Division 2 thread 2022

[eflreceiver]

Weeks along time in football. I spent ages trying to spell Inconsequential.... before I realised it's not that important.

 

[eflreceiver]

I feel there will be many one-sided games unless there is a downpour for 4 Qtrs. Sth Belgrave, East Burwood, Boronia, Ringwood, the close game will be the Basin and Knox, I will go the Basin by 8 points.

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

St Belgrave went down to Mulgrave. Ringwood won but Rams won by 174 points and will now sit on top of the ladder, with Ringwood second.
Next week is a big round, Sth Belgrave v East Burwood (3v1) and Boronia v Ringwood (4v2).

 

[eflreceiver]

Well, I couldn't be more wrong. Big weekend next week, Well done Mulgrave.

 

[Voice of the G]

I feel there will be many one-sided games unless there is a downpour for 4 Qtrs. Sth Belgrave, East Burwood, Boronia, Ringwood, the close game will be the Basin and Knox, I will go the Basin by 8 points.

How much support for Oakleigh Districts today,sad to see a side struggling.Been there and done that.

 

[eflreceiver]

How much support for Oakleigh Districts today,sad to see a side struggling.Been there and done that.

Agree, we have been there as well. They had a few supporters there. I can say the teams can hold their heads high, they fought the game out until the siren sounded. Many came into the rooms after the game and enjoyed the free food on offer and match reports. It was noisy in the rooms as we had a lady's day function which should be still going.

Jason McCartney (AFL) said this after the Bali Bombings where he was severely burnt and fought his way back to play AFL football again. "It's not what you are dealt with in life, it's how you deal with it". They know they are up against it but give everything they have.

An Oakleigh reserves player and a East Burwood Senior player both taken to Hospital by Ambulance with a major concussion. I hope they are both OK and wish them a speedy recovery.

 

[localfootyguru]

Oakleigh Districts will be lucky to field one team by half way during the year from what I have been informed. Are struggling with numbers already and with no success numbers are dwindling rapidly. Surely the powers at EFNL knew this team was going to be way out of their depth in the division. Could see the demise of a club the way things are going. Should realistically never have been allowed to enter the league but the EFNL focus and ego of being the biggest and best got in the way. Many people from the club have walked away due to the move into the new league and their lack of having anything in common with the clubs they are now playing.

On another note, umpiring is in crisis big time with some umpires doing 3-4 games per weekend. Many of the older guys now walking away due to the demands to fill games. Once again the league and their clubs don’t want club appointed umpires. Even the umpires coach is umpiring senior footy which is impacting greatly on coaching and development. But wait, the EFNL is still the biggest league….

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

Oakleigh Districts will be lucky to field one team by half way during the year from what I have been informed. Are struggling with numbers already and with no success numbers are dwindling rapidly. Surely the powers at EFNL knew this team was going to be way out of their depth in the division. Could see the demise of a club the way things are going. Should realistically never have been allowed to enter the league but the EFNL focus and ego of being the biggest and best got in the way. Many people from the club have walked away due to the move into the new league and their lack of having anything in common with the clubs they are now playing.

On another note, umpiring is in crisis big time with guys doing 3-4 games per weekend. Many of the older guys now walking away due to the demands to fill games. Once again the league and their clubs don’t want club appointed umpires. Even the umpires coach is umpiring senior footy which is impacting greatly on coaching and development. But wait, the EFNL is still the biggest league….

The white haired gent who umpired the 2's stayed on and then umpired the 1's.

 

[eflreceiver]

Oakleigh Districts will be lucky to field one team by half way during the year from what I have been informed. Are struggling with numbers already and with no success numbers are dwindling rapidly. Surely the powers at EFNL knew this team was going to be way out of their depth in the division. Could see the demise of a club the way things are going. Should realistically never have been allowed to enter the league but the EFNL focus and ego of being the biggest and best got in the way. Many people from the club have walked away due to the move into the new league and their lack of having anything in common with the clubs they are now playing.

On another note, umpiring is in crisis big time with guys doing 3-4 games per weekend. Many of the older guys now walking away due to the demands to fill games. Once again the league and their clubs don’t want club appointed umpires. Even the umpires coach is umpiring senior footy which is impacting greatly on coaching and development. But wait, the EFNL is still the biggest league….

