capital ready to roll out.

E.g. FS projected to go pick 15, so destination club has pick around that mark handy. Someone unexpectedly bids on him at pick 10. Now destination club has no way of obtaining him.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the current points system, it's the discounts & use of unlimited minor picks that grinds the gears.
Maybe remove discount and limit it to 2 draft pick combos only.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Watching Coates league prelim and grand final - I really really like Cooper Lord, Sandy Dragons. Late pick steal...

185cm contested midfielder with good skills, particularly by foot, great spread from the contest and loves to tackle. Exact type of midfielder the swans love, and exact reason I'd like to nab him with a late pick.

Good write up from his coach below.

DRAGONS BOLTER

Harding says Cooper Lord is a name to keep a close eye on this season.

“He’s a great story - he’s been a bit of a bolter for us. He came into the program in January this year and impressed everyone straight away with his elite running power and contest work. He stands up in tackles and fights tackles like an AFL footballer.”

After recording a game-high nine tackles in round one, Lord has continued to enhance the offensive side of his game over the past two weeks, racking up 21 possessions on Good Friday.

“He’s found himself in some really good spots to get used by teammates. We’ve been delighted with his progress, he’s attracting a lot of attention now and rightly so, he deserves it. He is a great character, and his football is just getting better and better.”

The Scotch College boy is one of the best two-way runners at the club and Harding hailed the balance that Lord gives to the midfield group.

“It’s incredibly important to be a two-way runner. Lord provides a lot of balance to our midfield. He’s the one that often does a lot of the dirty work, he supports his teammates incredibly well. Every week he comes up on our trademark videos, the run-down tackles, all his hard work he does around the contest. His teammates voted him their best player in round one, which I thought was a fantastic reward. It showed his teammates acknowledge and love the contributions he brings to our footy team.”

It feels like he would be a better option than Robertson. Yes Robertson has 3 or so years development into him but he appears to have a modest ceiling.

 

[Obeanie1]

Correct, as is the pick as you only get the 27th best player, not the 19th best

So 19's trade value for points is also devalued because the AFL is handing out assistance and compo picks to it seems everyone else.......except for the team that finished stone morherless last!

The reason why we will need priority assistance in another year is because our natural picks apart from our 1st are being pushed into the 30's by giving other clubs assistance.

AFL creating a welfare mentality. And jobs for the boys.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

The value of the first pick on the second day is grossly overrated here.

Pffft we could split it!
For a couple of inferior Round 2 picks!
2023's Foley and O'Neill!

 

[mattyc75]

The fact the the club is sending him overseas to fix his injuries i dont think he is going anywhere.

Yeah but hes actually at least partially paying for it...

On SM-G973F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Keys]

It’d be nice to have an uncompromised draft.

Priority picks screwed the drafts in the 2000’s along with a far too generous F/S system

Then just as the PP system was being phased out we had the expansion drafts of Gold Coast and GWS coupled with the introduction of free agency along with its flawed compensation system

Just as the impacts of expansion started to diminish along came the academies

It’s all a bit of a mess and even if it’s gets resolved soon there’s the Tasmanian team entering the comp on the horizon in 2028

The newly agreed CBA expires in 2027. That should be the AFL’s target to resolve all the inequities and unintended consequences that currently exist. Some solutions don’t need to wait until 2027 to be introduced

Academies

I accept that the academies are a necessary evil of growing the game in the northern states and they are part of the solution to player retention for those clubs

However, eligibility to academies needs to be tightened. Father/sons of clubs should be excluded - see Nick Blakely and Hodges’ kids. Also kids who relocate from another state that have already been introduced to Aussie rules after a certain age should also be exempt - see Walter

Then the bidding system needs to be fine tuned. The points system is ok but do away with the silly 20% discount which is irrelevant given points have no other purpose. I’d also suggest that to match a bid a club needs to forfeit at least one pick within 18 places (the equivalent of one round of picks) plus whatever else is necessary to match any points deficit

For example, for a bid on Walter at 2 Gold Coast would need to use pick 20 or lower than other picks to match points. Then if Read is bid on at say 5, they’d need pick 23 or lower as a minimum. In this instance, trading away pick 4 becomes a risk

Father/Sons

Retain the existing system but matching bids is the same as academy bids explained above

Free Agency

Do away with restricted FA and compensation. If you must have compensation then nothing in the first round and remove any attachment to ladder position - compensation to be beginning of or middle of a round with beginning of round 2 the highest possible compensation.

Players to be eligible for FA after 8 years with a limited eligibility after 6 years designed to help lower clubs and handicap top clubs as follows :

• Top 6 clubs unable to sign a FA with 6 year’s service
• Bottom 6 clubs able to sign a FA with 6 years service AND have players with 6 years on their list protected from FA
• Middle 6 clubs are able to sign players with 6 year’s service as a FA (excluding from bottom 6 teams) and can’t lose players with 6 years service to a top 6 team

This stops contending clubs poaching players entering their prime from bottom clubs and gives lower clubs the ability to chase free agents from higher clubs to fast track a rebuild

The academy and F/S changes could be made next year whilst the FA changes probably need to wait until the next CBA. The compensation for FA could be made sooner though

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

That a great attitude.

