D1 Division 1 2018

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bushbattler said:
G’day just wondering if any of these clubs could become successful A or B grade clubs , and what would it take to get there
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It's not impossible but would probably take a club 10 years to climb from D1 to become a successful and strong A or B grade club. Clubs with an Old Boys affiliate could potentially benefit greatly from a few years of strong teams coming through the school and continuing onto the VAFA team, but they would also need to find a way of sustaining that and being able to bring in outside talent.

As Bedford said it's much tougher for district/suburban clubs given our resources just aren't comparable to the strong A, B and even C Grade Old Boys clubs. We rely heavily on a strong culture among players and a good coach being the major factor in recruiting and retaining players, as well as having a good relationship with the junior club to bring kids through. (Even for us that's tough considering a lot of local Kew kids go to Trinity, Xavier, Marcellin etc. and I'm sure it's the same at other clubs)

In saying all of that, clubs have climbed from the Divisions to become strong A and B grade clubs before so I can't see why it couldn't happen again.
 
workhorse said:
It's not impossible but would probably take a club 10 years to climb from D1 to become a successful and strong A or B grade club. Clubs with an Old Boys affiliate could potentially benefit greatly from a few years of strong teams coming through the school and continuing onto the VAFA team, but they would also need to find a way of sustaining that and being able to bring in outside talent.

As Bedford said it's much tougher for district/suburban clubs given our resources just aren't comparable to the strong A, B and even C Grade Old Boys clubs. We rely heavily on a strong culture among players and a good coach being the major factor in recruiting and retaining players, as well as having a good relationship with the junior club to bring kids through. (Even for us that's tough considering a lot of local Kew kids go to Trinity, Xavier, Marcellin etc. and I'm sure it's the same at other clubs)

In saying all of that, clubs have climbed from the Divisions to become strong A and B grade clubs before so I can't see why it couldn't happen again.
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The big schools will continue to dominate
 
Gee I’ve just checked the A,B&C comps and I reckon of course a club from this section can make it these three sections have a healthy spread of big & small schools and district clubs , for instance de la still wacking away in A along with st bedes Maybe clubs have got to set standards a bit higher and work harder to engage their local communities to get behind them don’t sit back saying yes no maybe


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bushbattler said:
Gee I’ve just checked the A,B&C comps and I reckon of course a club from this section can make it these three sections have a healthy spread of big & small schools and district clubs , for instance de la still wacking away in A along with st bedes Maybe clubs have got to set standards a bit higher and work harder to engage their local communities to get behind them don’t sit back saying yes no maybe


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'Healthy spread'

Premier:
9 School sides from AGSV, APS & ACC
1 University side (Melbourne University)

Premier B:
5 Schools (APS & ACC)
2 Universities (Monash and Melbourne)
2 District (One merged, the other just hired Guy McKenna)
1 Religious/Cultural community (AJAX - Mark Williams is their coach and major sponsors include Pratt Foundation and South Yarra BMW...)

Premier C:
7 Schools - APS, AGSV
2 District (One merged)
1 Community/District (Williamstown)

Let's face it. There is a class divide that puts most clubs below the line giving up a fair old handicap.

More can be done, sure. But when looking at clubs playing in Kew - you've got a half dozen private schools offering an easy choice for most lads - one that they are pressured into it from the moment they leave their school (letters to all footballers, peer pressure etc).
 
lettheboysplay said:
'Healthy spread'

Premier:
9 School sides from AGSV, APS & ACC
1 University side (Melbourne University)

Premier B:
5 Schools (APS & ACC)
2 Universities (Monash and Melbourne)
2 District (One merged, the other just hired Guy McKenna)
1 Religious/Cultural community (AJAX - Mark Williams is their coach and major sponsors include Pratt Foundation and South Yarra BMW...)

Premier C:
7 Schools - APS, AGSV
2 District (One merged)
1 Community/District (Williamstown)

Let's face it. There is a class divide that puts most clubs below the line giving up a fair old handicap.

More can be done, sure. But when looking at clubs playing in Kew - you've got a half dozen private schools offering an easy choice for most lads - one that they are pressured into it from the moment they leave their school (letters to all footballers, peer pressure etc).
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The cheek of them - sending letters to their old boys trying to recruit them!

Check the fees of the ACC schools- hardly rich and powerful people there .

This is a tired old argument and other than a “ woe is me “ sentiment , who cares ? Beauy have shown you can get to A and oakleigh to B, so it can be done
 
Captain chaos said:
The cheek of them - sending letters to their old boys trying to recruit them!

Check the fees of the ACC schools- hardly rich and powerful people there .

This is a tired old argument and other than a “ woe is me “ sentiment , who cares ? Beauy have shown you can get to A and oakleigh to B, so it can be done
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Typical from you. It's getting harder for all to compete against the SKOBSAFL etc.
 

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Captain chaos said:
The cheek of them - sending letters to their old boys trying to recruit them!

Check the fees of the ACC schools- hardly rich and powerful people there .

This is a tired old argument and other than a “ woe is me “ sentiment , who cares ? Beauy have shown you can get to A and oakleigh to B, so it can be done
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It's becoming very tough for local clubs, I don't know if someone else has mentioned it , but what about restricting school teams to 2 19's.


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Gun Island said:
It's becoming very tough for local clubs, I don't know if someone else has mentioned it , but what about restricting school teams to 2 19's.


