DT Rucks 2010

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The Falcon Strike said:
I'm on a Naitanui upgrade to Cox strategy

Cox hasn't had the best pre-season - and i think Nic Nat will get his most ruck time early in the season - then as the season progresses and Cox gets more and more match fit - he'll take over more of the ruckwork - whilst the 19 year old ruckman gets more rest in the back half of the season.

I think by about rd 7/8 - Naita should have peaked and Cox fallen - so that the upgrade might cost $100k or so.

That's my plan anyway - based on having seen Naita in the intra-club match and now the NAB.
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good thinking Falcon I like it.

Sandilands V Jolly?
 
major tom said:
good thinking Falcon I like it.

Sandilands V Jolly?
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Sandilands is a lock for me. There are no obvious up and comers who are going to steal significant game time from him. He's probably got the most amount of "lock" points per week of anyone in the league
 

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Not really he is way to overpriced, he has had an interupted preseason and he is ageing, anyone who goes with him is either a DT noob or got huge DT balls, hes a big risk
 
Spoony said:
Not really he is way to overpriced, he has had an interupted preseason and he is ageing, anyone who goes with him is either a DT noob or got huge DT balls, hes a big risk
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I think he is still capable of consistenly big scores albeit in the 2nd half of the year when he gets his fitness back.

As someone stated earlier, going with Naita and then looking to upgrade him midseason to Cox could be a pretty good strategy. Still a lot of factors to go your way for that strategy to be effective.
 
major tom said:
good thinking Falcon I like it.

Sandilands V Jolly?
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I'm not a huge wrap on Jolly, Sydney like to bottle the ball up, Collingwood don't. 7% more hit outs in Sydney games v Pies games

Jolly's understudy in Sydney was White/Pyke meaning Jolly was on ball 90% of the game, with Fraser/Wood and manic interchanger Malthouse this will come down to about 75% at most.

Possible downside on Jolly, can't see any on Sandi.
 
But will Sandi improve? I mean he did have a good year last year. The only reason I would pick him is that he will score the most points of any ruck this year.
 
I agree with you Sandilands is a good safe pick who should average the same as last year, but i think that you are wrong about Jolly sydney play a lower possesion game than collingwood so i see upside there, also i can see two senerios this season either jolly does 90% of ruckwork and frasher plays up foward or jolly does 70%-75% and spends time up fowerd, and either way i see potentioanl upside. also collingwoods large number of interchanges has no negative effect on DT points.
 
Spoony said:
Not really he is way to overpriced, he has had an interupted preseason and he is ageing, anyone who goes with him is either a DT noob or got huge DT balls, hes a big risk
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That is a massive call more then likely judged on 1 year of DT.

Make no mistake if Cox is fit come round 1 he will still be 10ppg ave clear of the 2nd best ruck.

Our memories are very short, 12months ago the threads were "you cant win DT/SC unless you have Cox"

Now it's 'Where do we bury him"

The thing to watch Jolly for closely at the Pies is the number of stoppages.

Sydney play or I suspect played a larger number of stoppages then most if not all clubs.
 
NT.Thunder said:
That is a massive call more then likely judged on 1 year of DT.

Make no mistake if Cox is fit come round 1 he will still be 10ppg ave clear of the 2nd best ruck.

Our memories are very short, 12months ago the threads were "you cant win DT/SC unless you have Cox"

Now it's 'Where do we bury him"

The thing to watch Jolly for closely at the Pies is the number of stoppages.

Sydney play or I suspect played a larger number of stoppages then most if not all clubs.
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I agree

I actually made the mistake of not starting him last year.

He could actually be used as a midfielder if NN really steps up. But NN has had one unbelievable game, i don't see them occurring to often this year and unlikely again for the year. He just had one of those days. Against an oppo of no one. Put him up against Ryder and Hille and we will see how he goes.

Cox is the only ruck you can safely say has the potential to average of 105 next year. Kruezer, Tippett, NN might in the future.

If people are looking into picking Cox, i highly recommend looking at his scores against sides when he has played with a 2nd ruck NN, Seaby or even Lynch ect. Mainly the first 2, to see how he goes. He could be the best unique in the game next year.

I couldnt care too much about NN and him increasing his time in the ruck and thus decreasing Cox's. Its playing a very little role in why im not picking him. Durability/Age is the main one and lack of pre season.
 

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I'm intrigued by Fraser more than Jolly.

His biggest concerns have been durability which has been mostly attributed to him getting beaten by bigger bodies in the ruck. This year I see him getting back to that roaming role that he has played well and being more like Cox in the way he scores(as in marks and possies opposed to hitouts). I don't think I will have him, but I like him to surprise.

Jolly I don't like. He was never good when he had to share ground time, is a real rhythm player in that he plays himself into games. Can't see him going forward nearly as much with Cloke, Anthony and Medhurst already down there. Just don't like him.

Sandilands is the best or at least safest ruck this year. Durability is good, can score big but is consistent. You know he is good for 30-40 a game in hitouts alone. Pav playing as a forward makes him an even better fit to rest in the pocket and get a goal or two a game because Pav will take the best big back and also any zoning off defenders away.

Cox has the highest reward but I think will start slow and is a real candidate of being the guy everyone has by round 10-12. I think you are better going that approach of Sandi to start and whoever you think has the potential to get close to 400k to snap up Cox when he falls, just don't feel safe taking him given how much has changed since the start of last year with him. I'm still on whoever of Ottens and Hille shows the most over the rest of the preseason for my 2nd ruck spot. I might even go Warnock if he shows enough, I was a big fan of his when he was with Freo and can't see any reason not to stay with him, has a lot of ability and should be the #1 ruckman at the Blues.