Problem is it seems every other side is getting hand outs, compo and assistance.

But the worse team in AFL history is getting SFA.

AFL House and the Vic media can't have it both ways. The current AFL rules are helping other teams who are in much better situations, have been regularly playing finals and have a good lists.

Because it's fair?

And the worst team in the comp. Gets penalised and no assistance.

It's a broken system.

On the other hand we were the last non vic team to win a GF and we still have 9 premiership players from that GF going into next season.

The whole priority pick thing is hard to judge because norf need something they are ****ing terrible both on field and financially.

Honestly they just need to fold

The other problem is unequal academy access .

Would have been nice to sell our 1st pick for multiple picks to get Erasmus at the time especially after many clubs cashed in before they changed the rules .

Would be nice to have the rights to collard this year before pick 40 .

The NGA / Northern academy bidding is my biggest gripe

 

[ArdentEagle]

Yeah but hes actually at least partially paying for it...

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I don't know why we would make him partially pay as a lot of it is due to our own mismanagement.

Reading between the lines, it's almost like the club thinks he's leaving.

 

[bzparkes]

I don't know why we would make him partially pay as a lot of it is due to our own mismanagement.

Reading between the lines, it's almost like the club thinks he's leaving.

You know Gov and HEdwards also partially paid, right?

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

For example, if GC want Walter, then they should be forced to use a proximate pick (say within 3)

The problem with this is 2 fold. (Pretend they don't have pick 4)

1 what if the first 4 teams don't want to trade out of the draft. How does GC get Walter if north west coast and hawks want to keeps there picks.

2 Moreover this would incentivise those clubs to block GC being able to get within 3 picks so as being able to select that player.


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It doesn’t need to be this complicated. Simply remove the 20% discount and reduce the points value of picks beyond 18 (end of first round) or maybe 25.

The lower points value late picks then means clubs with an academy or F/S will need higher picks to match.

This will have significant benefits in terms of increasing draft capital required to match.

Clubs will no longer trade first round picks for a 3 later picks for points which will mean picks of other clubs won’t be pushed back quite as much.

It’s a really simple lever to pull and I’m astonished the AFL haven’t done it.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Yeah but hes actually at least partially paying for it...

On SM-G973F using BigFooty.com mobile app

When De Goey went to Germany to visit Hamstring Hans he partially paid for it.

Hannebery also went OS for treatment and I believe he paid for all of it.

Athletes have personal responsibility for their own bodies, and it is not too much to ask for them to contribute to their own specialist services above and beyond ordinary rehab/injury prevention.

 

[Obeanie1]

It feels like he would be a better option than Robertson. Yes Robertson has 3 or so years development into him but he appears to have a modest ceiling.

Why not both?

We need a mature bodied mid now to help protect the kids as they develop.

Tough two way runners with pace and decent skills. We will take three thanks.

 

[mattyc75]

I don't know why we would make him partially pay as a lot of it is due to our own mismanagement.

Reading between the lines, it's almost like the club thinks he's leaving.

Didnt 3 of them go for treatment? Hedwards and gov? (Could be wrong)
An article a few weeks ago said they'd gone for treatment and were paying for some of it themselves

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[Obeanie1]

When De Goey went to Germany to visit Hamstring Hans he partially paid for it.

Hannebery also went OS for treatment and I believe he paid for all of it.

Athletes have personal responsibility for their own bodies, and it is not too much to ask for them to contribute to their own specialist services above and beyond ordinary rehab/injury prevention.

So an employee pays for a work related injury rehabilitation?

Wow.

 

[Obeanie1]

Didnt 3 of them go for treatment? Hedwards and gov? (Could be wrong)
An article a few weeks ago said they'd gone for treatment and were paying for some of it themselves

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Yep. The mini bar tab and entertainment.

Lol.

 

[ShaunDuggan]

Why not both?

We need a mature bodied mid now to help protect the kids as they develop.

Tough two way runners with pace and decent skills. We will take three thanks.

He certainly gives 110%, which during the course of this season, there was a fair share that weren't at WC.

 

[mattyc75]

When De Goey went to Germany to visit Hamstring Hans he partially paid for it.

Hannebery also went OS for treatment and I believe he paid for all of it.

Athletes have personal responsibility for their own bodies, and it is not too much to ask for them to contribute to their own specialist services above and beyond ordinary rehab/injury prevention.

If I hurt myself at work id be pissed if I had to pay anything myself. But I work for bhp so knowing them they'd try to screw me over anyway

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[Dom sheed pocket]

So an employee pays for a work related injury rehabilitation?

Wow.

If I hurt myself at work id be pissed if I had to pay anything myself. But I work for bhp so knowing them they'd try to screw me over anyway

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In this context, work related injury rehabilitation would be engaging with high performance/S&C team and engaging many people in Perth who have expertise in injury prevention/rehabilitation.

Flying half way around the globe for world renowned treatment with all the trimmings is above what would be a reasonable cost to be covered by the club alone, and if players want to explore that option they should reasonably make a contribution to their own expenses (particularly in a resource constrained competition like the AFL and the soft cap).

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Wanted to throttle Simmo every time he threw Yeo into the guts this year.