Some are suggesting they should go down a Division after everyone has played them and then have a bye round in Div 2. To me, that would be the EFNL admitting that they failed and they never do that. Umpiring is a major concern and people simply need to stop abusing them. The umpires need to be in the rooms after the game as well. The Umpires and Clubs need each other, it used to be a thing, free feed after the game and have a chat. Clubs need to make them welcome and supporters need to be welcoming. My theory is if you get to know the umpires you are less likely to abuse them.

 

[Voice of the G]

Some are suggesting they should go down a Division after everyone has played them and then have a bye round in Div 2. To me, that would be the EFNL admitting that they failed and they never do that. Umpiring is a major concern and people simply need to stop abusing them. The umpires need to be in the rooms after the game as well. The Umpires and Clubs need each other, it used to be a thing, free feed after the game and have a chat. Clubs need to make them welcome and supporters need to be welcoming. My theory is if you get to know the umpires you are less likely to abuse them.

What is more important the survival of the Oakleigh Districts football club or the EFNL admitting they were wrong.For me it is their survival and still time to drop them down a grade if not 2 of cause if they accept the offer.

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

What is more important the survival of the Oakleigh Districts football club or the EFNL admitting they were wrong.For me it is their survival and still time to drop them down a grade if not 2 of cause if they accept the offer.

Has never happened before and won't happen this year!

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Good to see South Belgrave get rolled. Nothing personal about them but the talk of them going undefeated, that’s never a recipe for an enjoyable comp for anybody.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I think a few people are going a bit funny regarding Oakleigh District, certainly look to be having a tough year but they’re far from the first and certainly won’t be the last. You don’t shift clubs midway through the season, they’ll play it out and then drop to D3. I could even see a drop to D4 if requested but not midway thru the season, that’s just silly. D3 and D4 comps are humming along, you can’t put a new club in there mid season ffs.

The questions remain the same as ever and haven’t been answered since it was first proposed, why did they move leagues, nobody from the club, the EFNL or indeed AFL Vic who waved it thru have ever answered, it was just like “they wanted to”.

On umpiring I agree with others. The standard is the poorest this year that I’ve seen which is of course to be expected, they’ve lost huge numbers and many are umpiring more than one game so are fatigued. The abuse thing is a vicious cycle, umpires leave because of it, the standard gets worse so more abuse occurs.

To start to turn the tide I continue to say one factor is simple to tick off, it is staggering to me it hasn’t been addressed, the pay is appalling and I’m shocked they even have the low numbers they do.

People don’t seem to grasp you have umpires training once or twice a week, doing four hours for a match on a weekend (plus travel) in terrible conditions with abuse raining on them… for little more than $100, it is farcical.

Pay needs to immediately increase to a minimum of $250 per game for a senior field umpire, tax free (it is a community service at local level). Clubs will cop it, they don’t have a choice, and nor should they when they’re spending up to $5k per week on players - if you won’t spring $250 for an umpire to actually allow the game to happen then you’ve got no business playing.

It will at least START to get people perhaps considering it.

 

[eflreceiver]

I think a few people are going a bit funny regarding Oakleigh District, certainly look to be having a tough year but they’re far from the first and certainly won’t be the last. You don’t shift clubs midway through the season, they’ll play it out and then drop to D3. I could even see a drop to D4 if requested but not midway thru the season, that’s just silly. D3 and D4 comps are humming along, you can’t put a new club in there mid season ffs.

The questions remain the same as ever and haven’t been answered since it was first proposed, why did they move leagues, nobody from the club, the EFNL or indeed AFL Vic who waved it thru have ever answered, it was just like “they wanted to”.

On umpiring I agree with others. The standard is the poorest this year that I’ve seen which is of course to be expected, they’ve lost huge numbers and many are umpiring more than one game so are fatigued. The abuse thing is a vicious cycle, umpires leave because of it, the standard gets worse so more abuse occurs.

To start to turn the tide I continue to say one factor is simple to tick off, it is staggering to me it hasn’t been addressed, the pay is appalling and I’m shocked they even have the low numbers they do.

People don’t seem to grasp you have umpires training once or twice a week, doing four hours for a match on a weekend (plus travel) in terrible conditions with abuse raining on them… for little more than $100, it is farcical.