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Why? To help districts clubs? What happens of the leftover kids go to another school based club? Players in the third under 19 side are hardly going to win a club a D1/D2 flag. Stopping clubs from becoming too powerful..interesting concept
 
Gun Island said:
It's becoming very tough for local clubs, I don't know if someone else has mentioned it , but what about restricting school teams to 2 19's.


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Interesting concept and despite my club being one of those who fielded 3 x U19s last year I actually see some merit in what you say. However it is not as simple as just capping the number of teams. I think you will find that most clubs don’t go out with the intention of fielding 3 x U19 teams and trying to manage that amount of kids is often more trouble than its worth. Usually a club will nominate two teams and then throw another side in when it becomes apparent that kids will miss out. Experience shows that most just want to play with their mates and if you put the shutters up they give it away rather than look for another club.

For balance it needs to be acknowledged that plenty of District clubs field or have recently fielded multiple 19s in recent years including Beaumaris, Fitzroy, Parkdale, SMS to name a few. Kids who have played unders at A grade clubs move to lower grades to play senior footy when it becomes apparent that Premier seniors is a bit beyond them. I know of plenty of unders from my club are now at Glen Eira, Ormond, Oakleigh, SMS and other VAFA clubs. Long may that continue as personally I would rather see them playing seniors in C or D grade then Premier Thirds. As much as I hate to say it I actually agree with CC on this one. Footy is not a priority for many of the lads who play in the lower grades of 19s comp and the % who graduate to senior is fairly low.

And a word of caution to those grouping all old boys’ teams in the same bucket. ACC schools are a very different beast to the ‘elite’ APS and AGSV types. De La, St Bedes, St Bernard’s don’t have the same networks and have to work extremely hard to recruit and compete at this level. For the best part they manage to do it quite well but there are not too many silver spoons at those schools. There were 2 very big APS school old boys’ teams occupying places in C grade last year so just because you are an elite school does not necessarily mean you are an elite football club.
 
Jimmyjack said:
Interesting concept and despite my club being one of those who fielded 3 x U19s last year I actually see some merit in what you say. However it is not as simple as just capping the number of teams. I think you will find that most clubs don’t go out with the intention of fielding 3 x U19 teams and trying to manage that amount of kids is often more trouble than its worth. Usually a club will nominate two teams and then throw another side in when it becomes apparent that kids will miss out. Experience shows that most just want to play with their mates and if you put the shutters up they give it away rather than look for another club.

For balance it needs to be acknowledged that plenty of District clubs field or have recently fielded multiple 19s in recent years including Beaumaris, Fitzroy, Parkdale, SMS to name a few. Kids who have played unders at A grade clubs move to lower grades to play senior footy when it becomes apparent that Premier seniors is a bit beyond them. I know of plenty of unders from my club are now at Glen Eira, Ormond, Oakleigh, SMS and other VAFA clubs. Long may that continue as personally I would rather see them playing seniors in C or D grade then Premier Thirds. As much as I hate to say it I actually agree with CC on this one. Footy is not a priority for many of the lads who play in the lower grades of 19s comp and the % who graduate to senior is fairly low.

And a word of caution to those grouping all old boys’ teams in the same bucket. ACC schools are a very different beast to the ‘elite’ APS and AGSV types. De La, St Bedes, St Bernard’s don’t have the same networks and have to work extremely hard to recruit and compete at this level. For the best part they manage to do it quite well but there are not too many silver spoons at those schools. There were 2 very big APS school old boys’ teams occupying places in C grade last year so just because you are an elite school does not necessarily mean you are an elite football club.
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Omg!! Jj agreeing with me! I also pointed out the difference between aps and acc schools . You are right- st bedded and scotch couldn’t be further apart in every way, so the original post was a touch misleading . Carey were in E grade for ages so there are no guarantees .

Now if you could just explain Gilhams and salopeks points , we can move on!
 
Captain chaos said:
Omg!! Jj agreeing with me! I also pointed out the difference between aps and acc schools . You are right- st bedded and scotch couldn’t be further apart in every way, so the original post was a touch misleading . Carey were in E grade for ages so there are no guarantees .

Now if you could just explain Gilhams and salopeks points , we can move on!
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I already have and even quoted the relevant clause straight from the policy. Unfortunately the PPA does not ‘auto correct’ each season and manual entry, probably by a different club administrator each year, opens up human error as the most likely explanation. As no VAFA club is ever likely to threaten the points cap there is no appetite at HQ to even bother trying to police it. That's as good an explanation as I can give.

It is futile going over all that again and other posters have made it clear they are sick to death of that topic. So let’s just enjoy the moment where we are in furious agreement on something and move on.
 
Jimmyjack said:
I already have and even quoted the relevant clause straight from the policy. Unfortunately the PPA does not ‘auto correct’ each season and manual entry, probably by a different club administrator each year, opens up human error as the most likely explanation. As no VAFA club is ever likely to threaten the points cap there is no appetite at HQ to even bother trying to police it. That's as good an explanation as I can give.

It is futile going over all that again and other posters have made it clear they are sick to death of that topic. So let’s just enjoy the moment where we are in furious agreement on something and move on.
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Oh.. it’s officially human error !

Sorry ... I know for fact that isn’t the case and it is the actual points allocation .

I agree let’s just leave it with the fact you can’t explain it.

Play on!
 
Captain chaos said:
Oh.. it’s officially human error !

Sorry ... I know for fact that isn’t the case and it is the actual points allocation .

I agree let’s just leave it with the fact you can’t explain it.

Play on!
Click to expand...

Glad you agree. See that wasn’t so hard. We can all now move on.
 
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