I actually came down in the Shower before that one.
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Dennis Pagan = Most Overrated coach in history?
- Thread starter Shooter
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- Oct 25, 2001
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That reminds me of that song, I can only remember the send-up version "I'm a bloke, I'm a yobbo and my best mates name is Robbo..."
I'm a sook, I'm a dobber
and my heart is soft as butter
I'm a silly hypocrite
And I post a lot of s***
I'm a joke, I'm a ****
And I used to be cat
Til they started to look lame,
Joined the Blues and they're the same...
2 bad years out of over 20 years in coaching (reserves/under 19's etc) and people come out and say Pagan is a bad coach ...
What a load of %$&^^$^%.
Carlton have it's problems mainly due to Nazi style sanctions imposed on them in the draft by the AFL that was out of control.
Anyway I'm sure we will probably play off in a Grand Final sooner than Geelong or the Bulldogs or other clubs in the same boat.
Peter Rhode gets off scott free and he couldn't coach a horse to $hit properly.
I blame more of Parkin and Elliott for Carlton's recent problems, then so much Brittain, and now Pagan.
Mal Blight IMO was one of the greatest coaches in the last 20 years yet did FO at St.Kilda with a fairly poor list (at the time)
Whatever happens Pagan still has won 2 more flags than 13 or so other coaches in the league.
What a load of %$&^^$^%.
Carlton have it's problems mainly due to Nazi style sanctions imposed on them in the draft by the AFL that was out of control.
Anyway I'm sure we will probably play off in a Grand Final sooner than Geelong or the Bulldogs or other clubs in the same boat.
Peter Rhode gets off scott free and he couldn't coach a horse to $hit properly.
I blame more of Parkin and Elliott for Carlton's recent problems, then so much Brittain, and now Pagan.
Mal Blight IMO was one of the greatest coaches in the last 20 years yet did FO at St.Kilda with a fairly poor list (at the time)
Whatever happens Pagan still has won 2 more flags than 13 or so other coaches in the league.
Pagan has his snout well and truly ensconced in the trough like so many others in the AFL, if he was honest with himself he would not take the sort of money he is getting even if the Blues had not lost a game this year......... the fact that they are so pathetic is his responsibility and he should be ashamed to collect his paycheck......... IMO they should revert to people actually getting a pay packet from the CEO instead of gutlessly getting it via electronic banking .............. i imagine you would see some sheepish downcast faces on payday especially if it was on a monday.
NthMelbourneFC
Team Captain
if you ever go on North's Board you will see we only refer to Denis Pagan as:
Deni$
NthMelbourneFC
Team Captain
hey thats catchy, 8/10
- Banned
- #59
And Clarkson's coaching and gameplan is better because he's had early picks?Choota said:
Then why does he only have another 12 months on his contract?
No other coach in the league would have been able to coach as well with the lack of talent at Carlton.
And if the list is no better than when he started! Then Walker, Russell, Blackwell, Betts, Hartlett, Carrazzo, Waite, Deluca, Bryan, Bentick, Simpson must get the chop after having played less than 50 games.
1-No,it was the fault of the administration.And dont forget Ian "the human[?]Cholestomy bag"Collins was aware that the AFL was going to take action against the 'Baggers at the time.bogan_blue said:
2-He did SFA because he wasnt really interested in coaching at the Aints.
Not sure.markc said:
Pagan didn't just inherit a poor list, he maintained it. Obviously the draft penalties have hurt but his short-sighted recruiting of genuine hacks ought be scrutinised more closely. Will be interesting to see how he approaches this off-season. If he goes for seasoned players, look out...
I feel for Carlton fans and hope they can turn things around but the more I see of Pagan at Carlton, the less convinced I am that he's the right guy for the job. Next year will be pivotal.
