David Astbury & Ben Griff Injury's

[Stylo]

Really? Griff's shown many glimpses of what he's capable of. I can't believe people are writing him off. Demonstrate to me his injuries that are true examples of his body failing, I challenge ye gun jumpers.

Shoulders are all I can think of and they seem to be fine now.

 

[CoggaRules]

I have to agree. People seem to forget the before he did his knee in Sydney last year, Astbury had played 6 games straight at coburg. ie he couldn't get a game. Surprisingly, he is put up by the coaching staff as some sort of significant "out", which I simply can't come at. I am yet to see him really play a decent senior game yet he was given richo's number and put on the poster of the "young guns' , which is on my daughters wall

AS for Girffiths...well he always represneted a risk and you have to say we have wasted pick 18 on this guy with risky recruiting. I can't recall too many players showing absolutley nothing(othet than the odd mark here and there) for three years then suddnely becoming guns..he , unfortuantely he will become our version of gumbleton.

I wonder whether or not he has any trade currency?

get with the program dude. They annointed him with the no 12, and that has basically fallen on its arse from day one and they need to make it look like their "vision" was on the money. Its not to different than recruiting a JON at no 8 and keeping in in the 2s forever, with a couple of brief gigs in the 1s and having Wallet saying he will make his critics eat their words and then backing that up by keeping him in the 2s forever..then he fades into the western sunset..

 

[rammbo]

Astburys last game before he did his knee looked slow and lumbering imo he is a long way off being in our best side . He still hasnt had a breakout game ,griff and post r in the same boat.

 

[ize_]

Yeah I'm pretty surprised people are writing off Griff. Sure it hasn't been smooth sailing by any stretch of the imagination, but if you look at our history with getting players right, there's reason to have faith.

Take Cotch for example, he had a series of niggling and serious injuies through the first 2.5 years of his career, missing pre seasons and large chunks of games when he was clearly in our best side. He was carefully managed through that and now he's fighting fit, in fact I find it hard to remember the time when he was inury plauged.

Foley was the same, he was out for the best part of 18 months and people were writing him off, even suggesting trade scenarios. Now look at him. Add to all that the "big guys take longer" gospel and I see no real reason to start panciking yet. Obviously we're going to painstaking lengths to get Griff's body right. Dimma reiterated yesterday how important he is to our future.

Given our recent track record I have faith in the conditioning staff at the club to turn it around for him. The only issue is whether he has it within himself, physically as well as mentally. Still have very high hopes.

 

[RichosGuns]

Make no mistake Dave Astbury absolutely has all of the tools to make it.

He put on too much size last year and when from having okay pace to being slow. Hopefully he can regain some of that speed. He doesn't have to be super fast because Rance and Grimes have heaps of pace.

He is a smart footballer and who will play 150+ games for the club.

Has shown 100x more than Griffiths. He was excellent in his first season.

 

[Livonski]

If we did "cut our losses" what do you reckon we would get for Griffiths today?

 

[WATIGE]

Cotchin being compared to Griffiths? Surely you jest.

There has never been any doubts over his competitiveness or ability, unlike Griffiths. What cotchin displayed in those first two injury riddled years was far, far superior to anything Griffiths has displayed. Far superior. He also basically had the one injury not 23 different ones which Griffiths seems to have and he also has to be the slowest healer on the face of the earth. As is said earlier, he is Gumbleton and we should cut our losses now. he also represented a significant risk at pick 18 for Jackson. Unfortunately, the risk hasn't paid off.

Again the Foley comparison is folly. he had played state footy before being injured and had already shown himself to be a gun, so he was well worth perservering with.

Go on stick your wand up his nose Harry.

 

[RichoLedio]

If we did "cut our losses" what do you reckon we would get for Griffiths today?