I don't like Kruezer as much as most. Good player but I don't see the improvement or where it comes from, especially with serious questions as to his role.
 
I think I'm going to go with a ruck setup of: 1 locked in Keeper (Sandilands), and then one mid price money earning type player (Hille/ NicNat or even Charman).

Then I will wait and see how Cox is playing and if he is playing the same role as he always has, and try and upgrade to him during the season. He is too expensive for me to get first up with the injury doubts, but I do want to leave the option of getting him open, so I think the best thing to do is keep one of the ruck spots free for premium upgrade during season.

If I get Sandilands+Jolly then I won't really have the opportunity to get Cox unless I trade out a keeper which I hate doing.
 
No mention of Mumford anyone?

I was under the impression he was brought to Sydney to play the number 1 role. Good prie tage if he can get consistent game time.
 
I agree on the Mumford call but he didn't play against the Blues due to injury so I'm holding off for now. He has a lot of potential but I think a fit Ottens / Hille is a better option atm.
 
Dunn - Well Done said:
I agree


He could actually be used as a midfielder if NN really steps up. But NN has had one unbelievable game, i don't see them occurring to often this year and unlikely again for the year. He just had one of those days. Against an oppo of no one. Put him up against Ryder and Hille and we will see how he goes.
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I am basing my opinion on the Intra Club game as well. Whilst not as dominant overall - he still dominated the clearances and had tackles.

For me it is his tackling that is making me consider him. That and the fact that if he does have less ruck time - then at least he'll be rucking against guys he should monster.
 
For me it is his tackling that is making me consider him. That and the fact that if he does have less ruck time - then at least he'll be rucking against guys he should monster.
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His tackles are nice, but they are directly linked to him playing in the ruck or having a better understanding of forward play than he has shown so far, so are a risky investment and not a deal changer. Basically if you think he is going to get adequate ruck time the tackles are a supplement. If you doubt his ruck time, as I do, then his tackles offer no more incentive to buy.

On top of that, their is a big difference between beasting teams 4th and 5th rucks and beasting teams 2nd ruckmen. Just a few examples of teams "backup" rucks - Fraser, Hille, Ottens, Charman, Seaby, Kreuser, King and Petrie. I wouldn't back Nic Nat against any of those guys. So basically you have half the league that have guys Nic Nat will likely struggle with. Which makes that another flawed premise on which to select him.

Basically I like him as a prospect, not DT though, not this season. At least not until Cox is out because it is just too hard to see the reward over the risk. You are basically banking on Cox not playing most of the season and that is a very gutsy pick.

Also... I have one really out there guy I am considering and will certainly watch... Kepler Bradley. I know he is a spud, but in the event that Sandilands were to get hurt, he certainly has Ryder potential as a ruckman, ie. We have next to no one else(coming from a big Clarke Fan) he would be thrown in there as a possession winner. Obviously, I'm not really considering him from the start, but I would certainly look long and hard should Sandi be hurt.
 
Any love for the Seaby? Seemed to do well when Cox was absent (and he got a game) and up in Sydney should have the #1 role with Mumford as an understudy in the initial stages. Sydney play a stoppage orientated game so he should get fairly involved. But his low $200k price tag is a highly contested price range.....

And maybe Adam pattison? I cant see King running out a full season, Gardiner would be the same and I reckon McEvoy is still a bit green. Pattison may be a nice addition? Hard to tell, but potentially he is a good option. But aren't they all? LOL
 
huggy_b said:
Any love for the Seaby? Seemed to do well when Cox was absent (and he got a game) and up in Sydney should have the #1 role with Mumford as an understudy in the initial stages. Sydney play a stoppage orientated game so he should get fairly involved. But his low $200k price tag is a highly contested price range.....

And maybe Adam pattison? I cant see King running out a full season, Gardiner would be the same and I reckon McEvoy is still a bit green. Pattison may be a nice addition? Hard to tell, but potentially he is a good option. But aren't they all? LOL
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Mcevoy is number 2 dont worry about that. he will start
 
WoGiTaLiA said:
His tackles are nice, but they are directly linked to him playing in the ruck or having a better understanding of forward play than he has shown so far, so are a risky investment and not a deal changer. Basically if you think he is going to get adequate ruck time the tackles are a supplement. If you doubt his ruck time, as I do, then his tackles offer no more incentive to buy.
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in fact i'll argue the opposite - the more he understands the game - the less tackles he'll get as he'll be first to the ball.

in the essendon game - he was often second to the ball which increased his tackle count - a run and ounce on mcveigh is an example of that at the 50m line.

the oppositioin ruck argument only carries water for his ruck knock points. if he's beaten in the air - he still becomes dangerous (for points) on the ground - the opponent ruckman wouldn't matter in that case - and if they do get it - he'll be in line for tackles.

My view is NN will shoulder a lot more rucking duties early in the season - hence he provides good value
 
Going to try and save money in the ruck, but have got 2 possibly 4 players i expect to play all year and score reasonably well.

Warnock - likely to be Carlton's first ruck with Kruezer playing forward
Nic Nat - Should get game time early with his impressive start to NAB Cup
Vickery - Richmond expect big things from him, expect him to play 16+ games and can go forward and kick goals
Ace Cordy - High draft pick, might need another year to develop but should get some opportunities.
 
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