- Banned
- #64
What quality kids could he have drafted instead of the hacks with low picks? Long term they wouldn't be any better term than Clarke, McGrath, Bowyer, Bannister, Chambers and Longmuir.It was more important to trade the underperformers on good money who wouldn't play for Pagan and we'd be worse with dud kids who were picked up with picks 70-80!superstar said:
He'd be a better option for the Hawks than Clarkson with his game plan and he'd still be chased by other clubs for their top job.superstar said:
- Oct 9, 2003
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Pagan has delivered a premiership to Carlton. It might have only been the Wizard Wok but it is a premiership nonetheless. Possibly the only one he will experience as coach of Carlton. But it's a premiership.Bombers 2003 said:
Dont think Do
Senior List
Just a couple of comments on Pagan while at the Roos,
1)From memeroy he wasnt handed a premiership team but a team that was flogged by the crows.
2) Yes the game plan was a lot about kicking it to Carey (Why wont you?) but it still requires other players to be about to kick it to him.
Dont know to much about most of the Carlton players, but am pretty sure they are not the same standard of, Acher, Stevens, Grant, Havey, Martin, Pike, Bell and many others.
1)From memeroy he wasnt handed a premiership team but a team that was flogged by the crows.
2) Yes the game plan was a lot about kicking it to Carey (Why wont you?) but it still requires other players to be about to kick it to him.
Dont know to much about most of the Carlton players, but am pretty sure they are not the same standard of, Acher, Stevens, Grant, Havey, Martin, Pike, Bell and many others.
cypher said:
Long term those blokes don't have a future.
Plenty of kids drafted late or in the rookie draft go on to have good careers. As far as i'm concerned you're better off taking the punt on an untried kid who could be a player than recycling someone you know won't be.
Yes, the draft penalties have hurt but I feel Carlton have wasted two years under Pagan and they're only starting the rebuilding now.
- Oct 9, 2003
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Rock, Blakey, King, Allison, Armstrong, the list goes on.Dont think Do said:
Forget about kicking the ball to him. You need to win it first !
There is a small minority of supporters who think he's rubbish. I'm one of them. I know a few other Blues' supporters up here who think the same way. He used to be good though. It's just the game's past him by.
I had always had a lot of respect for Dennis Pagan prior to Carlton's game against us this year. After what was the worst game I have ever seen, Pagan said something like "if you want us to play attacking footy, give us some early draft picks." My immediate reaction was to wonder why Dennis couldn't "teach" his current squad to play good footy.
Has he been able to develope & improve the players he has at Carlton? If so all well & good. If not then you have to ask some questions.
Has he been able to develope & improve the players he has at Carlton? If so all well & good. If not then you have to ask some questions.
Could have stayed at North and been what Essendon is to Sheedy and what Jock is to Collingwood.
Who knows, he could have won more flags at North or still might at Carlton.
When the final siren blew in 1996 (and 99 for that matter) he was and always will be a champion coach after the previous three years of near misses (and 98 GF), and having to wait since 1977.
At the moment he has not much on his list & it won't pick up until they pick up and blossom some kids. At the end of 2000, StKilda were 16th. The tide will turn and maybe he will have enough time to turn it around before he retires.
Not overrated down at Arden St.
gaso
Who knows, he could have won more flags at North or still might at Carlton.
When the final siren blew in 1996 (and 99 for that matter) he was and always will be a champion coach after the previous three years of near misses (and 98 GF), and having to wait since 1977.
At the moment he has not much on his list & it won't pick up until they pick up and blossom some kids. At the end of 2000, StKilda were 16th. The tide will turn and maybe he will have enough time to turn it around before he retires.
Not overrated down at Arden St.
gaso
A premiership compared to a day series Premiership HARDLY!.Rod Stroker said:
- Banned
- #74
Wasted years? Can you explain that a bit better?superstar said:
Has he overlooked the best kids in what really is only one draft since he's been at the club? (Walker, Russell, Hartlett, Betts, Blackwell and Raso all young enough for the 2004 draft.)
Overlook Nick Stevens for Rawlings?
Stated they were in the flag huntwith a crap list like Essendon's and Hawthorn's coaches have stated?
Fail to take potential that wasn't there with late picks? (Deluca, Norman, Raso, Betts and Bryan were all overlooked by 15 clubs)
If West Coast, Saints, Geelong, Crows, etc don't deliver a flag that will be a wasted period! And you should have thought this argument out more!
Simply put, I don't think you're any better off now than you were when he took over. With that in mind, I would consider the last two years to have been wasted. As i've said, not entirely Pagan's fault but that's just the way I read it.
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