Did selling the round 7 game to the GC cost us a top 4 spot?

[Jeremias]

Interesting topic of discussion came up on Footy Classified tonight.

The panel were discussing our round 7 game against Fremantle. The question of whether or not selling that game to the GC cost us a top 4 spot, and that looking back on it at the end of the season, whilst we'll be able to count the money from it, we'll be kicking ourselves for not playing it in Melbourne.

I think this is an interesting topic of discussion and would like to see what other Carlton fans think of this.

Did we cost ourselves a top 4 spot? Had we played in Melbourne, I've got no doubt we would have won and won fairly easily.

Personally, I think it's too easy and too much of a cop out to say that selling the game to the GC cost us a spot in the top 4. Yeah, we most probably would have won if we played it here in Melbourne, but there are so many other incidents that could have influenced our finishing position besides this one.

What about the first Essendon game? Hawthorn? The fact we didn't turn up for the first 15 minutes against St Kilda? Our terrible inaccuracy against Sydney early in the season?

IMO all would have to be more valid reasons for missing out on the 1 extra victory that would have seen us reach the top 4.

I've got no issues with the club selling a game interstate and hope we continue to do so in future seasons. Yeah, we lost the game but we should not be of the view that because we could lose the game, we should not sell interstate. We just didn't turn up on the night and that's all I think there is to it.

The financial benefits of playing a home game interstate should be too great to deter us from selling interstate because we may lose the match.

What are your thoughts? Did selling the game to the GC cost us a top 4 position? And are you in favour of us selling a home game interstate in future seasons?

 

[BLue_Bloys]

Nup, I was there and we would have lost in Melb also.

Freo may have played worse in Melb but we were pretty terrible. Fev was basically a liability (whether he was injured or not) Cloke was actually presenting fairly well and our mids kept ignoring his leads (often in space on his own, opting for Fev instead) and our skills were pretty shocking.

Should have beaten Essendon, Hawthorn, Saints.....didn't work out that way, shit happens.

 

[Big Bad Sammus]

Yes it is a very interesting topic. I don't think this game had much relevence to us finishing top 4...we had a few games where we lost by a kick or 2. These are the games we should have won also. However, we net $400k and had to travel less than Freo. So we had more of a chance to win, we just didn't show up that night, there were glimpses, but just not enough to win it.

I believe we would have won too, had we played at the dome. But I'm happy with top 8 and that was what we wanted to achieve this year, anything else was a bonus.

End of the day - who gives a rats! We're playing finals

 

[iRemember87]

We played crap that game, wouldn't have mattered where we played.

Games like the Essendon/Sydney/Hawk games where we kicked ourselves out of a win in the first half cost us a top 4 spot.

 

[nosaints4flag09]

I think it is a pretty safe assumption to say that we will not be selling a game to the GC or anywhere else for that matter next year. Definately cost us a shot at top 4, everybody knows that Freo would stand no chance at all of beating us in Melbourne.

 

[as0l0]

it could just as easily be that selling the game and losing is what caused us to have the run that's put us in 5th rather than battling it out for 8th.

 

[Chodders]

Any one of the following games cost us a top four spot:

Ess Round 3
Syd Round 4
Haw Round 6
Freo Round 7

That said we still have a lot of young players learning the game. Expect us to win tight games like these above over the coming years.

 

[AlecDuncan]

Should have beaten Essendon, Hawthorn, Saints.....didn't work out that way, shit happens.

Agreed. This is what cost us fourth and even third:

Rnd 3: Fev kicking 4:7
Rnd 4: Kicking 3:12 to half time
Rnd 6: Fev missing a soda
Rnd 7: kicking 11:15
Rnd 9: Ratten having a ridiculous set-up
Rnd 12: kicking 5:9 against 7:3 in the second half, including 3:5 in the last quarter
Rnd 13: big heads after an "honorable loss"
Rnd 17: Ratten leaving his brain at home, and Maxwell unattended

 

[MBIB]

Can't say we would have won had it been played in Melbourne but I'm not a fan of giving away any home ground advantage in the future.

 

[mediumsizered]

I think most of us would agree that the loss against Freo at Carrara was more about attitude/commitment than about the venue. From memory, we only had 4-5 players who could have walked off the field that night knowing they had given everything they could.

We were very badly let down by our most experienced/talented players in that game.

 

[blue gunslinger]

agree MSR - if we had played half decent in Bagdad we should have beaten Freo

 

[bigphella]

clearly the fevola miss cost us

 

[blues4flag]

Who's to say how the season would have panned out had we one?

I do hope that the club doesn't play a game interstate next season, though.

 

[AlecDuncan]

agree MSR - if we had played half decent in Bagdad we should have beaten Freo

After all, if we can beat them at Subiaco, we should have beaten them anywhere.