Pay needs to immediately increase to a minimum of $250 per game for a senior field umpire, tax free (it is a community service at local level). Clubs will cop it, they don’t have a choice, and nor should they when they’re spending up to $5k per week on players - if you won’t spring $250 for an umpire to actually allow the game to happen then you’ve got no business playing.

It will at least START to get people perhaps considering it.

Great Post Bunk and on the money as always. Paying a worker more money is not what we do and that is not just umpiring. At $100 a game which is basically 4 hours @ $25 an hour, you could earn the same money elsewhere without all the BS. At the moment in many other industries that are struggling to get workers, they have to put up more dollars to attract and keep quality staff. If I have to attend training I am paid to do it, so to me, it makes sense to include training in an umpire's remuneration. Most of the money should be injected from the AFL coffers, after all the game is built from grassroots football. The AFL and Clubs give stuff all back to local football. It would be pocket change for them.

As for Oakleigh, they asked to come in as what's been said to me is they felt that the Southern League gave them little support. I think the posts are more about no one likes seeing teams get flogged week after week as many of us have been there and know the vicious cycle.

 

[localfootyguru]

Great Post Bunk and on the money as always. Paying a worker more money is not what we do and that is not just umpiring. At $100 a game which is basically 4 hours @ $25 an hour, you could earn the same money elsewhere without all the BS. At the moment in many other industries that are struggling to get workers, they have to put up more dollars to attract and keep quality staff. If I have to attend training I am paid to do it, so to me, it makes sense to include training in an umpire's remuneration. Most of the money should be injected from the AFL coffers, after all the game is built from grassroots football. The AFL and Clubs give stuff all back to local football. It would be pocket change for them.

As for Oakleigh, they asked to come in as what's been said to me is they felt that the Southern League gave them little support. I think the posts are more about no one likes seeing teams get flogged week after week as many of us have been there and know the vicious cycle.

I couldn’t agree more about the pay but money isn’t the only thing that is needed to attract people to umpiring. Remember that throwing more money at an issue isn’t going to solve the issue. The problem is the abuse and rubbish umpires and their parents in many instances have to deal with on game day. As someone that has been involved in footy at various levels and many locations, the problem is the same everywhere - the abuse and the lack of support from governing bodies about umpiring. Umpiring is just seen as a service and nothing more and they are cannon fodder when things are going wrong for a club - don’t look at your own activities but just play the blame game and abuse umpires for all their faults and frailties. Some of the behaviour I have seen over many years has been appalling and when some action is sought, there is no support from the governing body or tribunal to apply an appropriate penalty.

A number of years ago I was involved with a major club in the country and we had an opposition supporter push and abuse an umpire at a break in a final. The outcome, a slap on the wrist based on the fact the supporter had no previous problems with behaviour. Umpires were furious and threatened a walk out, the governing body then said walk out and we will find umpires from elsewhere. This still occurs.

Very hard to wind back a problem that has escalated out of control for years and has been seen as supported behaviour when people go to the footy.

The other issue is that of resourcing within umpiring. Having a senior coach having to umpire due to having no umpires is a problem as it hinders development and coaching. A senior football club has 50 - 60 players and may have 6 plus coaches involved. An umpiring group may have 300 members and a coaching staff of 3 to 6 involved. Umpires walk away due to the lack of perceived interest in them and feeling undervalued despite their commitment to umpiring and being involved. Environment is everything.

Lots of issues to address but the solutions are going to take time to resolve (if they can be).

 

[eflreceiver]

Good to see South Belgrave get rolled. Nothing personal about them but the talk of them going undefeated, that’s never a recipe for an enjoyable comp for anybody.

Next week is a cracker in Div 2. I expect Sth Belgrave to bounce back at home against the Rams. If Boronia knocks off Ringwood it's good for football.

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

To start to turn the tide I continue to say one factor is simple to tick off, it is staggering to me it hasn’t been addressed, the pay is appalling and I’m shocked they even have the low numbers they do.

People don’t seem to grasp you have umpires training once or twice a week, doing four hours for a match on a weekend (plus travel) in terrible conditions with abuse raining on them… for little more than $100, it is farcical.

Pay needs to immediately increase to a minimum of $250 per game for a senior field umpire, tax free (it is a community service at local level). Clubs will cop it, they don’t have a choice, and nor should they when they’re spending up to $5k per week on players - if you won’t spring $250 for an umpire to actually allow the game to happen then you’ve got no business playing.