Not much I'd imagine unfortunately

 

[Livonski]

I agree, which is why cutting now is a stupid suggestion. Better to manage him back to health and cross our fingers that he isn't a Gumbleton.
Cutting our losses sounds great when you're an MBA from Harvard talking about the manufacturing division, but it doesn't translate to a footballer with a sore leg, there aint no tax write off.

 

[TJTIGER]

Yeah I'm pretty surprised people are writing off Griff. Sure it hasn't been smooth sailing by any stretch of the imagination, but if you look at our history with getting players right, there's reason to have faith.

Take Cotch for example, he had a series of niggling and serious injuies through the first 2.5 years of his career, missing pre seasons and large chunks of games when he was clearly in our best side. He was carefully managed through that and now he's fighting fit, in fact I find it hard to remember the time when he was inury plauged.

Foley was the same, he was out for the best part of 18 months and people were writing him off, even suggesting trade scenarios. Now look at him. Add to all that the "big guys take longer" gospel and I see no real reason to start panciking yet. Obviously we're going to painstaking lengths to get Griff's body right. Dimma reiterated yesterday how important he is to our future.

Given our recent track record I have faith in the conditioning staff at the club to turn it around for him. The only issue is whether he has it within himself, physically as well as mentally. Still have very high hopes.

Totally agree Ize, good call.

 

[TJTIGER]

Cotchin being compared to Griffiths? Surely you jest.

There has never been any doubts over his competitiveness or ability, unlike Griffiths. What cotchin displayed in those first two injury riddled years was far, far superior to anything Griffiths has displayed. Far superior. He also basically had the one injury not 23 different ones which Griffiths seems to have and he also has to be the slowest healer on the face of the earth. As is said earlier, he is Gumbleton and we should cut our losses now. he also represented a significant risk at pick 18 for Jackson. Unfortunately, the risk hasn't paid off.

Again the Foley comparison is folly. he had played state footy before being injured and had already shown himself to be a gun, so he was well worth perservering with.

If rfc cut Ben at this years end I would be extremely surprised. Iv'e seen enough to suggest he's worth persevering with plus I dont think u get top 20 in the draft if you dont have something to offer. I remember a number of posters suggesting that there would be no way Foley would come back from his injuries either. But you just never know sometimes. The club needs to make sure it leaves no stone unturned not only in recruiting but in these types of cases too, although I hope we dont see too many of them. Must be really disheartening for the player too.

 

[santa claws]

IF they found some form I said. Don't think it will take that long for Astbury but agree that Kel will take a long time and may only play for Coburg in the future.

what has astbury ever done to warrant such faith ffs hes a kid whos played not much more than a handful of games and the majority of them were pretty ordinary as expected from a kid. yet hes all of a sudden going to take us to finals having been injured for how long.
how about we just let them develop and actually prove themselves over a decent period of time before we put em up there. do we ever learn? seems not.

can i ask what role you envision for moore. surely not kpd that would be throwing the baby out with the bath water. hes never had the body to play kpd and i can just see it now people wanting to throw him back in there.

long term its a choice grimes or moore. the missing piece is the 195cm plus close on 100kg kpd. can we play two third talls in the interim i suppose both are very good defensively in the air.
big ask to expect moore to play any senior footy at all this yr yet alone come back and lead us to finals.

 

[Doobie]

If rfc cut Ben at this years end I would be extremely surprised. Iv'e seen enough to suggest he's worth persevering with plus I dont think u get top 20 in the draft if you dont have something to offer. I remember a number of posters suggesting that there would be no way Foley would come back from his injuries either. But you just never know sometimes. The club needs to make sure it leaves no stone unturned not only in recruiting but in these types of cases too, although I hope we dont see too many of them. Must be really disheartening for the player too.

seen enough to suggest he is worth persevering with and where was this ?