 

[BlueTouchPaper]

You know what's interesting, Hutchy is the biggest moron on TV. Caro said that she would reassess at RD22, and that she did, and he still went on to show the footage.

Anyhow, Freo have had the wood on us for a while now, what, last 3 results decided by less than 2 goals, cost us a game maybe, but you could pinpoint another 7 or 8 instances where we could've picked up points...

Fevola's poster... Houlihan's shot against the Saints... Thornton going apeshit against Essendon...

 

[HBF]

Any one of the following games cost us a top four spot:

Ess Round 3
Syd Round 4
Haw Round 6
Freo Round 7

That said we still have a lot of young players learning the game. Expect us to win tight games like these above over the coming years.

I agree with this. Anyone of those 4 games were winnable, particularly the Essendon and Hawthorn games. IIRC, we discussed this at the time, and wondered if it would come back and bite us on the backside. Looks like it has. Still, our goal was to play finals this year, and we are going to achieve this. Who knows how far we can progress in September.

Depending on what happens in September, we may very well look at a top 4 finish in 2010 as a goal for the club.

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Who's to say how the season would have panned out had we one?

Agreed - while things might not change dramatically, a win creates a different mindset, different media articles, different expectations, and thus different approaches to games.

i.e. Had we been on an extra win, perhaps more pressure is placed on the Dogs to keep their top 4 spot and thus they beat the Eagles. A win against the Cats basically assured us a finals spot - had we already been assured that a week before, perhaps we don't play that game with as much intensity etc.

I hate seeing supporters bring up the Bombers, Freo, Sydney games etc as games we should have won, but be so dismissive of our wins. I could equally say we should have dropped that second game against the Lions, or we shouldn't have beaten the Dogs or Cats because we weren't favourites.

If the Bulldogs win this week, we finish as much as 2 games + a huge percentage outside the top 4, so its a non issue.

 

[Chodders]

It is interesting looking back on our 2001 season and comparing with 2009. We finished with 14 wins and a game outside 4th. I remember some pretty winnable games that year that we dropped. Example, Adelaide in the rain at OO.

 

[Gouldy]

Fev missing from almost directly in front cost us a top 4 spot...

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Any one of the following games cost us a top four spot:

Ess Round 3
Syd Round 4
Haw Round 6
Freo Round 7

That said we still have a lot of young players learning the game. Expect us to win tight games like these above over the coming years.

As I was saying, lets compare:

Ess Round 3 - North Melbourne Round 18 (The losers kicked inaccurately when it mattered, costing them any chance)

Syd Round 4 - Western Bulldogs Round 5 (The losers were the favourites, yet the winners had a favourible record and seemingly match up well)

Haw Round 6 - Brisbane Lions Round 11 (The team with the most momentum in the final quarters got within a kick, but couldnt finish the job)

Freo Round 7 - Geelong Round 19 (The favourite teams played poorly, and the winners played good without being great)


As I said, you can't use reasons to say why we should have won certain games if you are dismissive of those same reasons with our wins.

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Fev missing from almost directly in front cost us a top 4 spot...

If we lose this week (50/50), or if the Dogs win (50/50), an extra win wouldn't be enough for a top 4 spot.

While it would have guaranteed a home final already, we can do that this week if we are good enough.

 

[GibbsOnTheRun]

Although it pains me to say this, but we should also give Freo some credit, because their kicking skills and pressure were quite good for at least 3/4 of the Gabba match, and our pressure was defintely down, so as others above have said, I'm not sure it would have been a guaranteed win even in Melbourne.

 

[Woostieboy]

It wouldn't have made any difference where we played that game, Freo out played us and even though we didn't kick straight we didn't deserve to win it. Freo also had to travel further than we did so that shouldn't have been an issue.

 

[Bluebear]

What about the first Essendon game? Hawthorn? The fact we didn't turn up for the first 15 minutes against St Kilda? Our terrible inaccuracy against Sydney early in the season?

IMO all would have to be more valid reasons for missing out on the 1 extra victory that would have seen us reach the top 4.

Pretty much sums it up for me.

I've got no issues with the club selling a game interstate and hope we continue to do so in future seasons.

I have no issue with it either, but I think the club has already said we won't be doing it next year.

Maybe the club thinks it did cost us a top 4 spot.

Not sure money wise what that equates to compared to finishing 5-7th if at all.

 

[BeligerentBlue]

We would have had a better chance winning on our home ground be it Etihad or the G than in the holiday atmosphere of Qld where we clearly were not switched on. The selling of our home game angered me then and it angers me now. The club wants membership numbers then sells a game from under its members. It was another game my kids didn't get to go to. The club have to choose if they are in the money making business or the premiership winning business. If we won we could have jagged 4th and I would love to have played a nervous Saints in the first week of the finals. Then anything could have happened. This should never happen again.