It will at least START to get people perhaps considering it.

If you umpire cricket you can get between $150-180 (depending on your Association) and how many umpires are umpiring the game. It can get very hot at times and are you are standing for quite a while. But you don't have to go to training during the week or be very fit (judging by some of the umpires I've observed). Footy umpires should at the very least be getting as much as cricket umpires.
Does the EFNL charge registration or similar fees before a person can become an umpire?

 

[Voice of the G]

If you umpire cricket you can get between $150-180 (depending on your Association) and how many umpires are umpiring the game. It can get very hot at times and are you are standing for quite a while. But you don't have to go to training during the week or be very fit (judging by some of the umpires I've observed). Footy umpires should at the very least be getting as much as cricket umpires.
Does the EFNL charge registration or similar fees before a person can become an umpire?

Cricket umpires are out there in at times hot days for over 5 hours.Football umpires are out there for about 2 hours.Cricket competitions even with those wages struggle to get umpires.Agree though we could increase the umpires wages but more extra cost for the clubs who in some cases are struggling to get volunteers and forced to pay people to do some jobs.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Money certainly isn't the only issue but it is one. You will not attract new umpires without making it a feasible part-time job.

The current pay rates are absolutely farcical.

Not really fussed who funds it, but it must be fixed.

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

Cricket umpires are out there in at times hot days for over 5 hours.Football umpires are out there for about 2 hours.Cricket competitions even with those wages struggle to get umpires.Agree though we could increase the umpires wages but more extra cost for the clubs who in some cases are struggling to get volunteers and forced to pay people to do some jobs.

How many extra hours do cricket umpires spend training during the week. Zero, might have to go to a meeting once a month and even then if you don't go there are no consequences. Nothing like the 4 or so hours footy umpires spend that involves a lot of physical effort at training. The extra cost would be bugger all compared to the weekly cost of paying players. No games would be played if we can't get umpires.

 

[Voice of the G]

How many extra hours do cricket umpires spend training during the week. Zero, might have to go to a meeting once a month and even then if you don't go there are no consequences. Nothing like the 4 or so hours footy umpires spend that involves a lot of physical effort at training. The extra cost would be bugger all compared to the weekly cost of paying players. No games would be played if we can't get umpires.

Not all clubs have heaps of money and some are in debt now.Perhaps the salary cap should be reduced again and the savings to the clubs goes to the umpires.I understand where you are coming from though.

 

[eflreceiver]

Not all clubs have heaps of money and some are in debt now.Perhaps the salary cap should be reduced again and the savings to the clubs goes to the umpires.I understand where you are coming from though.

The money needs to come in from the top for support and development. The AFL, EFNL, and Football Victoria need to cut back on their dinners, luncheons, and functions and simply put more money back into grassroots football. In many cases, local football clubs don't have an endless cash flow and from what I have seen of sponsors many offer basically a loan. I have dealt with a few hospitality venues and they offer $10k as a sponsorship deal and demand you hold functions there to make their $10k back. That is not what sponsorship is about, that is basically a loan.

 

[Bobby Beecroft]

Not all clubs have heaps of money and some are in debt now.Perhaps the salary cap should be reduced again and the savings to the clubs goes to the umpires.I understand where you are coming from though.

Salary Caps are farcical as it is now (especially at top end), decreasing further is not the answer. End result - VAFA get even stronger at their top end.

Agree with receiver needs to come above & where does that come from?

Leader Local want subscriptions to read - How much they paying the leagues for content? Give some back!!

 

[Voice of the G]

Salary Caps are farcical as it is now (especially at top end), decreasing further is not the answer. End result - VAFA get even stronger at their top end.

Agree with receiver needs to come above & where does that come from?

Leader Local want subscriptions to read - How much they paying the leagues for content? Give some back!!

I also agree in not lowering the salary cap.If we are going to increase umpire payments agree with receiver that perhaps the AFL could help.As for payments quite a few field umpires are now doing 19,s and the 2,s.What would they get for that?

 

[eflreceiver]

If you want to read about local football you have to get around the BS Paywall or subscribe to the total BS package. Not many read the articles so it's a major loss to the EFNL and other entities. It's one fckd situation. But there is the podcasts that give us a lot more info yet nothing on the EFNL website.