 

[andylena]

I remember reading that Ben wouldve been easily a top 5 draft pick if not for his injury concerns. Worth preservering with I'd say

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[THE_GUN]

what has astbury ever done to warrant such faith ffs hes a kid whos played not much more than a handful of games and the majority of them were pretty ordinary as expected from a kid. yet hes all of a sudden going to take us to finals having been injured for how long.
how about we just let them develop and actually prove themselves over a decent period of time before we put em up there. do we ever learn? seems not.

can i ask what role you envision for moore. surely not kpd that would be throwing the baby out with the bath water. hes never had the body to play kpd and i can just see it now people wanting to throw him back in there.

long term its a choice grimes or moore. the missing piece is the 195cm plus close on 100kg kpd. can we play two third talls in the interim i suppose both are very good defensively in the air.
big ask to expect moore to play any senior footy at all this yr yet alone come back and lead us to finals.

You see santa , this is 1 thing that you dont get never seeing him play live being in perth.

Its the way he moves, The way he reads the play, the way he mans up and covers other player man.

Things you dont see on the tv , Astbury will make it and you will eat your words - trust me

 

[Calcium Man]

People wanting to cut Griff are kidding themselves. Would you also have cut Josh Kennedy as he struggled with injuries in his first 3-4 years at Carlton and west coast! Or what about Ben Reid?

He is a third year KPP player with tons of ability but is still growing into his body. I do worry about his competitiveness a bit but a 200 cm, 70m accurate kick on both feet and clean below his knees player do not grow on trees. He deserves 5 years minimum.

 

[Spiderland]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/135540/default.aspx

 

[Stylo]

You see santa , this is 1 thing that you dont get never seeing him play live being in perth.

Its the way he moves, The way he reads the play, the way he mans up and covers other player man.

Things you dont see on the tv , Astbury will make it and you will eat your words - trust me

This - he's our most promising young tall defender in my eyes. Good skills and athelticism for a tall, plus he's got a good footy brain. That and he really has the hunger to succeed.

As for the Kel thing Santa... Hmm maybe backline depth? Insurance as a third tall who can play KPD at a pinch? It can't be a bad thing having him recover from injury if only for that reason. Forgive me if I'm wrong but didn't he play FB for a while? If he could release Rance to CHB then I'm all for it. As I said though I do doubt whether he'll make it from how far back he's coming.

 

[Cutty]

There are plenty on our list more deserving of delistment than Griff and Astbury.

I for one am keeping the faith, particularly with Griff. Only not playing regular footy because he is being cotton-balled IMO. As others have said in regards to Foley and Cotchin, the cautious approach can pay off in the longer term.

 

[ize_]

Cotchin being compared to Griffiths? Surely you jest.

Comparing them in that they've both struggled with injury early in their careers. Not on ability or standing in the club. Don't think there's much to argue about there.

There has never been any doubts over his competitiveness or ability, unlike Griffiths.

Which is why I said "if he has it within himself, physically and mentally."

What cotchin displayed in those first two injury riddled years was far, far superior to anything Griffiths has displayed. Far superior.

Which is why I mentioned the adage about big guys taking longer. As you said, you can't compare their games at all.

He also basically had the one injury not 23 different ones which Griffiths seems to have and he also has to be the slowest healer on the face of the earth.

My memory of it is the opposite. Could be wrong, but I thought Cotch had struggled with achilles, ankles and groins at least before he got right, whereas Griffiths has pretty much been shoulders all the way. We're just taking extreme caution with him and getting him right. This knee thing is minor and only a sprain.

As is said earlier, he is Gumbleton and we should cut our losses now. he also represented a significant risk at pick 18 for Jackson. Unfortunately, the risk hasn't paid off.

Don't understand why anyone would write off a 21 tall forward with obvious ability after just over 2 seasons.

Again the Foley comparison is folly. he had played state footy before being injured and had already shown himself to be a gun, so he was well worth perservering with.

And Griff is a developing tall with all the assets who has shown enormous ability at U18 level. These things take time regardless of injury. The comparison on injuries is completely sound. Your comparison on expected output at the same age isn't.

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

Come on Astbury show us all where your at...its been a while...too long in fact......